What is reasonable to expect of retired grandparents?

[Marmalady10]

My parents live in the same town, but probably make the effort to spend time with our teens maybe twice a year. They show no effort or interest in their lives. In the past I have invited them to navity plays, sports matches and presentations, but there is no real interest there. I have always had to hire babysitters because they let me down. I have come to accept that my parents only really show up around Christmas and holidays, and only then they might take them out once for breakfast, and last time my dad went a bit extra and took them to look at new buildings being built (his interest, not theirs). It feels like they only make effort to keep up appearances and tell their friends what doting grandparents they are.
They never message the kids to see how they are or how they got on in exams or important sports events. Am I expecting too much? What is reasonable to expect of grandparents living 5 minutes away? They are both retired, mobile, and in good health. We are the ones who always have to invite them over and take them out for meals, and this is never reciprocated. They do like to socialise a lot so I get it that they have their own lives but surely some interest in your family isn’t expecting a lot? When I have brought this up with them in the past they have been completely offended that I even suggested it, and then nothing changed anyway.

I can’t imagine what it must feel like to have family like this.
I was a single parent to two babies (still single) and they live a 5 minute walk away and I wouldn’t hear a peep from them. It I called, I would be told, it’s hard and that’s just how it is. I don’t think I can forgive them for what they did (or didn’t do) during the hardest time in my life.
They weren’t very good parents to me growing up, so it was naive of me to expect things would be different as grandparents. I feel sorry for my children as their grandparents on my ex’s side are dead anyway, so this is all they have. I’m redecorating my sons bedroom as my children still sleep in a double bed and the room is full of my clothes, and I work, and it’s half term, and my parents are nowhere to be seen (my dad is still in his 60s a physically fit). It does make me sad so I really sympathise with op.

OP I completely understand you sadness
My 2 beautiful now adult DS have never had any involvement or interest from either set of grandparents, My husband and I bonded over our very cruel childhoods
However, I think that some talking therapy/counselling would benefit you and help you navigate the grief you are feeling
Your parents are absolutely dreadful, the MRI example is just jaw dropping
I think for your own mental health you should just stop
Neither my husband nor I see our parents I spent years trying to be the good daughter having them over for christmas day, easter lunch etc etc but got sick of it never being reciprocated and the judgement and snide commnents

Good luck and I hope with help you can move on and be happier

That is incredibly selfish! I don’t think I’d be making much effort with them after that!

I cant wait to have grandchildren and go to Nativity's and sports days and school fairs with my anticipated GC. My older son said to me recently, mum when I/we have a baby will you babysit and stuff. Absolutely was my response I fully expect to do some school runs, holiday care etc too I am greatly looking forward to it

Stop trying op. They aren’t going to change. Match their energy and just get on with your lives. It’s sad and you will probably grieve a little for the relationship you thought they would have with your children but there’s nothing you can do about it. I would however remember this when they suddenly become needy as they get older.

I'm older than you! I did two full days a week childcare for my grandaughter when I was in my 60s. OP isn't even expecting her parents to provide childcare, she just wants them to show a tiny bit of interest in their grandchildren.

Obviously, they have no obligation to do this but it's a bit rich that they pretend to their friends that they are doting grandparents when they couldn't really care less.

It doesn't sound like you are asking for childcare, as your kids are older. It sounds like you are hoping for a relationship and they are putting very little into that relationship. If I had a friend who never messaged me, was disinterested in activities I suggested, left me to put in all the effort etc, then I'd stop bothering. Obviously it's up to them what effort they put in but if they don't bother I suspect your kids won't bother as they get older.

What a shame, my dad is planning his 80th celebrations, dm, dsis and I, plus our teen dc, and the activities will include something the dc enjoy because he wants us all to have fun together.

We've had years of childcare from all gps, my dm would never move away as she likes to see dc regularly, and has her own WhatsApp group with them. MIL would actually probably have died years ago but I had her bonus grandchildren and she literally lives for them despite being unwell.

They are missing out, but you're learning how you can be better and be the best gm yo your future gc

I think there are more parents like yours than not tbh.
My Mum was an amazing Nan and loved every second with all her grandkids (she had 11 plus great grandkids) always fair and would help whenever she could. Ditto my PIL they were amazing too.
I’m now a Nan and have 2 grandchildren, 1 of which I look after full time whilst my daughter teaches (the older one is at school). The way I see it is I’ll help whilst I’m able to and sometimes I can’t and will say but I do consider it an absolute privilege to be able to spend time with them and can’t understand those who don’t.
2 of my siblings in laws moved miles away once their dgc came along so as to say ‘don’t ask me to look after them at any point’ but to anyone outside of the family would play the doting gp’s.
Used to drive me mad!! 😡

I think it's natural for you to have some sort of expectations at first, but that doesn't mean they are obliged to take an interest. Maybe it's time for you to adjust your expectations?

I’d try and get past what’s ‘reasonable’ and just do what’s right for you and your kids.

My parents are very self absorbed and have never put much effort into getting to know any of their grandkids - who are just basically ignored at family gatherings. They actually only ever babysat once, and I came back to find my 8 year old exactly where I left him - plugged into the tv. They’d just full on ignored him the entire time.

We do mix with older friends and mentors who actually take an interest instead, and that’s much more healthy for our family all round. It’s a bit sad, but not half as sad as waiting for my parents to change, which is what I used to do.

It sounds to me as if your parents are the same people they always were - disinterested as parents, disinterested as grandparents. You hoped that their disinterest was due to their time/interest being focussed on work, so I can understand the disappointment when nothing changed on their retirement. It sucks.

They won't change now. The only thing you can change is how they affect you. Stop hoping they will have an epiphany and want to be involved with your lives - they won't. They are the same people they always were. How are your in-laws, your grandchildren's paternal grandparents? If they are around, cultivate those relationships, but as for your own parents - have you heard of 'Drop The Rope'? Step away, divert your energies / thoughts away from your parents' inadequacies and concentrate on your much-more-fulfilling life outside of them.

"Actually I have always been there for my parents and I look after them well. I invite them over for meals and we take them out for meals, but this is never reciprocated."
Drop the rope. Stop inviting them over / out. Put the same level of effort into them as they put into you. See how long it takes for them to notice. Amuse yourself by running a book inside your head, placing bets as to how long it will take.

"I’m pretty sure my parents will expect us all to run circles around them when they come to ill health or get less mobile, but I have to admit it makes me feel more like reciprocating their effort as I get older, because they have never really been there for me and they are not there for my children either."
Drop the rope. Reciprocate their energy. Absolutely do not jump to their demands. Keep in mind how they behaved when you needed an MRI. They prioritised "a friend of a friend’s birthday luncheon" then, I'm sure that friend of a friend will be thrilled to step up to the plate for them in return.

Truly - drop the rope.

I've seen so many posts on forums regarding the same subject and never replied but this is my day.

Before you got pregnant and had DC did you chat about trying for a baby with your parents or just your DP/DH?

Did you remember to ask if they'd like to be included, and if so in what way in the upbringing of any future GC?

I expect many don't see it's anyone else business, including GP's if they want to have DC, and rightly so.....until those GP's don't offer child care then its them in the wrong.
Some feel their days of looking after young children are over and don't see past that, some possibly didn't even enjoy looking after their own.

Do your DC phone/pop in to see their GP without you?

While my DC didn’t discuss planning a baby with me they knew that once LO got to a year their mother would go back to work PT, a nursery place was found while LO was a few months old but how many days needed deciding so I was asked if I'd like to look after baby for one day a week, if so what day would suit.

I chose a day and have looked after LO weekly for 3 years, a few overnight sleepovers for Mum and dad to have a decent night out/lay in next morning and a daytime on the odd occasion if nursery is closed or LO dad had to work on the day he has them.

None of this was expected and they don't give a list of do's and dont's, unlike some friends DC have, we just go by how we bought our own DC up.

Did anything happen to make them not want to help out? ie not received a Thanks, no calls from your kids ever?
Barring that why not have a chat? Ask outright if they've been offended somehow? Tell them a friend wouldn't leave a friend in the lurch in your MRI situation and you'd think family, your own parents wouldn't let you down like that. Ask why their friends are more important than their own children and grandchildren.
You must have the discussion or it will always eat at you. Even if you don't get a satisfying answer, compromise, apology, awareness from them, whatever, at least you will get it out in the open and you'll know clearly where you stand.

It's sad, and frustrating, but equally I don't think you can "expect" anything sadly - everyone has a different grandparent relationship and they're entitled to not help if they don't want to, its them who are missing out though. Some people don't seem to realise that you get out what you put in - your parents are clearly in that group. When they're very old, need help, are lonely or there's just one of them left, or when they feel disconnected from younger people, unfortunately your children won't have that deep rooted connection that will ensure they are there. You would all be well within your rights to do the bare minimum for them.
It's also really sad as parents when you feel how wonderful your children are, not to be able to share that wonder.
In their (very limited) defense, it sounds like they didn't have great role models (as you didn't see your grandparents) and at least they treat everyone equally. Possibly they just don't realise what's normal? My mum in particular had a bad relationship with her parents, whenever I suggest seeing her just for something fun, she acts like it's a very odd request! I have to basically bully her to spend a day with me, but I think it's just that she doesnt realise it's normal to want to hang out as a family for no reason. I'm lucky that they're happy to help out and be involved with the kids though, it's just socialising they're not up for (which I find sad, and I hope I spend lots of fun time with my adult children, if theyll have me).

They've raised their kids now its time to do as they please

Well that is beyond shitty behaviour from them. It really does show exactly where they place you and your dc as priorities in their lives, doesn't it? Their daughter's hospital appointment and need for emergency childcare help comes way below a nice lunch with friends-of-friends. I'm so sorry. 🙁

I help out with my grandchildren, and also do as I please. Not working means you have loads of time to fit in the stuff you want to do.

Totally feel your pain

They're 10% grandparents: they only like the best bits: meals, school photos and celebrations

It's the same here, op

I think it’s terribly sad for you especially as they live so close by and are in good health. So selfish of them. I am a doting grandmother and put my children and grandchildren 1st and foremost.

Hurtful op. We had the same. I suppose you have to accept this is how they are. Its hard though. My mam never helped. No huge interest in them. Was happy when she got her college place she 20. Then moves onto next topic lol

Tbf my parents have always been very social and my sister and I spent a lot of our time at other people’s houses.

So they preferred going to the pub drinking rather than being parents? If they couldn't be arsed with their own children they certainly aren't going to be arsed with other people's children, relatives or not.

Match their energy OP, and don't change that energy if they suddenly need help in a few years.

Even 2 weeks before she died my MIL was on the floor playing with my 4yo and 2yo. My mother however just sits them in front of the TV. Like you I’ve been let down with childcare. She’s desperate to do it and then makes more important plans, one time she even suggested she got a babysitter. I had to explain that her having the children was the childcare and if she was just going to get a babysitter I could do that (with one the children know because she works at their nursery).

My PIL lived about a mile from SIL so naturally saw a lot of them, just about every day. My DC are the youngest of the gc and they told me "the novelty had worn off" by the time my first was born...which was a slightly bitter pill as a ftm. Although I think the second got a bit more attention because they were the v youngest in the family.
I invited them for christmas once but they said no because they "wanted a quiet christmas on their own"....but it turned out they went to SIL with a houseful of people.

However in older age and ill health, SIL and the GC that were most local and closer, are doing more of the heavy lifting.

My own grandparents died when I was a toddler so i had no reference or expectation

Our parents belong to the most selfish of generations. In many cases, they barely parented us, as latch key kids, we were raised fend for ourselves, with all the consequences of that.

My parents are the same with my children, OP. I am a single parent, I'm with my three children, alone, all of the time. I live 2 minutes drive away. According to them this was "my choice" and I am never to have any expectations of them. My parents are 64, perfectly fit and wealthy. My children are very well behaved and good company.

Recently I have lowered my hopes for them doing anything differently to zero, but also I no longer go out of my way to engage with them, as I used to.

They will reap what they sew, and I dont envy them. When my children are adults I will always be there for them as needed, this is what family should be, and used to be, years ago.

It's their pure self interest OP, and YANBU to be upset.