Son excluded after meeting today. Was meant to be isolation. Feel sick about it

[FrostedOwl]

I dont really know where to start and sorry if this is a mess but ive just got home and my head is pounding. Had a meeting with school today about my son after an incident last week. At the time they said it would be an internal exclusion so isolation for a few days and we accepted that. I wasnt happy but i understood it and told him he’d messed up and that was that. Today’s meeting was meant to be a follow up and somehow it’s ended with him being formally excluded. Fixed term. I feel like the ground’s been pulled from under me. I keep going over the meeting in my head thinking did i miss something or did i say the wrong thing. Part of me is furious with him, part of me is angry at the school and part of me just feels like ive failed completely. Im trying to be calm but honestly im shaking typing this.

What the school said today (sorry this might be a bit long):

• the original incident was “more serious than first thought” even though nothing new has actually happened since last week
• they said his attitude in isolation wasnt good enough and he was “non compliant”
• apparently he walked out of a lesson earlier in the week when he was meant to be in isolation (i wasnt told at the time)
• they said theres a pattern of behaviour building and this exclusion is to “send a message”
• i was told they could escalate it and that they are within their rights to do so

He isnt an angel. I know that. But he also isnt violent or out of control and this feels like a big step. He’s also been school refusing on and off this term which i know doesnt help. Some mornings he just flat out refuses to go and says he cant be bothered or that theres no point. I do get him there most days but attendance isnt perfect and the school bring it up constantly like its all connected. Maybe it is, i dont know anymore.

Am i being unreasonable for feeling like this has been handled badly and too quickly or am i just defensive because its my child. I feel judged every time i walk into that building. Ive never posted on here before so sorry if ive done this wrong. I just dont know if im seeing this clearly or not.

It's more likely he was badly behaved.

Yes, but 16.5-19.9pc of kids have SEN. That's 1/5 students, or up to 1.5 million children.

I completely get that, but I think OP needs to be open to the fact that her child was badly behaved.

My first post here was about him potentially going to a PRU so I don't think I'm against the idea that he might have behaviour problems but I do think it's wise to screen out anything else.

But anyway, behaviour problems usually come with something to create them. Maybe SEN, neuro diversity, problems at home, mental health issues, being bullied.

It doesn't mean he should get a free card but imo OP needs to get tovthe bottom of what's causing him to act like this.

Just popping by to say I was properly expelled from school when I was 15, just before my GCSEs for an outburst.

I still ended up with 3A* and getting a BA and MA at Russell Group universities. I now work a corporate job and it’s never come up in my life since.

I am autistic and had a very strong meltdown at school - it involved chucking a chair (not at a person) and storming out. I couldn’t cope with something going on in a class that I was really interested in.

The school had no idea I was a little neurospicy - nor did I at the time. I’ve never had an outburst like that again - and it was not my parents’ fault.

I just wanted to share because it was not the end of my world, and I ended up getting more support at the next school I went to, which also suited me a lot more.

I agree behaviour was inappropriate, but the cause needs to be sought.

I just wanted to say, sympathy and solidarity from someone who has been through it, a while ago now, and ended up with a truly wonderful adult son. Schools mostly do what they can, but there is no one size fits all for 14 year olds. Hold the line as best you can, and keep caring.

It's strange how reluctant many people are nowadays to accept that there is such a thing as badly-behaved teens who are not struggling and don't have undiagnosed SEN.

It seems to be pecifically when we are talking about behaviour in school though. Ask people about teenagers behaving badly on the streets in their local area and people will happily call them delinquents. Or ask people how they feel when it's their own dc being sworn at or having their education disrupted. ..

We all went to school with kids who were just straight-up naughty. Do people really think that doesn't exist any more? There is a saying that 'all behaviour is communication'. Sometimes what they are communicating is 'I am a giant pain in the arse'. They do quite often grow out of it though.

Don't start blaming the school or it will just get worse.

This situation, stressful as it is, sounds salvageable and maybe the exclusion will function as a reset.

It sounds like your son has somewhat articulated the trigger - he’s finding it difficult to be put on the spot/answer questions/feel embarrassed in class for whatever reason.

Obviously, his behavioural outbursts are unacceptable (and he needs to accept that) and will get him into increasingly serious trouble throughout his life if he can’t learn how to deal with those feelings.

I think that’s essentially the key - your DS needs coping strategies/needs to learn a pattern of behaviour to fall on when he feels this way. Maybe that is something you can start to research together during the exclusion.

A friend who is an Educational Psychologist once said that the best thing she could do for her children was to help them know how to respond/behave when in uncomfortable situations at school. Sometimes it’s a completely reasonable situation that the child just doesn’t like and sometimes it’s because a teacher is being a bit of an asshole - either way, exploding, swearing etc isn’t ok.

Some children need to be actively helped to deal with those situations, otherwise they will end up being the persistently disruptive kid.

Been in your shoes.... and I can empathise!

My son was excluded for a fixed period as he was about to sit his GCSE's, that turned into him not returning to 6th Form.
Several other lads were involved in an incident, all were excluded for a few days whilst they investigated, but he was excluded for longer after investigation.
We'd had several discussions with school in the previous years he'd been there about his reluctance to attend, his behaviour in class etc., but we never got to the bottom of it until it all came out post exclusion.... turned out he'd been bullied for most of his time there, because he was sporty and was picked for various teams etc.

He struggled for a long time, did eventually get a diagnosis of very mild ADHD/Autism but he'd always coped really well and no-one had suspected just how much he'd been struggling.

Turned out his refusal to go to school was down to bullying on the bus, refusals to wear uniform properly were his dislike of certain clothing on his arms, his inability to finish school and homework on time was down to his going off at a tangent and researching other stuff that was, to him, more interesting.

He left during his AS Levels, went on to do a college course where he was treated more as an adult than a 'naughty teenager' and thrived.

He's now an adult, holding down a very responsible job with his own flat/car etc.

There's a lot of hope for your son, and I hope you get the help you need to get him back on track.

I wish you well with school and meetings!

Of course it's not unreasonable to feel whatever you feel.. it must be very worrying too and I'm sure you're drained from it all. Of course you feel the rug has be pulled from under your feet when you didn't know of his further misdemeanour this week and it's a shame he didn't tell you about this and I'd be cross about that one.
Are you close and does he speak to you about things? I'm wondering if you were to go back a few years could you unpick what's happened or happening here? I'm assuming he wasn't refusing school in primary.

Yes, but it doesn't need to be related to SEN. Teenagers aren't all special needs, some of them just have normal, run of the mill, anxiety or anger issues that are age related and they will grow out of.

We need to stop pathologising normal, transient, situation based emotional times.

I really hate this. As a teacher and SENDCo for over thirty years now I can tell you from my experience that SEND needs are NOT ever an excuse for abusive behaviour or even a reason for it. It’s really disgraceful to imply that someone with SEND is incapable of knowing it’s not ok to swear at a female teacher.

my DS19 has all the ND's and has been known to swear during a meltdown, and it has NEVER been allowed a free pass. He might not be able to help doing it, but he is always expected to apologise afterwards. He knows his teachers don't deserve that kind of language, and has always accepted the consequences within the behaviour policy of his setting.

He also always apologises to me when it happens at home.

All this and he's basically been excluded for just three days??? That's the punishment?

It's not that bad....?? The way the op reads is that he's permanently excluded from school...

It's the way the OP keeps saying she knows it's not ok to behave the way he did. It's a little bit more than not ok. It's terrible behaviour that no school should allow, it sets a horrible example for the other pupils and the school and I suspect that your lack of outrage at this behaviour is a factor here. This wouldn't have come from nowhere, there has surely been escalating bad behaviour that he's been getting away with? Saying it's not ok is nowhere near enough. It is unacceptable behaviour and the school has been lenient in not excluding him long term.

I think you've misunderstood. My posts are about finding the cause of unwanted behaviour, not excusing it.

As an (grand)parent I would be absolutely fuming that my DCs' education was being destroyed by one or two children in their class who were totally disruptive. I would expect those disruptive students to be totally removed from the usual classes and educated separately all together so that compliant students' education was not affected.

Schools get marked down on exclusions, so it's serious, good on them, ban screens etc whilst he's at home, make him realise it's a big issue, back the school up, don't defend him, he'll take that as you minimising his actions, he may well need the shock.

Your "naughty" could very well be someone else being bullied or having undiagnosed autism. These days we tend to take more of an interest in what's behind behaviour, not just label them "naughty" and put them on the scrap heap.

Lots of children are not a good fit for school but are made to go anyway. Op's son might thrive in alternative provision.

Unfortunately some use a SEND diagnosis as an excuse for poor behaviour. It’s endemic.
unfortunately people who agree with me are often attacked by the SEND Stazi.
we are not saying that all SEND is an excuse, but some is.

Yeah but I bet it wasn't anywhere near as common as it is now. It just wouldn't have been a thing at any of my schools-they wouldn't tolerate it and would be straight onto the parents if we didn't show up for school and no one had informed school we were sick. Kids have realised school is optional and there's nothing their parents are going to do about it. Kids had anxiety back then too yet funnily enough still managed to get to school!

But SEN is not the cause of swearing at a teacher. Misogyny might be. Pride, shame, models of aggression at home or in the peer group.

In this case, the people to be worried about are the teacher and the other 25 or so kids trying to learn in that class.
Even IF this child turns out to have ADHD/ASD or any other need, he still can’t go round swearing at people and causing disruption. And it’s a big IF.
Whereas what we definitely KNOW is that someone was verbally abused for doing her job. She might want to leave teaching or go off sick because why would you want to go to work to be abused? That’s all the kids she teaches, all the colleagues in her team absolutely fucked for the rest of the year.
That’s why the school are 100% right to exclude.