Son excluded after meeting today. Was meant to be isolation. Feel sick about it

[FrostedOwl]

I dont really know where to start and sorry if this is a mess but ive just got home and my head is pounding. Had a meeting with school today about my son after an incident last week. At the time they said it would be an internal exclusion so isolation for a few days and we accepted that. I wasnt happy but i understood it and told him he’d messed up and that was that. Today’s meeting was meant to be a follow up and somehow it’s ended with him being formally excluded. Fixed term. I feel like the ground’s been pulled from under me. I keep going over the meeting in my head thinking did i miss something or did i say the wrong thing. Part of me is furious with him, part of me is angry at the school and part of me just feels like ive failed completely. Im trying to be calm but honestly im shaking typing this.

What the school said today (sorry this might be a bit long):

• the original incident was “more serious than first thought” even though nothing new has actually happened since last week
• they said his attitude in isolation wasnt good enough and he was “non compliant”
• apparently he walked out of a lesson earlier in the week when he was meant to be in isolation (i wasnt told at the time)
• they said theres a pattern of behaviour building and this exclusion is to “send a message”
• i was told they could escalate it and that they are within their rights to do so

He isnt an angel. I know that. But he also isnt violent or out of control and this feels like a big step. He’s also been school refusing on and off this term which i know doesnt help. Some mornings he just flat out refuses to go and says he cant be bothered or that theres no point. I do get him there most days but attendance isnt perfect and the school bring it up constantly like its all connected. Maybe it is, i dont know anymore.

Am i being unreasonable for feeling like this has been handled badly and too quickly or am i just defensive because its my child. I feel judged every time i walk into that building. Ive never posted on here before so sorry if ive done this wrong. I just dont know if im seeing this clearly or not.

I was an assistant head teacher and SENDco and dealt with all things welfare, including exclusion meetings. Apologies for the long response I just wanted to offer a perhaps different viewpoint of other PP and admit I have not RTFT.

3 days for a first time fixed term exclusion feels a little bit OTT. 1 day to begin with would probably have been sufficient, especially as your son already feels targeted. Before going down the SEN route ask the school to see if there are any patterns in your son’s absence. For example, is he mostly off on a Thursday, try and pinpoint what it is about that day that he doesn’t like! Is it a lesson, is it a peer group he’s with, is it a teacher? I had to do a lot of work with staff around the importance of building relationships with children. As educators we are there to support children, not to make them feel vulnerable. If for example you son does not like the way a biology teacher puts him on the spot, ask that accommodations be made that this does not happen. Instead could advanced warning be given e.g. “Billy I’m going to ask you a question about plant cells next. Be thinking of your answer please?” Find out if a teacher has made your son feel humiliated in some way that has perhaps caused peers to laugh at him. If a staff member is identified ask what school could do to help improve that relationship - do they adopt restorative practice or a relational model in school? Is it possible for your child to have a check in every day maybe twice a day with a trusted member of staff to rebuild the relationship your son has with school, every child has the right to reach their full potential. School should be supporting you in trying to reduce the number of days your son does not want to go to school. Attendance should be a partnership between parents and school for it to have a positive impact. Once all of these avenues have been explored then look into SEN screening. I would rule out relational issues before looking at SEN ones, especially if this is a relatively new problem. I do think you are within your rights to express that communication has been poor. It feels very unfair that you went into a meeting at the end of an isolation period to then be told a FTE was now being issued. If walking out of isolation leads to an exclusion, that conversation should have happened the same day.

with regards to what you are doing at home, this is absolutely the correct response. Refusing to go to school and being excluded should not equal fun and it is good to see a parent supporting school in this way. It is possible that your son has picked up being viewed as a criminal but my something staff have said to him. I’m not saying it definitely is but some staff do make links between exclusions and then life as a criminal to “scare” children. I how you manage to resolve matters and improve relations and communication with the school.

This is a long thread so I read your responses OP And apologise if I am going over previous responses. Things that you can do:

Your son’s actions were triggered by something and I would want it clarified what the triggers to that event were. That was you can determine if he was being rude or was he in flight or fight mode. The triggers need to be spoken about and a support plan put in place. Do not be fobbed off by the school having an event a consequence attitude. This needs to be explored throughly and your child’s barriers identified.

”bunking off” is a form of school refusal. Anxiety manifests in many different ways. Something is keeping him from school. This is a SEN need and should be highlighted and a support plan put in place. Your child needs an area of safety that he can go to try and prevent these instances happening.

The LA will be informed. This is because the school have to demonstrate certain criteria if they were to permanently exclude in the future. Contact your access and inclusion team at your LA and ask them for advice on how the school can work with your son to prevent permanent exclusion in the future.

It sounds like your son is now trapped in a chain of having done something wrong, punished, punishment gone wrong, punished more… it’s like a massive pile on. You know when you have a bad day or week and it’s one thing after another, it’s so hard to bounce back, so you tend to feel worse and worse and for kids, that often transpires in continued poor behaviour.

You could physically see these kids (usually boys) in lesson looking having totally lost their way, but masking it with this sort of behaviour. He’s not fine, or he wouldn’t be playing up. There’s something bubbling under the surface here (finding work too hard, fear of being put on the spot, anxiety, having to maintain his appearance, any number of things) and he needs support, love, understanding and a fresh start after this episode has been dealt with (and it does, properly, swearing / refusing to leave was one of my most feared things as a teacher, pp have expressed why).

But ime there’s always been something under the surface causing it, school won’t delve deeper and your child likely won’t open up to them now.

Could you use the upcoming half term to do some detective work - get him to catch up on things that are tricky (which might give him a boost if he’s finding himself behind), find out why there’s a difference in good work done at home but he can’t do it at school. Look up EBSA on Facebook (emotional based school avoidance).

Hope you and your son are ok x

You sound like a great mum OP, you’re covering all the bases. And from what it sounds like, this could be the shock your DS needs and hopefully he’ll find a way of turning this around as he won’t want the embarrassment of it happening again.

Those on this thread who think that school refusal is connected to poor parenting, it really isn’t. How on earth do you get someone to school who is refusing to go? You can hardly force them to get dressed and frogmarch them there. It’s really hard. Try having a bit of empathy.

BlueJuniper94 School Refusal and Truancy are two very different things. From the little that the OP had told us by the time you made your comment, her son's absence* *was probably due to truancy rather than refusal. However, and possibly erroneously, I haven't read any more of her comments yet. That was because I wanted to stay focused on my reply to you, and my memory and thought processes are no longer what they used to be.

Those of us who have - sorry to use an emotive word next, but it is how I and the rest of my child's loved ones, and the child themself truly felt - suffered from having a child refuse to go to school, which meant having our still young 11 year old tell us that they couldn't go back to school, that they would probably do something bad (they are not at all violent, so they meant to themselves, not to anyone else) if made to, even if that meant I would be prosecuted for not dragging my 11 year old to school - I wouldn't have, and couldn't have, used physical force to get them there. I respected and trusted my child enough to know that they had come to the end of the road in terms of being able to stay at school.

Of course, their refusal led to the school psychiatrist becoming involved, which I welcomed. Both my child's head of year, and their headmaster were initially involved but they soon withdrew from the proceedings. All the expected officials were involved, and presumably because they could see how distraught my child really was, I was never questioned about my own refusal to try and make my DC attend school. My child had all sorts of interventions, and mental health involvent over their remaining school years, but sadly they were unable to return to any 'normal' sort of school setting.

That was all many years ago now. My, adult child has fulfilled their potential to become an extremely kind, caring, and intelligent person, of whom I am so very proud, but they were eventually found to have a severe mental health condition, which sadly means that at least for the now, they cannot live under the same every day living conditions that most of us do.

I do know that spread all over the Country, and probably the World, there are actually many families that are similar to mine, and it was really horrible for me/us to read your damning reply to the OP. So BlueJuniper, please give some more thought to anything you have to add, before adding it. If it helps, my saying that, has reminded me that thinking before writing or speaking is a lesson that I need to remember too.

Yes. And the child is 14 and has a mind of their own.

Parents can't choose their child's behavior but can choose how to respond to it. What part of OP's response was inappropriate?

I bet his teachers are happy verbal abuse is being taken seriously. The absolute shit teachers have to deal with daily is unacceptable. I don't understand why anyone still wants to teach.

Honestly, your dot points really sum it all up so well.

• the original incident was “more serious than first thought” even though nothing new has actually happened since last week
• they said his attitude in isolation wasnt good enough and he was “non compliant”
• apparently he walked out of a lesson earlier in the week when he was meant to be in isolation (i wasnt told at the time)
• they said theres a pattern of behaviour building and this exclusion is to “send a message”

The incident was more serious than first thought, his attitude since wasn't good enough and he also walked out of a lesson.

Maybe communication of this to you wasn't clear enough or fast enough, but that's why you've had a face to face meeting.

The fourth dot point is really the most important thing now. They're trying to send a message, probably to your son and others, that this sort of behaviour won't be tolerated. Let him learn from this.

I read your other posts, it sounds like you're backing the school up when your DS is around and that is really important, even if you don't 100% agree with things. We all have to learn lessons sometimes, better to do that now, while he's young enough to make changes.

I'd be wondering if you could afford some private counselling for him. He needs strategies to handle his own emotions when things aren't going his way, without resorting to swearing. If swearing is common in the household, maybe tone that down and lead by example too. Giving him someone to talk to and strategies for handling his emotions could really help.

Also, it's good that he's feeling a bit embarrassed, but it's also important that he knows lots of people have made mistakes and then turn their lives around. Does he know what he wants to do in the future? Having some goals to work towards could help him see why he needs to work hard in school and get to where he wants to be.

If he gets some counselling to sort all this out it could be money really well spent. Hopefully one day you'll look back and if this is the worst thing he's ever done, you'll be quietly very happy.

*From a mum and teacher for over 40 years. 4 kids, one of whom did manage to get himself suspended once. Luckily, we can look back and say he never did anything like it again.

I'd be more curious about your reaction than school's response OP. If you're feeling sick about how it was handled- what are you worried about? In terms of school, your son, others?

There were times where my local school got things wrong. But there were others where - after some thinking - I needed to admit they did things right, even though I was not my initial thought. They were able to see what I - as a parent - did not, in terms of what was a good next step for my child.

Is anything going on at home? My Gran was a teacher for 30 years and she always said a child acting up at school generally has issues at home. Realise he’s a teen and some of them try to push boundaries but I have three teens and none have been in trouble at school ever.

I think it’s understandable why they extended it to an exclusion. They tried isolation first and he decided to turn up to a lesson then presumably gave the teacher lip when they said he should be in isolation. My DC’s school send kids to another school in the academy trust before excluding which is good, means they’re not dossing about at home.

Cooperate with the school, don’t argue against them. They’re not picking on your DS to be mean or unfair, he’s being a little git and needs punishing.

Schools seldom take exclusion lightly. It sounds like they investigated the incident and it was more serious. Also sounds like your child wasn’t complying with the isolation sanctions. I feel so sorry for the school and teachers, so much wasted teaching time on these sorts of things.

@FrostedOwl you're right to ignore the extremists on MN who delight in amplifying and catastrophising every little detail of a post.
Please let me give you some pointers as a specialist.
The suspension is a graduated response by the school because he didn't comply with the lower sanction (isolation). Entirely reasonable.
The behaviour your son is displaying isn't particularly unusual. The high demands of school and all the rules and regulations don't sit well with a lot of adolescents. Pushes their buttons.
The big tool to use is the reintegration meeting. What should happen is that they identify issues related to the reasons for the suspension, identify what support your ds might need to help him make better choices (with his input) and you all agree it as a plan.
You are clearly backing up school at home so don't feel judged. Just make sure there is action to support your son with his issues with school.

Quite, but that's why good PRUs can be great for challenging pupils where the school way of doing things just doesn't work.

I go into the PRU as a tradesman to run short programmes teaching the pupils who are interested some practical skills, showing them a non academic route to making a living.

We are not shackled as the school is by its ways of doing things - and it works, we have had so many successes, gas fitters, sparks, chippies, motor mechanics etc, all who would have flunked out of mainstream now have jobs and bright futures.

I'm thinking the OPs DS might benefit from a PRU placement rather than mainstream

Of course it used to be a thing! School refusal and 'truanting' are different, as has been explained. Just because you personally didn't have any experience or knowledge of it doesn't mean it didn't exist.

It existed when I was at school in the 70's, and my colleague refused to go to school way back in the late 60's for much of the middle years of her education. How much further back would you like to go?

Also, 'fining parents for this' is absurd and does nothing to actually address the problem. Fining people for anything in general is a wildly ineffective and unfair system. It's just a lazy way to be seen to be doing something.

Now I've heard it all 🤣

Totally agree with you. My issue is the speed at which people jump to it on this forum and just wildly diagnose everyone as neurodivergent, that's all 😊

Thank you for the clarification.

Yes, I have seen many people on here comment that a certain type of behaviour may be due to neurodivergence and then other people pile on saying stuff like they were too quick to ‘diagnose’ neurodivergence. But the fact of the matter is that there are many problem behaviours that can be caused by neurodivergence or of course some totally different issue. Neurodivergence is relatively common and very underdiagnosed especially in girls and women (although it may not feel like it is under diagnosed). I think it is totally legitimate to mention neurodivergence as a possibility. In this thread, the OP has said her DS is anxious and is badly behaved at school. This could well be due to ADHD for example - swearing at teachers could be due to much worse impulse control when under pressure.

Why do people seem to assume all bad behaviour is SEN, it's insulting to children with SEN.

Your son behaved awfully, and is disrupting the learning of others. It's also telling that he did this to a female teacher.

This.

Don't we all want to help the OP do whatever is needed to help turn her son around? She may never have considered that he might be struggling and masking. It's worth her considering it.

It was called ‘school refusal’ back in 1994 (I know as I was labelled a school refuser !)

She said the school had no concerns about SEN.

If I had a penny for all the kids I have known where school had no concerns......

Ok then. What does his father have to say about all this? Has he had a word with him about his behaviour? Once my sons got to your DS’s age I left quite a lot for their dad to deal with. Things such as behaviour issues that I had been confident I could deal with on my own when they were little. Men have a different approach and teenage boys often respond better to that than to what they might see as Mum’s “persistent nagging”. I’ll concede that the teenage years can do extremely difficult. You need as many different weapons in your armoury as you can get.
Try to get something positive out of the time your DS has to spend at home. Simply being bored will not help him to learn the lesson you want him to learn.

Excellent points. 🩷