To find it shocking how brazen people are with their hatred of refugees?

[GreenFairy93]

Another day, another Facebook post calling for the army to be bought in to stop the boats. Another comment section full of people shouting "sink the boats!" "Use as much force as necessary to stop them!"

There are women and children on these boats and people are brazenly calling for force to be used against them and for them to be sunk, with pictures of their faces next to their comments. Not an ounce of shame. And there's hundreds of them.

I just find it absolutely abhorrent and honestly, really upsetting that so many people have dehumanised asylum seekers to the point they have absolutely no compassion in their hearts to the point they are publicly calling for harm to come to families fleeing war.

AIBU to be shocked that people think this is ok now?

I don't know what that Group is, but isn't it up to the admin in that Group to delete the posts?

I belong to my local community group on Facebook and the admin are very good. Any racist posts or personal attacks get deleted.

Some people would fit into a nazi world quite easily. Horrible to think of.

BINGO! You’re all a bunch of nazis.

I’m not entertaining that or suggesting anyone needs to come up with a counter argument against that. It goes without saying, and I didn’t mention it. I was referring to military intervention, as I stated.

I didn’t mention that, as it’s quite obvious to any thinking person that the idea of feeding people to whales is not be taken seriously.

Well that's what the thread is actually about. I know, I started it. Something has gone wrong in society for people to feel emboldened to air these views in public. It's a worrying society where members of the public feel comfortable saying things like that about certain groups of people with their name and a picture of themselves attached to it. It demonstrates that a group has been dehumanised to the point where no-one has a problem with joking about shooting and drowning them.

So why are you trying to make it about something else? What unrelated point should I be making reasoned counter arguments for exactly?

The military intervention being called for in the comments being discussed here is the use of violence against civilians. It is not to simply pick them up and take them back or man the queues.

So you bringing up the peaceful/organisational use of the military, in the context of justifying the behaviour this thread is about is irrelevant, because that's a perfectly valid conversation to have, but it is not the one being discussed. Trying to turn it that way is just trying to make these views melt away into a reasonable conversation as if it never happened. Why are you so keen to do that?

We have (sadly) only 2 native Orcas still living in British waters and in any event no Orca has ever attacked a human in the wild. This is because we aren't part of their food chain.

So such a suggestion is obviously tongue-in-cheek, as is the one about "laying a minefield"

So "tongue in cheek" comments joking about killing people is fine now is it? As long as it groups of people we don't like and think deserve it?

Where is the line on this exactly? No one thinks it's ok to joke about killing kids, jokes about killing women are very poorly received. Jokes about killing people of a certain race are very frowned upon. Why does being a refugee make it ok to joke about killing them? Other than xenophobia exactly?

Do you actually believe these clearly angry people actually are only joking and mean no harm to refugees and would be upset if they were shot at by the military?

Women and children where? They’re young men on these boats! They do need to do what’s necessary to stop the boats as so many die trying to cross. If they knew it was fruitless it would save lives. Ppl have had enough and rightly so, feel free to to make room in your house for a couple though.

And IMO anyone trying to put a child in a dinghy to escape from France should be prosecuted for child abuse.

@GreenFairy93 "Do you actually believe these clearly angry people actually are only joking and mean no harm to refugees and would be upset if they were shot at by the military?"

I didn't see these people as being "clearly angry". I saw a lot of posters who seemed a bit brassed off making silly suggestions to solve the problem.
eg; Putting GPs receptionists would make sure no-one got through. One person reckoned that if shops can secure a piece of cheese in a supermarket we should be able to secure our borders. ( ! )

Something has gone wrong with social media certain people feel emboldened to say all sorts of stupid things - “of course a woman can have a penis” , “it wouldn’t matter if there was a spike [in murders of women] as long as ‘transwomen’ get to use the ladies toilets” -and these are just a couple of examples from the leader of a major UK political party and a Cambridge professor respectively.

My objection is to you implying that this is a more widespread problem to the extent that you have ‘lost faith in humanity’ as a result.

Anyway, this thread has been informative so thank you for that. I feel much better that many people are gaining awareness of the issues and are prepared to talk and debate about it. This is what is needed.

And IMO anyone trying to put a child in a dinghy to escape from France should be prosecuted for child abuse.

Absolutely!

Have you looked at the timeline on this? it's more than 20 years, women didn't come forward as they weren't believed, it's bad enough now but was much worse then. Marital rape wasn't even considered to be a crime until 1991 and it wasn't until 2003 that it was treated the same as any other rape offense, it takes years for those legal changes to filter through in to the system, it's really not evidence that more rapes and sexual assaults are happening it's proof that since the change in the law more women are coming forward and more importantly are being taken seriously

On the TV this week coincidentally as people have got louder about never seeing them the government mouthpiece finds footage of them trying to leave France

My objection is to you implying that this is a more widespread problem to the extent that you have ‘lost faith in humanity’ as a result.

I have lost faith in humanity because almost half of the people reading this thread think it is unreasonable to be upset that this behaviour is both occurring and normalised. The fact that people aren't seeing this behaviour as shocking and deplorable is honestly ridiculous.

Yes, bad people exist and social media emboldens them. The fact that normal people don't think this is a problem is the problem here.

It demonstrates that a group has been dehumanised to the point where no-one has a problem with joking about shooting and drowning them.

Maybe I’m jaded, men on the internet have been making threats worse than that about the women they have dehumanised as ‘terf’s’ for years. I have had pictures of guns pointing sent to me and threats, abuse and sexual comments about my children online. All by men.

Women in the public eye have even more abuse and threats heaped on them daily. Check the FWR thread about Kellie Jay Keene and the 7 years of harassment of her, her children, her family, her children’s school by trans activists. The police have added to the issue by pulling her in for interview for utterly spurious reasons several times and refuse to do anything to help her. She has had to pay for private security for her Let Women Speak events where she platforms women who have something to say.

It is not ok for those Facebook people to joke about migrants dying or being eaten by whales, obviously not, but for you to pick on that small group of people on those particular posts and try and add to the general misrepresentations of the discussion on immigration in order to shut it down is not ok.

@BundleBoogie
I agree...there will always be nutters who are emboldened by the anonymity of the internet, but they are clearly very much in a minority (and despised by the majority)
And I'm sorry to hear about the abuse you have suffered

for you to pick on that small group of people on those particular posts and try and add to the general misrepresentations of the discussion on immigration in order to shut it down is not ok.

I have done no such thing.

I am pointing out that a group of people have been dehumanised to the point where this is not a problem to many people. I have not made any comment either way on the actual situation of the small boats, or attempted to shut down the wider immigration discussion. It's an important discussion that needs to be had, but it needs to be had with the fact these are real human beings who deserve dignity and respect like everyone else does.

Why are you claiming I have tried to shut the discussion down? Beyond trying to keep the thread on topic that is, because the topic of this particular thread is these posters behaviour and the fact that people are acting like it is acceptable and what has gone wrong for this to be the case, the topic is not whether small boats should be welcomed or sent back.

You may have noticed on Mumsnet that people don’t always answer the question you want them to answer.

I put that you are being unreasonable because you are clearly viewing lots of posts from this group so presumably a member but instead of reporting the posts you object to you came to Mumsnet to start a thread on them.

I repeat: To find it boring and incomprehensible that virtue signallers point blank refuse to listen to genuine concerns over mass immigration, undocumented migrants and unacceptable vetting standards for ALL races, cultures and colours and instead keep making these futile attempts to call everyone who disagrees with them a racist/fascist/slur of choice all the while sneering sanctimoniously and clutching their pearls.

Your time is over. Even on mumsnet which has always been white saviour "progressive" paradise people have had enough of being shouted down and called vile names for worrying about genuine things.

You already know every single concern people have. They're not going to shut up. Disingenous "confusion" posts are just dreary and pointless at this stage.

Well said.

I think, like others, if we felt the comments were real and to be taken literally, the vote stats would be vastly different.
I just don’t think that those posting those comments mean them literally- I think they are just angry and spouting off.
If you spent less time being outraged and more time wondering what on earth would drive someone to such anger and desperation, your contribution to the debate may gain value.

Use of the military is a legitimate consideration, since it could be considered a powerful deterrent to people getting on boats across the channel. The French arrangement is clearly not working as the numbers appear to be ramping up, week on week.

It's really important that you don't lump everyone that disagrees with you as "virtue signallers". They just have a different opinion.