To think that white British/ American etcmen are just as much a threat to women as migrants?

[malificent7]

I am not excusing grooming, paedophile sex rings and unmonitored immigration at all but I hate all these protests.
I know that my white male ex teacher is a sex offender. Not to mention the Epstein scandal.
Aibu to think that ALL men are a danger to women...not just men of different ethnicities/ religions etc?

The issue is, a lot of the far right protesters type are just as much of a threat to women as the immigrants they “fight” against.They are the opposite side of the same shitty, abusive, violent, misogynistic coin. The hypocrisy is off the charts , and rage inducing. Joe Bloggs with a lengthy arrest record , 2 for DV and 3 for common assault isn’t there to protect me or any other woman (or girl) , he’s there to promote his own (violent and racist) agenda, just using me as an excuse.

I think the unspoken bit is that most violence happens within a relationship, which many people, especially on the far right, tend to the blame the victim for. But if there’s a stranger attack they are more likely to see the woman as an innocent victim. Stranger atracks are a tiny minority of total viokence but i dont know whether statistically they are more likeky to be made by a certain group.

Mmmm yes well we can’t do anything about that, but surely we don’t want to add to the problem/risk? I’d rather we mitigate the risk by controlling who comes into the UK. Some of the cultures referred to, I would want to be more vigilant with my daughters. My opinion based on what I see and read.

There's a big problem with statistics which is at the heart of this. The majority, 85% of sexual violence against women and girls, is by someone they know. At least 50% is by a partner or former partner.

However, sexual violence is very rarely reported and victims are more likely to report attacks by strangers than someone they know. We already know that convictions, especially against someone you know, are rare. Therefore statistics aren't that reliable.

I would not say not ALL men by any means but definitely all walks of life, age, nationality, immigrant, non immigrant whatver their colour can be a danger to women if they are that way inclined.

Now for the controversial bit, there are many men entering the country illegally, we don't know who they are, we know nothing of their past or what their intentions are which potentially adds to the risk. Is it really too big an ask just to know who is entering our country?

Assume you have an 18yo daughter intent on travelling solo - would you honestly feel the same about her doing that in Pakistan as doing it in Scandinavia? Honestly? I travelled a lot in my early 20s, almost always as a solo woman or as part of a group of women. Travelling in North Africa as a young woman was completely different to travelling anywhere in Europe (and I've been to a lot of European countries) to the point I would never want to go back.

Once again, women are being told to put-up, and shut-up.

Yes indeed. I'm in NI where there has been a lot of 'SAVE OUR WOMEN' protests. There have been 3 women KILLED by white men very recently, and not one protest against this. Stats were published recently showing that almost 50% of the men who have been arrested during protests (rooting) have been reported for DV. They aren't worried about the women, they are more worried that 'forrin' men might have claim to them.

Not all men are like that!

"All men are a danger to women"

Stop importing men then. Your post should only endorse the protests of these unvetted men that mums are out protesting against being in their community.

Your question doesn't make sense OP.

Sure any man could potentially be a threat.

And empirically, most men are not in fact dangerous.

The question is, are some men, as a group, more dangerous, statistically then other groups?

Rather like, if I go visit London, or I go visit Cairo, is there one place where I am more likely to be groped, harassed, or attacked by men.

In that case the answer is yes, absolutely. Even though any and all of those things could also happen in London.

Op.

Can you really not make the logical assumption that men coming from much more misogynistic countries, are more likely to be misogynistic?

If not, who are oppressing the women over there?

Would Afghan women agree with you?

I think this is all very true.

We have to be both balanced and honest in our approach, and also not let the far right steal the agenda on this issue (which I think is what has happened).

It shouldn’t be a huge ask to expect the same laws to apply to everyone, but apparently it is.

But actually the same laws, without deciding we’re only going to focus on non-white men. It doesn’t seem very surprising that Reform are constantly being found to be committing offences against or at least being offensive to women, whilst banging on about “immigrants threatening our women”.

Agree!

Unfortunately a small percentage of men are child abusers for example. Even more unfortunately the proportion of men (and women) who would turn a blind eye to child abuse in the right circumstances is much higher. The circumstances thing is complicated. It's not just to do with different cultural values. It's also to do with where the victim is perceived to be in the "in group" compared to the perpetrator. That's potentially why it was easier for the grooming gangs to abuse children for so long - the children were an out group to the South Asian men (race) and an out group to police etc (class). You need to be able to talk about that. But saying its a problem with foreign culture alone is completely counterproductive. Women and men from all cultures can be succeptible to the same behaviour patterns. See the film Whistleblower for example.

When the grooming gangs case came out I think some people were using the "it's terrible Asians" to push the problem further away from them. If it was just South Asian culture the white social workers, police etc would have stopped it sooner. I said a while back I thought the police seemed to be using "we were scared of being called racists" as an excuse.for deeper complicity. I stand by that... And that's the risk of only focussing on the racism angle.

But lots of people think "I would totally deck any kiddy fiddler" imagining how angry they would be if someone hurt their sister. But if it was their good friend/colleague/army buddy telling a funny story about the time they had sex with a prostitute in Belize/Kenya they wouldn't be worrying about if she was underage/trafficked. But you can rewrite that tendancy with self awareness.

I wouldn't like to travel around India alone as sexual harassment is rife. The majority of visas given to non Europeans are for Indian nationals. According to your argument, we should have a crime wave of Indian men sexually harassing women because apparently they can't control themselves. Do you have any evidence for that?

Because we vet Indians arriving here?

One of my neighbours sought my opinion on Reform yesterday. Most unexpected and unwanted. What do I 'think about 'the boats?'' I think it's vastly exaggerated by Farage. Why? Because migration is all they've got, nothing else. Tell me another policy. Oh, well, good day then.

Did the whole queue clap?

All this . “We were scared of being called racist” sounds a lot better than corruption, sexism, classism and an institutional lack of care.

The majority of visas given to non Europeans are for Indian nationals.

I think the key point to that statement is "visas". India also has a well-functioning bureaucracy, so we can have relative confidence that only men with no criminal record are coming here.

They're applying legally, and can be vetted before arriving on our shores, they aren't turning up in boats.

Absolutely, the Taliban do not prosecute sex crime let alone keep diligent criminal records for the sake of vetting. There’s absolutely no way of knowing whether a small boat illegal immigrant has committed sex crime previously or not, or any crime for that matter. It’s very ‘let’s see what he does’, with tragic consequences for many.

It’s almost like it isn’t a ‘brown people’ thing after all isn’t it!