To throw my 16 yr old son out after he squared up to me

[summerviews]

I have been busy all weekend sanding the staircase. My son brought two big bags of washing down and asked if they could be done. I said of course.
An hour or so had passed and I thought I'd ask him to put a wash on. He did this, no bother.
A couple of hours later I asked him to pop his washing into the dryer. Which he did.
Roll on this evening my eldest came home and wanted to get a wash on ready for work tomorrow. He put it on a quick wash. Once it's done, he goes to the dryer and realises stuff is in there and it's still wet! My 16 yr old son says he doesn't know why, and wants to take it out regardless. I explain that he should keep it in the dryer and let it dry properly or the clothes will stink if left damp or wet. He tells me I'm to blame as the dryer is my responsibility. I let this narky comment slide and calmly tell him to leave the washing in and turn it back on.
I know what's happened, he's put his washing in there earlier and not started it at the beginning of the cycle, so it's only done a half cycle, if that. But I say nothing (I pick my battles).
Literally less than five mins later 16 yr old walks to dryer and begins to pull everything out to check if it's dry yet. 🤦🏼‍♀️ I say "son, do you actually want to die?! In a playful, yet exasperated tone. "Put the washing back in!" I get up and begin to make my way over there to put everything back in, as he's just standing there with an angry look. As I'm walking, he says, "SAY THAT AGAIN!!". I tell him not to talk to me like that, that I'm trying to help him. He is still stood stock still, fists clenched and butts me with his chest (like a 'come on then!' kind of thing) he's done that to me once before a very long time ago and he was distraught with himself for being so horrible to me. I'm shocked at his reactions to say the least as it was never that deep as I now realise he's being aggressive and this is ridiculous behaviour. I tell him to stop and to have some respect, I remind him I'm his mother and to never do that to me again because I won't tolerate it! He then loudly shouts that I'm a "BITCH!" in my face. So I quickly walk away from him. I'm literally gasping for words, as I'm so upset and shocked. I shout to him to pack a bag and get out, that I will not stand for violent abusive behaviour from a child of mine.
I text his dad to come and get him (were not together). I say to him, don't ask my why ATM, son will explain.
He goes upstairs packs some stuff and leaves, shouting a cheery "bye everyone!" as he goes. Once son has left, I text dad asking him to talk to son about domestic abuse and that I don't tolerate it, and that I am ashamed of son's actions.
An hour or so later my phone is flooded with voice notes and messages from his dad accusing me of saying "do you want to die??" And that son was right to react the way he did and me saying it was abusive and violent is just the sort of thing I would typically do.
Ex was extremely abusive when we were together. That's the reason I left him.
Since then he has been a great father. No signs of abuse with new partner and soin look up to him.
For the rest of the evening I'm told I'm cancerous and is why no one wants to be with me and I'm a pathetic excuse of a mother.
I remind him of the abuse he has done when together and that I should not have expected anything in the way of advice to son from such an abuser. He continues to flood my phone with how I deserved what I got when we were together and that son is better off with him as I'm a pathetic excuse.
I blocked him. I can't take anymore of his abuse. I have been sobbing all evening.
I know my son will be upset with his actions today.
I was hasty in calling his dad, I know that now. At the time I was frightened and wanted to show my son I wouldn't tolerate such abuse.
I'm still sobbing. I don't want my son turning out like his father. I shouldn't have sent him to him. I've sent him into the lions den.

Grow up

Bit of an odd comment from you and over reaction from him. Have you got a death wish is an expression people use, rather than die. The better response would be to explain how long tumble drying takes

Well OP is the mother and the son is the child. It’s her job to teach but hey, if this is your view, your kids are obviously bringing themselves up.

There's another thread where the OP was actually assaulted by her DSD, whole thread full of 'poor girl, be kind, there must be something upsetting her, what's she been doing today, make her her favourite dinner and give her treats and a chat'.... here it's CHUCK HIM OUT!! HE'S ABUSIVE!!"

In this context it CLEARLY means:
Clothes are still wet, they can get mouldy, so will affect your health

WTF? Really? I wouldn't have taken it to mean that and I'm a 70 year old woman not a hormonal teenager.

People are so deliberately obtuse online.

If you don't understand what sarcasm is at 70... there's no hope
.

You and your sons have experienced abuse. You need to choose your words more carefully. Saying do you want to die is not nice for anyone to hear, let alone someone who’s experienced abuse. He may have genuinely feared that before as a child.

Only took a page or two for posters to blame OP and tell her to apologise to her son for provoking his threatening behaviour. The ‘joke’ wasn’t meant as a threat, it was in relation to him wearing damp clothes, and didn’t warrant him squaring up to OP. Which is the actual issue here. OP clearly felt threatened, so asked him to leave. Hopefully the situation will cool off today and they can sort it out and put some boundaries in place as far as behaviour is concerned.

That was might thought.

I thought (perhaps wrongly) he wanted to empty the dryer so his brother could use it & then he could have finished drying the load he had put in.

That doesn't mean he wasn't wrong to square up & insult of course but it seems an unnecessary drama.

Pandering to fucked up guys when they're kids is why they go on to batter their wives and think well mum was fine with it. Fuck him and fuck his hormones and pathetic self importance. Don't you bloody dare apologise he assaulted you for a shit joke.

Yep. OP explained to him about wet and mouldy clothes before making the ‘ do you want to die’ comment. Wasn’t a major leap to realise what she meant.

Having seen an extended family member call the police on both her children when she felt they had stepped out of line, I do not think this is a good idea.

They have both turned into lovely adults and they no longer speak to her.

Everyone getting hung up on OP's you want to die comment. Completely missing the point. What sort of lives do people.on here lead if you can't say things in a jokey way, I can see what you were doing there OP, trying to keep things light, even if others are clutching their pearls over it.
As for your son you have shown him you wont have him near you if he acts like this, it's just a shame your ex is such a prick.

You don't understand abuse. Kid felt threatened - should he do nothing and be (as he will feel) mistreated, or react in the only way he can become of the power imbalance.

Some people struggle with understanding sarcasm, and some people grow up in a family where truth and lies are inconsistent, and so how do you know when something's a joke or serious if it's never the same. When it's like that, it's not because we are stupid (thanks for the suggestion that unless we get your jokes we must be an idiot). Someone might find it funny, albeit really cruel to threaten a child, to humiliate them (publicly as well) etc. Who has the power in this relationship? The mother or the son? The mother says that the ex was abusive, and yet somehow everyone thinks that won't have affected the son in any way except negativity and allegedly copying his behaviour. Seriously educate yourselves. Is it possible that he has been affected by witnessing it, and further that he himself has been subject to it. Perhaps his father has threatened him.

Sarcasm as it's often badly veiled aggression or mockery - all for the amusement of the speaker and none for the victim. Often used by people with low empathy. I have to ask, did the mother tell the son why or how the washer/dryer operates, or just randomly said that? I was not allowed to use either without explanation (so I did whilst they were out). They liked to control everything.

This...

He's a teenager being a teenager... Ultimately his behavior is unacceptable ...

He will be particularly sensitive to confrontational behavior given what he's witnessed growing up... And also a dose of testosterone.

Also when he's dysregulated, he's unlikely to perceive your underlying jokey tone... He's seen it as an escalation...

I would concentrate on trying to find an adult male role model who isn't your abusive ex... He will only learn aggression and violence from him.

Really think it through... When versions of this happen again what will you do.. Like a plan of action...

I would hold the line. Poor response and line from you. Do you want to die?

He squared up to you called you a bitch etc
leave it. Let the dust settle. Your ex is nasty and yes don’t expect help like this - if you have messages saying you deserved to be hit from his Dad - I would keep them.

Im so sorry this happened to you. Being physically intimidated by your own son is an awful, conflicting thing that is very complex to deal with. Whatever anyone tells you, this is not your fault, not even a little, because whatever you said to him, to have him react with physical threat will always mean there's a problem with him. Because somewhere along the way he's picked up the idea that men control, silence and retaliate to women using their physical power. That has to be stopped before he becomes a danger to women, like his father. I think you did the right thing in removing him. And again, it's not your fault his dad is unsuitable. However, you will want to protect him as well as yourself, so I think you need to get professional input. Start by calling Family Lives who should point you in the right direction.

Kid felt threatened - should he do nothing and be (as he will feel) mistreated,

Yes. He should do nothing.

I think you have two issues here and both are really tricky. The first is how you parent your son while (understandably) not tolerating any violence, aggression or intimidation. And the second is your ex. He will manipulate your son into thinking he was right to behave the way he did, you provoked him, you’re crazy etc. which will stop your son having that crucial regret later and start to turn him into the kind of man who justifies his violence against women by blaming them.
I think that as soon as possible, get your son home and talk. Get him listening to you and not his father.
What you said about taking the clothes out of the dryer is irrelevant by the way and hopefully you know that.

People are getting unnecessarily hung up on your die comment. I know exactly what you mean. It’s a bit like the ‘do you like hospital food’ comment I have heard people make.
Putting that aside- I think he has lacked a decent role model father. He must know he was abusive to you. What I think is required is a cooling off period for all of you then you can both calmly talk through what happened and what needs to happen going forward. Your son’s behaviour was absolutely unacceptable and quite worrying. Is family therapy an option?

Teenagers squaring up to their parents is part of growing up. My 2 sons did it to their dad.

This is absolutely not normal, or at least shouldn't be. It's not something that ever ever happened where I grew up, and something has gone badly wrong with parenting and society in 21st century Britain for anyone to think otherwise.

There are more woman than ever raising children alone, it's dangerous for them to normalise abuse from their larger, stronger sons.

You both need to apologise. Your comment was weird. Teenagers do have more trouble interpreting other people’s emotions and are more likely to interpret them as aggressive. He obviously heard what you said as aggression not a joke. As a teenage boy he may well be experiencing aggression and threats from other boys which may also cause him to have a higher threat response. (Also, even as an adult woman that comment would land badly with me, I’ve lived with an aggressive man and that comment would hotline to my threat alert too, I may not outwardly respond to it, but my limbic system would).

However, your so. clearly massively over reacted and should not have been aggressive.
I think you should have laid a boundary without kicking him out, but given him time to cool down and you both have time to think, self reflect and talk it through. Sending him to his Dads has just exposed him to a man who is backing his narrative when he is emotional and receptive to that supportive narrative.

I think you are the adult and you need to be the one to initiate the repair process here.

Do you want to die is not jovial it sounds ott.

They both overreacted, it's possibly a stressy household and they both need to acknowledge that and work out how to keep calm.

You handled this very badly op but I think you know that.

You've just sent a child who has gone through having an abusive parent in the house and a seperation, to that abusive parent. Who will now fill his head with poison, damage your relationship irreversibly and set him on the wrong path.

I'm not one for gentle parenting. At all.

But you were the adult here. You are supposed to model how to behave, and instead you issued a weird threat and escalated every single thing.