For thinking the details of my holiday are none of work's business

[Truffleshuffle84]

I work for a medium size company in he UK

Staff handbook says all leave must be agreed by your line manager and will be approved on the basis of business need and general staff numbers/ work coverage etc - all fine, been here for 8 years, never an issue. I'm in a team of 5 and collectively with our line manager we manage to get holidays to suit everyone etc.

Line manager left in June and we've got a new one from a different department, no issues, we all get on well.

But, I've asked for a week off in the autumn for the school holidays. LM replied asking when I was away and where was I going, I thought it was just a casual passing interest type question, replied with details of our plans.

They've now rejected my leave request because they don't think I'll be fit for work Monday returning from Tenerife on a Sunday on a flight that lands at 10.30pm (at an airport 20 mins from home).

I've not replied yet but AIBU for thinking it's up to me how I spend my annual leave and it's up to me to decide whether something is achievable whilst being ready for work the next day?

That's mental- you could literally drive to the other side of the country and back for the weekend and get home on a Sunday night at midnight after 8 hours of driving, and how would anyone know, or get to dictate what you do on a Sunday night! Surely it's you're own responsibility to get into work on time, and if you don't, well the ownership is on you.

its fucking tneenrife! even if it wasnt you know how you feel when you travel not them

My late husband did that after our trip to visit the Australian relatives. We landed at 6am, got home at 8, and he went straight to work.

OP's line manager's decision is absolutely nuts.

Are you a brain surgeon or long distance lorry driver?

This is bat 💩 she's like a parent telling her child, no u can't go out with your friends it's Sunday night and you have school in the morning.

Monday shouldn't be her concern when its not part of your holiday. Monday absence is a Monday problem. She can't say you can't have the previous week off because you may feel tired on the Monday. You now know never to give any details even if she asks.

Take this to HR. There's no staffing issue so there's no problem.

HNRTFT but when was it ok for employer to dictate what time an employer goes to bed at night?!!

I don't want to start lying and for that to get discovered and then the lying be something I'm challenged on.

One of my colleagues is good friends with my sister, I'll not manage to keep my plans secret, and I'd like to be able to talk about my holiday with my work mates without having to massage the truth etc

Thanks for all the replies. I'm going to email her back on Monday and say:

Hi LM,

I'm not going to change my plans, I'm satisfied that I'll be fit for work. Thanks for your concern but I'm not worried about flying home on the Sunday evening and being ready for work as required. I've checked with the team and there's no crossover with our leave for that week r.e. staffing levels so could you approve it on the system please. Let me know if you need it to be resubmitted or if you can approve my original request.

Thanks

Truffle.

If she knocks it back again I'll escalate it to HR.

I think this is too long.

Hi Lm. I will absolutely be fit for work. I have resubmitted the leave request for approval. Many thanks.

In future, do not tell anyone of your holiday plans. They do not need to know the finer details and I wouldn’t be providing them.

IMO you could land at 5am and go to work at 8am. Not up to the employer to decide if you will be fit to work as long as you turn up at the required time on the required day!

Imagine the amount a company would have to shell out on night nannies to make that work.

What a ridiculous reason for denying A/L, on this basis , you're not allowed to have a late night during the week. Unless you operate dangerous machinery or are a surgeon, it doesn't really matter if you are tired.
Most of the working population are bloody tired but still manage to function at work.

Can you imagine phoning in sick and giving the reason as 'tired' !

That’s utterly ridiculous.

Hi LM,
I'm not going to change my plans, annual leave arrangements, I'm satisfied that I'll be fit for work.
Thanks
I note for your concern.
[a little passive agressive but🤷‍♀️]
but I'm not worried about flying home on the Sunday evening and being ready for work as required.

I've checked with the team and there's no crossover with our leave for that week r.e. staffing levels other member of the team off that week so could you approve it on the system please. L let me know if you need me to it to be re submitted my holiday annual leave request again or if you can approve my original request.
Thanks
Truffle.

Just wow!!!!
Like your response

Fuck me!
you could stay up all Sunday night playing call of duty and go into work on zero sleep if you want!

Don't say you are moving the fights if you aren't. Keep it simple.

"What's the policy for vacation flight times? I've been told my flight time is not allowed"

Sit with the awkwardness as you knew the question is unanswerable. Don't offer to back down, let them take that graceful way out

This Line manager would have had a nightmare with me back in day, we used to go clubbing straight from work, and do the walk of shame into the office the following morning having stayed out all night and zero sleep .

Don't say you are moving the fights if you aren't. Keep it simple.

"What's the policy for vacation flight times? I've been told my flight time is not allowed"

Sit with the awkwardness as you knew the question is unanswerable. Don't offer to back down, let them take that graceful way out

It's probably others taking the buscuit that has caused this. Ie. People ringing in sick on the first day to return. I wouldn't bother replying if you are not going to change your plans. It's just going to be another no.

I'd just learn from it and put this one down to experience.

Absolutely bonkers. How does she know that you are not staying up every sunday night getting drunk until 4am and then coming into work? Hopefully HR will tell her to wind her neck in!

Madness.

And at the other extreme, I've had my company book me early morning flights to head office in another city where I have to wake up at 3 am to make the flight and they know this and I must then work a whole day at that office before flying home again in the evening. It's absolutely exhausting.

But as long as they're in control, they don't really care about our health and wellbeing / work-life balance.

Quick washup only or new shirt with the look at me fold marks or were you pro level with a clean one (or three) hanging on your chair 💅

Learn from what ? Experience of what ? Line manager has massively overstepped. Given that no-one else is off in the time OP has booked, the line manager has no right to assume that there will be any problems because of a late flight. And if OP isn’t going to change her plans she needs to confirm that the dates are booked.

Straight into the loo , wet toilet paper to wipe smudged mascara off , clean my teeth (always had a a toothbrush and mini toothpaste on me) Tame hair (big perm) as best I could and styled it out. There was often a round of applause for anyone doing the WOS !