To think this is a batshit holiday with kids

[HollaNack]

I share 3 kids 7,8,9 with my ex of 2 years. He has booked summer plans to take them all in his van through France for 3 weeks, ending at a waterpark.

Am I being really precious, or is this insanely inadvisable with 3 small kids?

We're not unfamiliar to van life. We lived in one together for 2 years in Europe, pre kids. The van is the 'family' camper, the kids know it well, it's all equipped and goes well when it starts.

But the risks are insane. Huge risk of drowning with 1:3 ratio staying weeks at a waterpark. Tiredness, cranky hot kids, fights, cooking, missing mum, no respite or somewhere comfy to sit and stare at cartoons in a language you don't even understand.

It's not a civil breakup. I have an NMO against him and the kids are only just getting round to being comfortable staying the night at his.

I just feel like this screams 'manchild biting off more than he can chew and risking his kids happiness/safety/lives in the process'

I'm aware that I could do Specific Issue Order but honestly, it would feel a little petty. He does not listen to reason and this is going to be my lot for the next 10 years. So I'm trying to see how this could possibly be an ok idea. Also because I'm trying to balance Positive Outlook with the kids, vs not completely gaslighting them when they raise their own concerns (so far mostly around timescale).

Do we think this could be ok? Am I being precious? Or do I need to try and stop this?

YABU: They're not babies, let them have their adventure
YANBU: This idea is indeed batshit and must be stopped at all costs

The holiday itself, if that's what he's used to, sounds fine. But 3 weeks away when they are "only just getting used to spending the night at his"? I wouldn't be happy with that part.

I would also be concerned about the swimming part, is he vigilant with them in the water? That would be my biggest worry. For what it’s worth, I took my 3 kids (3,6,7) to a waterpark in Italy this week solo and it was fine, kids had a blast. Last night my husband took them swimming to the Aqua park on our campsite and they all had a great time.

We’re travelling through a few European countries and I see lots of kids playing in the campsites playgrounds in little groups with the parents on their pitches nearby. I’m always with mine due to 3 year old (and I’m far too uptight).

I have1SS and 5 DSss and we went on this kind of holiday - but stayingbinna set up tent or static caravan for years when our boys were that age and they loved it . It was actually quite easy once there because they mixed with others and.were off swimming and playing every day .We just ate bagettes and cheese and ham . I think these are the holidays kids love .

I think the holiday sounds fine but not with someone who has an NMO against them.

Exactly my thoughts!

I don't think the road trip/water park is a particular issue of itself, the danger seems to be from him, the NMO and the fact they haven't seen him for any length of time for a while. Going from zero to a full-on road trip seems a bit much.

What was the reason for the NMO? Can he do some more overnights between now and the trip so he gets used to having them again? Perhaps a camping weekend in the UK (following which he may think that 3 weeks will be a bit intense!)

Can't see the issue given the DC ages. He is their Father and entitled to take them away and spend time with them just as you are.

There are a lot of shit dads in the world. I have seen descriptions of dads on here I wouldn’t trust to look after an earthworm. But a shit dad is unlikely to plan a holiday like this. It sounds great. They will have fun for most of the time. They are used to the van. You need to think of things to take your mind off it while they’re away. Personally, I would plan a massive redecorating project.(which to be fair, I would probably half finish and still be in the middle of by Christmas.

3 weeks is long but other than that there's no way you'd win a specific issue order to stop this holiday. It's entirely reasonable for him to take the kids in the camper and to a water park and no court would stop this. He's thought through ratios ie having an extra pair of hands with someone who will pitch tent next door so no safeguarding issues.
He's mad of course as this will be tough if kids are cranky and it's a long time living out of a van.
If I were you I'd suggest a shorter holiday to him eg 2 weeks and see how he responds. But other than that not sure you can do much to stop this

It's too long. One of them is already telling you this. Three weeks would be horrendous should they get homesick.

You also have a NMO against him, so good reason not to trust him.

Finally I don't like the thought of the random friend. You have no idea if the children will feel safe with him.

You’re being a control freak and looking for issues. Arguably one could say there’s a drowning risk on any holiday that involves water. Why should this one be any different?

it sounds absolutely awesome and the perfect holiday for them.

I think it sounds fine, aside for 3 weeks being slightly too long IMO. Do you think you could speak to him and just have a chat about the fact that you think they might cope slightly better with a shorter period? Or about what to do if they have enough half way through. I think it’s got to be longer than a week though with all that driving.

Other than that I would be trying to equip the kids myself to be a bit more self sufficient and to look out for each other.

My dh has taken all of ours to the beach with strict rules as with 2, 5 and 8 then 3,6 & 9 he obviously has to stay with the little one. But I think it wouldn’t be allowed at the local pool and I wouldn’t want him to do it regularly as the big ones would want to do more proper swimming. And I’ve always been really clear no distractions no phones when supervising in water, So I’d be very concerned about the water park. The rest sounds awesome tbh! Can you cut it down to one or two weeks?

Obviously the parent should always be supervising. But supervising a 7, 8 and 9 year old who can swim is not like taking a 2, 3 and 4 year old swimming on your own.

Absolutely this.

A dad who has a NMO against them is by definition surely a shit dad. Not exactly a good example to them and not allowed near their mum

who is this pal ? What do you know about them?

What's the non molestation order for? Was your children ever present? Feel like this is relevant

Are you able to meet the friend that is planning to go so that you can suss him out?. I also wonder if the trip is too ambitious .Could your ex take them to a holiday park in this country that has a supervised water park and then decide if he wants to go on a 3 week trip sometime in the future.

We have a camper van, my initial thought was where are the car seats going when they are on site because they take up so much space!

Here we go! Yet another person who comes on here with their sob story, states their issues at some length and then disappears without trace! Won’t answer any questions, won’t clarify any details, just lights the touchpaper and stands well back! Makes me wonder if they have a problem at all, or whether they are just on here to wind us all up. I lose patience with people like this. There are plenty of people with real problems. We don’t need people who invent them for fun.

There are two issues here. The holiday itself which sounds amazing. I don't think you can knock a French driving holiday, I have taken my kids on a mixture of both french driving holidays and AI holidays. For every con you have come up with about the french holiday I could come up with another con about AI, certainly I think the french pools tend to be more heavily lifeguarded than the Spanish AI ones I have been too. The french also have tighter hygiene laws and drinking around the pool isn't really a thing. I think I have only been to one french site that had a bar on poolside, none of the others did.

However the abuse towards you is mentally difficult to deal with a maybe clouding your vision on this and it also maybe giving you a little bit of ptsd or something which is pushing you into panic mode, so perhaps talking this through with a professional would help?

@Lmnop22

im not sure kids that age are bothered about home comforts! They’re all about fun and adventure. What kind of home comforts are you thinking of?

Splitting up in tricky circumstances must be so hard. But the fact is that he is an equal parent and you don’t get to tell him how to do that job anymore. The holiday sounds brilliant, they will learn lots travelling through another country and have loads of fun at the water park. You’re going to have to trust that it will be ok or you’ll drive yourself mad - no court in the land is going look at that holiday plan and say it’s somehow inappropriate.

i get it OP. My DH has very different ways of doing things which have historically rubbed me up the wrong way. His way often feels slapdash and half arsed. But, and it’s a big important but, their safety has never really been at risk. He would argue his relaxed approach to life is healthier than my ‘plan for Armageddon’ one - and in many ways he is absolutely right.

Stuff like suncream, important yes but your kids are at the age now where they can put it on themselves apart from their backs which they can help each other with - you can do some test application sessions on warm days as training for them. I’d drip feed this sort of thing over the next few weeks so they are more likely to take responsibility. You can at least make sure plenty of stuff (suncream, rash vests, antihistamines etc) is packed but after that you’re going to have to leave them to it. Plan loads of selfish me time stuff while they’re away and try to enjoy the peace that we all wish we had until they’re gone!

be the adult in the room - through gritted teeth if necessary, sell them this trip. They need to learn to spend time with dad without you and this is a great way to start that journey. They’ll need your help in seeing this as a big positive, because for them that’s exactly what it is.

good luck.