For not wanting my children to ‘learn’ Christianity?

[AmusedLemur]

I use learn loosely, I don’t mean learn, I mean be spoken to about God as if it is fact, when I myself do not believe.

context

I am an atheist. My husband was raised by a very catholic family, however he himself is not a practicing catholic (he doesn’t attended church, never prays, etc)

He says he does believe in a God, but it’s not something he lives his life by / he thinks about too regularly.

This has never been an issue for us because mainly we’re on the same page. Yes he will take his mother and father to church on Christmas Eve, but that is as about as religious as he gets.

Let me preface this by saying I have an amazing relationship with his family. I love them. We got married in a church to please them, and when we had our baby (Gia - 2) we got her Christened so they wouldn’t worry.

I have no problem with them talking about their love for God in front of me or anything like that. But, Gia is now of an age where she is taking things in. And they tell her that God is the reason she is here, to be thankful for him, he gave her life and everything she has. More has been said, but I’m not there when it is, so I’m not entirely sure what.

For a 2 year old, she obviously believes when her Grandmother tells her this and so comes home and asks me if I’ve thanked God, tells me she loves him, and so on and so forth.

I don’t want to correct Gia by saying God isn’t real, because it’s her choice to believe. But am I being unreasonable by not wanting my in laws to teach her that God is real from such a young age?

You don't have to tell her god isn't real, but you can teach her about other religions and about evolution. Just keep talking to her about all of the different ways people interpret the world - you can tell her what you believe in and in time she can make up her own mind.

DD goes to a CofE school (not our preferred choice) and for the first couple of years declared herself a Christian. Both DH and I are atheists and just kept up a dialogue with her about it all. A couple of years ago she developed an interest in science, particularly natural sciences and informed us that she no longer believed in god because it didn't make sense in the context of evolution (she's 7, so she didn't use those exact words, but that was the gist!).

I'm an atheist and my DD has almost completed school. I wouldn't worry too much about it. Gia will come to her own reasoned conclusions in time. (Usually, it's all a load of hooey)

We went to church for many years when I was younger, and I attended Sunday school. It was more down to it being a quite fun/upbeat community one I guess. We moved and I stopped attending it post primary school. Can't say it has much of an impact on me religiously. But I do recall it just being a fun thing when I was young that had its own place and time I guess.

I'm an atheist as an adult too.

Would you be happy for someone to teach your child that God isn't real from such a young age?
What would you say if your child asked if God is real? Surely saying that he isn't real is the same as saying that he is?

I'm a Christian so obviously I teach my children that God is real. However I would find it upsetting if my inlaws kept telling me children that he isn't real so I understand why you don't like it

I don’t necessarily want people to teach her anything at 2 years old.

Talk openly about religion yes, but be clear it’s an opinion and that people believe different things. Not talk as though it is fact, as if everyone knows that’s what’s real.

Especially when they know I don’t believe but that I won’t feel comfortable correcting her.

I mean to be honest, I'd be looking at it from the other side. They are forcing religion onto your 2 year old child. Religion is a belief system, not scientific fact. I would be asking them to keep the 'God' talk to a minimum with your child until she's old enough to decide if that's something she wants to practice herself or not.

Just a reminder that most young children believe Father Christmas is real for many years so there’s no need to overthink it.

I would explain that people see the world in different ways, believe different things, and that nanny and grandad believe in a God and talk about God, but you don't, and that's OK because everyone is different. You could also say that one day they will decide what they believe. At least I like to think that's how I would handle it (and I do believe).

YABU - you married into a Catholic family. Of course they are going to talk about their faith to their grandchild. Its the entire way they view the world and everything in it. Its not an add on. You just have to accept that.

You can talk to your child about your views on the world too.

When she is old enough she will make up her own mind and follow her own path.

You do not need to make this into a big deal, and nothing good will come of this if you try to.

I think the difference here is that it's generally expected that the 'Father Christmas' belief ends. Religion is enduring and ongoing. I do agree with other posters though, you need to tell your child 'your' beliefs too (or lack thereof). You are well within your rights to do that, just as they do when talking about theirs.

@AmusedLemur Hi, you might want to ask MN UK to redact part of your post where you use your child’s name/ age as it might be a bit identifying.

I am expecting to be in a similar situation when my 3 week old is older.

My wife and I have discussed it and we’ll take it head on and explain to grandparents that our impressionable child will not be spoken to about their religion as though it is fact, although they’re more than welcome to explain what they believe.

If my child grows up and chooses to believe then that’s fine but I’m not having them indoctrinated from minute one.

Honestly, you are overthinking this. A 2 year old is not going to believe in God or even understand what the hell Granny is talking about just because she’s talking to her about the concept. Dh and I both come from Christian families, went to Christian schools all the way through with mandatory church attendance every week. Dh is an atheist, I converted to another (non-Christian) religion, which I now only mildly practice.

The thing is, you are atheist. Your Dh presumably has no interest in raising her religious. But you need to stop confusing the issue by having a religious marriage and getting her christened. I think that’s much more confusing than what a random family member talks about. You committed to a Christian marriage and to raising your dd as a Christian, I’m guessing with commitment of godparents within the family too. That’s very much blurred the lines. I think you need to stop going along with practicing Christianity if you don’t intend to practice Christianity. But what granny goes on about really will do no harm.

Also she’s 2. As long as the message is a loving one, not a God will damn you to hell if you are naughty one, none of this will do any harm.

To them it is fact. To you it isn’t. You are both correct. Gia has to make her own mind up. She will be exposed to lots of people and beliefs over time, and that is a good thing.
My mum and 3 brothers all grew up in a church family. Only 1 now practices.

Absolutely not necessary to ‘accept that’. DH and I are both atheists who grew up in devoutly Catholic families. DS has not been baptised or confirmed, and though he attended a C of E school for most of primary (we were living in the country and it was the only option), he’s a thoroughgoing rationalist who used to enjoy battling the loopy biblical literalist vicar when he came in. We’ve never felt the need to pretend religious belief has any particular value, just pointed out that the grannies and grandpas believe things we don’t because they find it a comfort.

I don’t necessarily agree with that. My parents were married in a church because it was pretty, and christened me and my siblings (so the family could meet us and have a party) but are by no means religious.

Thats why I was more than happy to do these things. Most of my friends children were christened, again for the party, but they didn’t do it for the religious side.

I get your take, however I think these things are hugely common in British culture without religious commitments (in a country where religious beliefs have largely declined)

Respectfully, Christianity is certainly ‘fact’ insofar as there appears to have been a historical preacher in first century Galilee whose followers diverged from Second Temple Judaism to form their own belief group which was open to gentiles, and wgich grew into a world religion etc. There’s no ‘fact’ whatsoever to the divinity of Jesus, the existence of a deity etc

Please, this thread is not to argue the existence of God / Jesus.

It is not a fact to many people. Religion is belief. I have not posted this to argue that.

We live in a free country and people are able to change their beliefs throughout their life. For many people, religion is not enduring or ongoing. I know an awful lot of people raised in Christian families who are not Christian.

I am not religious, but I would rather in-laws talked to my children as if God were real than talk to them as if Father Christmas was real. There are expressing their authentic beliefs about God (and remember Christianity is about faith and belief, not fact) whereas they would just be lying about Father Christmas. Some children are really distressed when they find out their parents lied to them about Father Christmas, because it was presented not as a belief but as reality. Learning you cannot trust people your trusted can be upsetting at any age.

I'm an atheist. Honestly, I think your PIL are probably a bit confused about where you stand given the church wedding and the christening. Do many people really christen their kids just for the party? I wouldn't have been comfortable with that.

The thing is, if your dd is growing up in the UK, she will be exposed to Christianity from a young age in any case. I remember dd coming home at the age of 4, in reception, proclaiming that Jesus was the light of the world. It doesn't seem to have scarred her!😂

Just be open and honest about your own beliefs and about different people believing different things, and let your dd know that she can make her own mind up about what she thinks, and change it as many times as she likes as well!

Your PIL believe in this stuff and it's important to them. They will be sharing it with your dd because they feel that it's the right thing to do. It isn't a hill worth dying on in my view, but I would gently seek to rebalance it by exposing your dd to a range of other perspectives, including your own.

I would have knocked that right on the head, no one needs to be talking to 2-year-old about their religion, especially when they know the mother of that two year-old doesn't have the same beliefs.

If they can't stop it then they see far less of the two-year-old.

I wss brought up RC went to a convent primary school ,taughr by nuns ect ,im agnostic at best now
My son was baptised as RC he also went to catholic schools hes atheist
They dont seem to be doing a good job of indoctrinating people.