Is our parenting technique too gentle?!

[GJD23000]

I need a bit of advice. My husband and I are starting to think we are too gentle on our 6 year old DD. I absolutely wouldn’t class us as ‘gentle parents’ but we are definitely on the gentler side of strict, we only have the one so I would say we are pretty relaxed with her. We are incredibly flexible in our jobs, which we love, but it also means we can be at her beck and call and are almost ‘too’ available for her. I ask now because her behaviour, especially around bedtime, has been getting increasingly bad - tonight she has screamed at us for over an hour, calling us horrible names and being very rude. She refuses to go to bed without us going to bed next door at the same time (we have on occasions done this when tired and watched some tv) Her attitude can sometimes be bad, quite rude and often she comes out with really mean things. Other times she is amazing, sooo funny, kind, loving and friendly but her ‘mean’ times seem to be increasing and I am wondering if we need to be stricter. You read the internet and it tells you all the horror stories of strict parenting but I’m starting to think the lack of it is leading to her disrespecting us….what are we doing wrong?! Help!

She's not a "horror". She's an overwhelmed 6 year old child expressing her anxiety around being separated from her parents through unwanted behaviours. Behaviours which can be addressed with the right strategies. Whereas you are all grown up but still get something out of anonymously upsetting strangers who have only asked for help when they are struggling.

@CNN25 sorry if I’m doubling up on something already said.

It sounds very challenging. Im sure you’ve thought about this, but do you know what she is feeling at bedtime / why she may be behaving like this?

As a child I became quite scared to go to bed. I felt lonely and frightened. I think I’d also become aware I wasn’t going to live forever, which terrified me and was frightened my grandfather would die. I guess I’m sharing this, as I’m sure you’ve thought, but what is it that she may be feeling and how could you reassure her/ help ease it.

Many other people have shared good thoughts on affirming boundaries etc xx

How are you getting to the stage where she is able to say horrible things to you. I would not allow it.

Im a strict parent to an only child (you say she is an only like it’s an excuse). She’s a teen now, we have a very good relationship - everyone says we are like best friends, she opens up to me, but the boundaries are there - there is a line that we have both drawn - as a parent, I’ve also gotten to know what her boundaries are - parenting is a 2 way street but there are non negotiables.

I think many parents fear that strict = no relationship. That’s not true. At her age it’s so important that you give her those boundaries. That she is told off for bad language and being rude. That she understand there is a bedtime. You are allowed to hear her out too. When’s she’s calmer you can talk about it.

When my DD was around that age she hated bed time and eventually she told me that she was scared of a reoccurring scary dream she was having. I say this to highlight that even at a young age you can be strict and enforce bedtime, and you can also have conversations and help them to articulate feelings.

Completely agree @Tuttifrutticutiepie

It’s strange, I’m not sure. She used to be really good with going to bed but something has obviously changed within the past few months. She has a nightlight and she does sometimes say she is scared/hears noises but a lot of the time she refuses simply because she is ‘not tired’

I would guess there are unclear boundaries outside of bedtime as well. Children need clear, enforced boundaries. Without clear boundaries they have to make the rules themselves, which is scary for them.

Is her bedtime appropriate for her age? When not throwing a tantrum does she go to sleep in a reasonable time? Do you have a bedtime routine that is consistently followed?

I think you have swung too far into permissive and need to re-establish boundaries and enforce them.

As for cancelling the sleepover Tuesday, many would argue that is too far from the behaviour to be effective discipline. Effective discipline happens in the moment.

@FoldinthecheeseI love the idea of "two minutes." I may steal that one.😀

While I don’t really personally favour strict parenting, there needs to be a balance. You are the parents - you need to set some boundaries. Generally children feel more secure with some (fair) rules and order. There’s also no excuse for rude behaviour or calling you names - where is she learning that from!?

All of these things are absolutely true and good but also kids and adults get tired and irrational and just need to f-ing go to bed and preferably be told kindly, compassionately, and firmly that it's bedtime. Gonna tell myself that right now but if I was a kid I'd need someone else to

#oldschoolparenting

My little girl doesn’t really have the personality for ‘gentle’ parenting but my parents were authoritative/strict and it was actually pretty detrimental to our relationship, I couldn’t really talk to them as always felt like I would get in trouble and never felt my mum was on my side

Your parents were strict with you for a reason, and the reason is that if they hadn’t have been you’d have probably been screaming abuse at them and dictating their bedtime like your daughter is doing to you.

My mum did not put rules in place and I behaved like your daughter. As I got older I used to lash out at her and call her names. I wanted a good telling off and I never got one. It made me feel like she didn’t care about me and that I was in charge, which I was. It made me worry that if a burglar came she wouldn’t be able to deal with it and I would have to tackle a burglar. I felt unsafe in the home and scared.

You mentioned you couldn’t talk to your parents. Neither could I, because my mum wouldn’t stand up to a small child so there was no way I was going to burden her with issues like being bullied or problems in school. I was jealous of my friends with strict parents.

For me cancelling the sleepover isn't really effective..its too far away and by the time Tuesday comes she won't really connect the 2 things. If this behaviour is worse around bedtime I would wonder if this is about anxiety (as well as being a diva lol!) Is she trying to control the narrative? She's really annoyed at being put to bed and you adults remaining downstairs so she's left out ? I am not excusing this behaviour at all just looking for reasons for it. I wouldn't put up with this at all but it is a bit unusual....
I'm sure you have a good bedtime routine and all but just reinforce it and be really consistent. Plenty of discussion before bed about what is happening and when...what the adults will be doing etc. Off to bed..then stop staying in her room just keep returning her calmly. And keep going as long as it takes. Reward chart? And reward good bedtimes and lots of praise and working towards a treat. Focusing on good behaviour rather than taking away things for bad behaviour.

OP, in the kindest possible way — you're supposed to be her parents, not her friends. It's your job to establish boundaries and rules and ensure she sticks to them. It will help her feel safe. At the moment she's having to take charge in her 6-year-old way because you're not doing the job she needs you to do. The shouting and being rude to you is a way of her trying to find the boundaries. It's terrifying for a child when no one is in charge.

You and your husband need to step up and be the adults. She doesn't have to like or be happy with your rules but you do have to be in charge. She can't expect to be happy or get her own way all the time. We all, even when we are only six, need to learn that we can't always get what we want. She needs you to do this for her. Take control.

Hmmmm, she may be tired, but just saying she is ‘not tired’ to try to avoid it.

I would definitely create the boundaries as others suggested.. Id also want to feel into why she is behaving this way, as I’m sure you are. I don’t believe she, or other children are just ‘naughty’.. she’s having emotions, causing her to feel and behave this way.

Again, when I was a child, I was told I had to stay in my room at night or a lock would be put on my door. It was such a desolate experience. My mother would give me orange juice at night to drink and leave on the bedside table (such a strange thing to do I think.) Though I’d never wet myself, sometimes I used to pour it on the bed and pretend I’d done so. My father would only allow her to come in, if I’d wet myself. I did this many times. I mentioned it years later and she said she never knew it was orange juice on the bed. I find that quite unbelievable. It seems we lived in quite an abusive situation, but it’s hard for me to know clearly.. as I was a child.

All this makes me remember how scary bedtime was for me, nightmares as well. I really have empathy for children scared at night. I’m sure / hope / boundaries and understanding will help your daughter and you both!

Also, we need to go to bed, whether we feel actively tired or not 😊

When you say 'parenting'....

You're being sent to bed by a six year old? Good grief! This kid needs to learn that your family is not a democracy. You are tolerating her calling you names, fgs. This isn't working, is it? Show her that there are consequences to bad behaviour. (Take away devices, use the naughty step, do whatever is safe and works for you.) If you don't, you're raising your kid to be a tyrant.

@op what were the methods your parents employed that made you feel unable to go to them? Was it shame? Was it emotional unavailability? Because for me, gentle parenting isn't about never saying no or never telling them off, but it's about not using shame or emotional manipulation as parenting techniques. You can absolutely parent authoritatively AND avoid creating a parent/child relationship like the one you grew up with. You sound very emotionally supportive of your daughter, now I think some of the practical stuff like making clear your lines in the sand on behaviour and bedtime will actually strengthen your relationship rather than damage it.

Could you try “in room” rather than “in bed?” I gave my poor parents hell at bedtime due to not being tired, because I…wasn’t tired. I’ve never needed a lot of sleep. My Mum eventually just made it a rule that I had to be in my bedroom and quiet from 8pm. They still got their evening and I could read or play or listen to tapes (showing my age!) quietly. Sanity was restored, no more bedtime arguments happened and I’m now 34 and still only sleep 5-6 hours a night.

This reads as though you get excited about the prospect of exercising that kind of power to frighten and upset a 6 year old child? Do you? Does it make you feel excited to think of the OP's child being really distraught? Or perhaps it is the thought of OP getting upset by your comment calling her child "nasty brat" that you are salivating over...

Are you for real?

I have a 6 year old daughter too. She is very emotional, highly strung and tends to totally lose control. I found the book The Explosive Child very helpful. If traditional adult imposed consequences just turn into an escalating power struggle, the book suggests ways to work as a team to help children meet expectations instead. It is based on the idea that children do well (behave) if they can. They know you are the boss and don’t want or enjoy conflict but they lack the skills to respond appropriately to demands. I have found it extremely helpful, and I feel comfortable with the approach as someone who is not a natural tough disciplinarian, but wants to raise a respectful and kind teen in the future.

Do you think she's frightened or has nightmares? I was terrified of a variety of supernatural things at 6 years old (I must have inadvertently watched a kids' TV programme that was aimed at 10 year olds) and my mother used to have to stay on the landing outside with my door open and the landing light on. She used to do a bit of ironing (!) and I was comforted by the squeak of the ironing board and could then go to sleep.
I think your DD's "meanie mummy" is because she's scared

My children all hated bedtime. They were frightened of missing something. I used to do bath, stories, kisses, cuddles then left them to it. They understood that they could read, have a little play in their room but the mummy time was finished. Worked great once they got the hang of it. Generally they looked at a book and drifted off. They only really got up and came to get me if they felt unwell.

You are permissive parents not gentle parents. Gentle parenting is parenting without screaming or verbally abusing your child and not hitting them, but using age appropriate consequences. You are permissive. Your child rules the roost. If my 4yr old told me what to do I would laugh and say no. If he screamed he would be told off. Abuse would be a telling off too. Seriously get a backbone and parent your child.