to think maybe its ok and actually quite normal to not have close friends?

[Anothernameschange]

Read a lot of posts on here about friends not being genuine, caring, on there as good time friends etc etc and seeing all the expectations of lifelong close friendships I've realised I don't actually have many...if any I could categorise as the seeing regularly /almost like family category that other people have.

Now don't get me wrong I am not trying to do a woe is me post - though I would be lying if I said this has never upset me - but now that I'm older, almost 40 and handling a small family etc I realise I struggle to find the time to see even one friend regularly let alone a big group like you see on social media.

So my thought is that maybe now, esp post covid, people in my situation don't have friends and actually its more common than most people think.

Yes. The post about the single mum who needs to have an operation but doesnt have a single friend she can ask for childcare was very sad.
This " my little family' I see on MN is so unwise. Men leave. Some even after 25 years.

I don't think it's normal or desirable. I've got friends I made at school over 50 years ago as well as others I picked up along the way through work. I've always made time to see them, even when I had children and still go out with them in different groups. I can't imagine what it must be like to not have any. I also agree with the person who said it's not a good idea to put all your emotional eggs in one basket.

@Whyareyoulikethat

This topic comes up regularly on here. It always makes me sad when people make out that a woman with no friends must be very weird and unlikable.

With kindness, though, I think you've read this wrong.

It's completely understandable that people find friendship difficult, for a variety of reasons. Everyone sometimes struggles with this. In your situation it's particularly understandable.

What alarms some of us is the normalisation of the idea that it's not desirable for women to have friends and that it's optimal to not have them. Fining it hard to make and keep friendships is common and natural but it doesn't follow from that that friendship is inherently bad or a waste of time. It's surprisingly common on here for people to post that they've been "let down" so many times by friends that they no longer bother etc. As if the idea of friendship itself was the problem, not the fact that the individual friends were dicks.

I just feel that however difficult life can be and however hard friendships can be, it's really important to hang onto the idea that friends can be life enhancing. Retreating into a tiny world with no one except your husband and children is dangerous an we all owe it to ourselves to work on having other frames of reference in their life outside the family.

Yes friends can sometimes be arseholes and let you down and it can be difficult for us. But that doesn't mean the solution is to be completely alone except for being with your spouse.

I think life is better, more fun and more secure when you have your people. To laugh with, talk to and who you know will support you when you need it. Whether this is your best friend from school, a big group of 'girls', your immediate family, extended family or an eclectic mix of randoms you've gathered along the way, doesn't matter.

@BooomShakeTheRoom The same as if your friends moved away, stopped being available, fell out with you etc. You’d make new friends.

But it's not always that easy to make new friends as you get older. Lots of people work from home now which makes it less easy to form friendships through work. Friends moving away doesn't mean you stop being friends.

I see 'friends' 2-3 times a year, normally someone's birthday we all get together but thats it. I don't have time with DH, 3 growing up boys, 2 (soon to be 3) grandchildren work, parents with early stages of Alzheimers and dementia.

I have a friend who I have not seen for years and we keep saying we are going to meet up but to be honest I think we both keep putting it off because we don't like socialising anymore lol

The main reason I am finding it hard to make friends is that I now WFH- can't change this in this climate- and DC are grown, so school gate friends have drifted or left London.

I listened to a podcast by Mel Robbins on this. She's a bit too American but she does make sense. She says friendships depend on proximity and need at least 100 hours. I don't spend that much time with people any more now I WFH and am not at the school gate. I have joined a lot of hobby groups, but those are more good acquaintances. I guess it takes time.

I also find it quite odd that people find it easier to find a husband than to make friends. I have been married nearly 30 years and I find marriage tough sometimes. How can it be otherwise really when it has to meet so many criteria? I find friends easier because I am not sleeping with them or having children with them or sharing finances with them!

Loneliness is proven to be a killer, there have been reports about this in the media over the last couple of years.

@UninterestingFirstPost Is very much a real introvert, likes socialising but does not need to all the time and needs time to recharge. The issue is people on MN mix up being an introvert with being quite frankly anti social or socially anxious and they are all different.

I have three friends divorcing currently, I spent Boxing Day evening with one because her kids were going to their Dads. We ate and drank too much, laughed and cried. I was there for her when she needed me as she has been for me. Friends are great for the good and bad times.

I have a lot of sisters and I’m in touch with some of my friends more than some of my sisters. Myself and one sister have a lot in common, 2 are sweet and very lovely but I have no common interests with them and one is evil personified. I would have chosen one sister as a close friend. I think that’s why so many families have issues they have enforced time together.

No, I don’t think that is the most common reason, or anywhere near. Judging by the significant numbers of people on Mn who claim to be without friends, the most common reasons include the following: social awkwardness, losing the use of their ‘social muscle’ for some reason or never having used it in the first place, dropping friends to retreat inside ‘my little family’ under the impression this is a normal or inevitable life stage, generalising, based on very limited experience, that all friendships involve ‘drama’, being the kind of person who defaults to their sofa and Netflix, only leaving the house if absolutely necessary, having a very negative view of the rest of humanity, poor self-esteem, those who engage in people-pleasing relationships etc.

I wish I had more siblings. Silly old mum stopped at 2 DC because apparently she couldn't afford any more. Stupid reason if you ask me.😏( this is a joke). I really do miss my sister who is in another country.

I used to have lots of friends but the numbers have dwindled. I had a couple of years where I didn’t realise I was being used by a group of friends for childcare and when I got sick and couldn’t help them they all dropped me.
I was really hopeful last year when I met someone lovely last year, our children are similar ages and have the same hobbies. I supported her through a marriage breakdown and the loss of a relative. However earlier this year I received some hard news and text her hoping for some support. She completely ignored me and now ignores me at the children’s activities. I’m really hurt so doubt I’ll bother with anyone again.

I have one friend and it's a guy I knew from work. I don't have any female friends despite trying.

Who do you send funny cat videos to if you have no friends at all?

Jokes aside, I don't meet up with my two close friends as much as I used to but we speak every day. Life wouldn't be the same without them. I hate meeting in big groups now I'm older, I'd avoid that if I could!

I don't know if it's normal and I don't care.
What I learned through life is that you can only ever truly rely on yourself.
Humans are flaky, they can change their mind anytime about anything.

I don't meet up in person with my friends as much as I used to but as a group we all chat every day. With kids, the logistics of those 'are you free for a quick drink' days are gone so it takes a lot more planning to actually see them but having been through an awful break up with ex DP when my son was a baby, I couldn't have got through it without them

I have 2 sisters who I would consider to be my best friends. In turn this has made 2/3 of us really 'lazy' friends when it comes to other relationships.

I'm ok with just having them. We socialise together, our partners get on really well outside of the BIL relationship and they even socialise together.

I think it's ok, as long as you have what you need in whatever relationships you have. Could be partners/children/siblings/friends. Doesn't matter.

I think it's very easy for anyone to lose friends even if they themselves have good social skills and a positive can do attitude. Between all the people who no longer feel able to maintain contact due to their mental health, those who move away for work and those who feel they have to ring-fence weekends for "family time" in order to be good mothers it's very easy to lose people.

I don’t have 1 friend, I have my teenagers and parents thats it. Been single for many years so no other half and friends I did have when I was younger have drifted apart for one reason or another. it honestly doesn’t bother me and I don’t even think about it, happy to do my own thing.

I have a close group of friends, some from childhood and others we’ve picked up along the way at Uni, etc. I do feel very lucky to have them, the time I spend with them is extra special to me these days as it’s such a great break away from the kids, where free time can be that bit more fleeting. A few of them have moved away, but we still plan weekend trips together at least twice a year. Friendships do require effort on all sides to maintain.
I have also made some good ‘mum’ friends too since having kids, there’s a small group of 5 of us and they’ve become such good friends we go on holidays together etc. But again, we all really put the effort in when we first met at baby groups - you can’t be afraid of ‘making the first move’!

@HamSpray

No, I don’t think that is the most common reason, or anywhere near. Judging by the significant numbers of people on Mn who claim to be without friends, the most common reasons include the following: social awkwardness, losing the use of their ‘social muscle’ for some reason or never having used it in the first place, dropping friends to retreat inside ‘my little family’ under the impression this is a normal or inevitable life stage, generalising, based on very limited experience, that all friendships involve ‘drama’, being the kind of person who defaults to their sofa and Netflix, only leaving the house if absolutely necessary, having a very negative view of the rest of humanity, poor self-esteem, those who engage in people-pleasing relationships etc.

Absolutely this: there's a difference between struggling with friendships but continuing to try anyway and this very fixed mindset which says: "I have the husband, tick, can now step off the social roundabout, never really enjoyed it anyway".

A lot of people seem to regard having friendships as a kind of intermediate stopgap stage which you engage in in order to meet more blokes before creating "my little family" and then happy wash their hands of them.

I am genuinely shocked on here at how many people seem to think that friends are a weird added extra which most people can do without once they have "my little family" but it seems to be surprisingly prevalent.

It's partly poor self-esteem but I think it's also a way of seeing the world which dictates that husband and family is always the ultimate loyalty and the rest is window dressing.

Not the point, I know, but quite a lot of MNers seem to refer to a ‘friend’ who is more like an acquaintance they don’t really like, because of CF-ery or otherwise generally arse-ish behaviour.

It does often mean they stop being close friends in my experience though. Single people need friends because otherwise they’d often not speak to an adult in a meaningful way outside of work at all. People in relationships have someone already very close to talk about meaningful things.

Romantic relationships end as do friendship. In the last 20 years, I have one friend who’s been a constant, my husband, and my family. I have lots of friends who have come and gone.

I think it’s more and more common, people live further apart for various reasons, people are busier than ever, finances are low for many, I only have a couple of close friends that I can truly be myself with, I’m not hugely social anyway and need my own space. but I see them less and less. I would like to see them more but it’s hard to make plans that match up. I am a bit lonely sometimes but finding friends over 40 is hard, I used to meet a lot of people on dog walks (no dog now) or school gates (now no school run) and I don’t meet many people through work…

Yes, I think that last point is probably absolutely right.

And the ‘friends as stopgap till I find a chap to make my little family with’ mindset goes some way to explaining why there are so many fraught posts on here about not managing to make ‘mummy friends’ at baby and toddler groups, or ‘exclusions’ and ‘cliques’ on the school run.

These are women who stepped gladly off the social roundabout after they married/started a committed relationship, and are now confronted with new child-focused social situations in which other adults are demonstrably making and maintaining friendships, and they feel they’re supposed to, too, but their social muscle is under-exercised.

It probably also goes some way to explaining how fraught many bridesmaid/hen party posts are, if some people view these events as the literal last hurrah of their friendships before the bride retreats inside ‘my own little family’.

And yes, absolutely, to this. A recently-arrived alien learning about human language and customs through the sole medium of Mn would conclude that ‘friend ’ means ‘someone I know whom I don’t like much and who frequently behaves unpleasantly, but with whom I nonetheless socialise’.