To use the men's toilets when the ladies is busy

[Everythingisnumbersnow]

A poster on another thread suggests this is unreasonably but I don't see why.

I use the men’s at work near reception. It’s an individual toilet. I’ve also witnessed men using the ladies toilets when the men’s has been busy. As long as you’re not pissing on the corridor, I don’t give a shiny shit where you piss.

I did this at the O2 last year thinking I was VERY clever. I had to squat over the toilet as it was filthy and managed to pee all over myself. Won't do it again. Had to watch The Killers covered in my own pee hoping desperately that I didn't smell

It's what I meant by "taking into account my own feelings and what I believe most people around me would do)."

I could rephrase "taking into account my own feelings and what I believe the feeling of most people around me are"

Our actions (what we do) are based on what we feel.

I do value other people's feelings, and those are conveyed to me by their actions (broadly speaking). I'd have to ask them if I wanted to know how they felt.

No. Because that would have a significant impact on my rights and those of other women so would be a situation where defiance of a rule would be justified. Using the mens toilet in a climate where there is a fight to protect single sex facilities simply because its inconvenient for me to wait isn't remotely the same.

I’m not particularly bothered for myself, I am more concerned about the cleanliness of the facilities than who is using them, although men’s toilets are likely to be less clean some women have questionable hygiene too. However I can understand some women do need safe women only spaces and think men should too. My dp often comes out of a public toilet saying he couldn’t go, he’s never said it’s because a woman was in there but it’s wrong to assume that men aren’t bothered. That’s when he relents to my suggestion of going to M&s for a wee.

This can't be real. Months of threads about male in female spaces and now you are advocating for females going into male spaces. Talk about having your cake and eating it.
If men are a risk in female toilets, why go in to theirs? You can't have it both ways. Either they're a risk and you need separate spaces, or they arent and you don't.

Protecting safe spaces for woman (and men) doesn't mean that facilities for mixing should not exist.
There should be spaces for everyone : women only, men only, men and women, unicorns.

All of them should be clean.

I mean I'm not going to disagree with that 😅

But by that theory, its a choice then if you go into a mixed space or single. But we have seen time and time on here the sentiment that the problem with the NAMALT theory is that you can't pick out the nice ones. So how do you know when you go into a men's space or a mixed space that youl only be with the nice ones?
Presumably the OP does this because she doesn't want to wait. But that gives the idea that your need to use the toilet is higher than your safety.
If its just a single toilet, like some workplaces, absolutely. Go for it. But I can't believe anybody is saying it's okay for women to go into men's toilets.

No more entitled than expecting women to wait 15 or 30 mins for the toilet in case a man should want to use it.

Just don't use the men's, it's simpler I don't. I don't know where you got the idea that I did.

If women can go in the men's toilet then it defeats the argument for having segregated toilets. Women (generally) don't want men to enter the women's toilets because they feel threatened. If men are a threat to women in women's toilets, they are an equal or greater threat to women in men's toilets, given there is a high probability of a man being in there, there is legitimate reason for them to have their penis out, and there is no particular suspicion directed to them simply for being there. A man hanging around in a women's toilet waiting to trap a victim immediately raises concern if a passer-by walks in. A man in a men's toilet probably still looks odd if they are just hanging about, but will probably be ignored by other men who will just assume they are a drug-dealer or gay man looking for "action" rather than waiting to pounce on the woman who is using the cubible at the end, should the chance arise.

Use them if you really need to go, and have your excuse ready if questioned. From my long experience of using men's toilets I can clarify that most people do not walk around 'with their dicks out'. Not sure what toilets people in these comments have been checking out.

no one is expecting a woman to wait 15 or 30 mins. Why not take it up with the women who are lingering in the loo?

Even when I have my periods, it doesn't take me 30 - or even 10 - minutes to sort myself out. I don't think the females in my house use the toilets for longer than the boys...Most toilets don't have a private sink and mirror in each cubicle either.

It's highly amusing that men are now getting the blame for the queue in women's toilets 😂. That's an interesting reverse of things!

I don't think most women recognise such a fight tbh

Just so we're clear:

17 yr old transboy in a wig and make up using the ladies = terrifying threat who prevents me using the loo.
Load of drunk blokes at a concert in the gents = No threat at all, happily use the loo with them.
Unisex loos = why I voted for Trump.

(For the avoidance of doubt I don't want men in my loo and I don't think I'm entitled to use theirs)

No you shouldn't. Men need privacy as well.

I'm not a hypocrite.

Men need to stay out of women's spaces, so we should stay out of theirs.

Yes, we are much, much less of a threat to them than they are to us and yes, women statistically will have been attacked and assaulted far more than men (so there isn't the same emotional impact on them seeing us in their toilet) ... But we will never win this fight if we stoop to double standards.

I couldn't comment having seen no research into the views of 'most women' on the subject. Presumably you have to lead you to say that?

your actually asking this OP

I agree partly.

However that's not the only point. People are focusing on the impact of men seeing women in their toilet, we are all agreed it's not as big a threat (although I would argue it leads them wide open to accusations of things. And before anyone comes at me, I know its very rare for an accusation to be false and the difficulty in convictions, but the point remains).

The point is, you can't keep men out of your space because they're a threat to you...and then walk into theirs!!

If it’s an individual one vs open plan- I see no issues. Especially if there are no men in sight (eg I use the men’s when I’m at my nail salon and all clients at the time are women; or there’s a line up of women and no men- I pop into the men’s)

The root of this issue is that, when public toilets are being designed the space allocated to the gents/ladies invariably is cut in half, when really the ladies needs more space for more cubicals.

Unfortunately that's the hand we've been dealt. The fact is, you can't simultaneously make the very valid argument that women require a safe space to use the toilet and also make the argument that it's perfectly fine for women to use the men's facilities. You just can't.

Firstly, men have the same right to privacy as women, and secondly you can't claim that it's not safe to allow men into a female facility but happily enter a facility full of dangerous men because there is a bit of a queue in your safe space.

Spot on.

It wouldn't bother me.

I wouldn't like a man to use the women's if the men's is busy, so I don't think you should, no.

Those facilities are for men. They deserve to not have you in there.