to think DS's girlfriend is taking the piss and he needs legal advice

[redwingparty]

Keeping this short as I don't want DS to be outed, though I could write a very long post about this woman, but the main thing is:

DS2 has just bought a flat, his girlfriend has moved in and she is not paying him rent. She is lazy by nature (stayed with us at Christmas but refused to help prep food, lay the table or clear up afterwards because she 'didn't want to'; she spent most of her time in bed) She has just started a MW job and I overheard her say to DS that since he was not charging her anything to live with him, she will only do three days a week.

DS has a long commute, long hours and two second casual jobs at weekends.

I am worried that he will get fed up of her sponging off him but be unable to get her to leave the flat legally if it is her main home. What rights does she have?

Also she mentioned setting up a sideline business of her own from the spare bedroom of the flat which would involve strangers coming into the house. DS1 told me this is probably illegal and against the lease, and could invalidate the contents insurance. But I think DS would find it hard to say no to her (which in itself is a bit of a problem - he idolises her and she puts him down very subtly but frequently).

AIBU to think we should get some legal advice about her housing rights and rights to operate a small business (similar to hairdressing) from the flat?

Not me, she said this to another family member when they asked her to help as she was the only one who hadn't. I wasn't in the room. But apparently there was a bit of a row. I had no idea anyone else thought she was a lazy freeloader. It was my private opinion until someone else mentioned it.

Ok but I think you’re unusual. If staying for several days as a guest it’s extremely rude to not offer help around meal times.

You really need to speak to your son. Not sure what you can do if he is happy with this arrangement.

Also when you said “she did not want to help out” do you mean you asked and that was her response?

That’s astonishingly rude if so.

But ensuring he doesn't unintentionally void his contents insurance or fall foul of his lease or end up having to let someone freeload indefinitely is just being a responsible parent giving advice that comes from experience

Has he asked for your advice? Yes it's hard when you see them making mistakes, but he is a grown man. I have a similar age dc and only give advice when asked. Otherwise, it may just be seen as interfering.

The real concern is that he seems to be in an abusive relationship. She may try to isolate him from you and the wider family, especially if she sees you as interfering. It's heartbreaking, but you need to tread softly and keep the lines of communication open.

It depends what the son who lives with her wants. Not you or your other son

and so?

Thank you. I agree - I won't say or do anything that seems like a direct attack on her.

I am Mum to a young 20-something Ds and I would hate this, OP.

I would be more worried about his self esteem, being exploited , being put down and unable to assert himself than legalities about living in his flat.

I would I think find ways to compliment him on his very hard work / work ethic.

But also find a way to say that equality is important in a relationship , and it should not feel as if one person is doing all the heavy lifting, finance wise or household chores.

And that self esteem is important. It isn't good that she puts him down.

I sometimes wonder whether some sensitive young men are not sure where to draw boundaries and feel compelled to 'support' CF girlfriends rather than risk being controlling / possessive etc . Probably a controversial POV.

Has he got a sister that could impart some blunt observations from the POV of a young woman?

English property law is bonkers in lots of ways - the Scottish system for buying and selling properties for example makes much more sense!

Yes. Do it. He's blinded by love and this has red flags all over it

MW job - insulting term to show that someone is not capable of earning more than 11.44 per hour

I think for alot of people, it’s usual for family guests to help out. And so OP is treating her like family - obviously in the assumption everyone else helped out too!

For example if I was at my parents’ or aunt’s house I’d offer to help in any way needed with food, laying the table etc, and would clear stuff up as and when needed without being asked, as though I was at home.

Wouldn’t presume to do that in non family houses of course - I would offer but usually people say no.

Oh sorry - I totally misunderstood that and wondered how on earth someone who had trained as a midwife could be considered inherently lazy!

Well, I'm not a trad wife. If I have guests for Christmas, all of them adults, and I have already cleaned the house and made up extra beds and baked and made puddings and bought all the food and wrapped loads of extra presents, then I expect those able-bodied adults to offer to lay the table or clear the table or unload the dishwasher or scrub a pan for the week they are staying with me. I'm not an unpaid servant to a bunch of twenty-something adults.

Absolutely. This is how adult heterosexual relationships work and start. He earns more, he pays, she does a little bit on the side, she gets pregnant, they got kids. What a hateful post to make against your eventual DIL - when you did get married, did you disclose your financial set up to the in laws. My effing MIL made a dig and my husband told her to shut up. She herself used her first husband life insurance to pay off her second husband's debt and buy a house, leaving her boys with nothing. Repent of your own dirt before throwing dirt at a very young lady

I would call her out
just say hi Gf please can you lay the table mash /the spuds/ empty dishwasher.. in this house we all help out.. we're not a restaurant and if you want to be part of our family then please join in..

You are right about English leasehold law. It sucks.