to think DS's girlfriend is taking the piss and he needs legal advice

[redwingparty]

Keeping this short as I don't want DS to be outed, though I could write a very long post about this woman, but the main thing is:

DS2 has just bought a flat, his girlfriend has moved in and she is not paying him rent. She is lazy by nature (stayed with us at Christmas but refused to help prep food, lay the table or clear up afterwards because she 'didn't want to'; she spent most of her time in bed) She has just started a MW job and I overheard her say to DS that since he was not charging her anything to live with him, she will only do three days a week.

DS has a long commute, long hours and two second casual jobs at weekends.

I am worried that he will get fed up of her sponging off him but be unable to get her to leave the flat legally if it is her main home. What rights does she have?

Also she mentioned setting up a sideline business of her own from the spare bedroom of the flat which would involve strangers coming into the house. DS1 told me this is probably illegal and against the lease, and could invalidate the contents insurance. But I think DS would find it hard to say no to her (which in itself is a bit of a problem - he idolises her and she puts him down very subtly but frequently).

AIBU to think we should get some legal advice about her housing rights and rights to operate a small business (similar to hairdressing) from the flat?

Thank you. I want to do something like this. Im aware it is none of my business. At the same time...I was in a disastrous relationship in my early twenties. It left me really scarred and wary of men with rock bottom self esteem. Turned out my parents loathed him but thought 'they'd better not say anything'. At the time I felt they just didn't care enough to warn me off and if they had, it might have saved me months of deep and secret unhappiness. It's tricky, when you can see someone is a leech and a bully. Should you say something or not?

I suspect posters criticising the OP don't have adult DC in potentially abusive relationships and can't imagine what it is like to have that worry.

Interesting, can you somehow throw that story into a conversation without making any expression link to his situation, see if it gets him thinking?

Thank you. That is a lovely and helpful message. He is in his twenties.

That's a good idea. I could do that at some point. Not considered it but it might be worth a try.

I think this may be the case. He needs to check.

You can get a document from the mortgage company that she can sign to waive all rights to the property. He could spin that he needs to have it for his mortgage as my previous mortgage that was one of the terms of my agreement.

He needs to work on boundaries and pushing back. Things he’s also need to progress in work to enable him to cut the other jobs lose. Also says a lot about her she’s wanting to work 3 days a week whilst knowing he has 3 jobs to pay for everything.

In general, I agree with you. But not when it comes to manipulative or coercive behaviour. Then I think we have a duty to intervene with loved ones of any age, before they are in too deep. It's cold blooded to stand by and watch anyone sink too deep into a really unhealthy relationship. Why would anyone do that? There's a difference between interfering and showing concern. That's the balance I want to find.

This is a reasonable idea. I've always said being a parent demands the skills of UN diplomat especially when your child is no longer a child, except in your own eyes.

If you can talk to your offspring about most things, it's often possible to introduce subjects that are resonant but couldn't necessarily be construed as directly personal to said offspring.

In an ideal world, direct honesty is supposed to be ideal, but sometimes it just generates defensiveness, and completely shuts down communication.

Once again I wish you well OP - it's really hard to strike the balance between guidance and interference, and sometimes it's impossible. But you know your son best, and I'm sure you'll know the best way to reach him. We all just want the best for our children, always, but they also have to learn to navigate relationships and all aspects of adult life, and we have to learn to let them.

I thought that but DS1 said this isn't true. If it is her primary home, her address where mail is sent etc, she could have tenants' rights even if she's not paying rent. I think I need to find out about this in case he ever needs advice on it.

You and your nunya friends might stop caring about your children the minute they turn 18, the rest of us don't 🤷‍♀️

Thank you. I am aware that my desire to sort things out stems from when he was younger and had an absolutely horrendous time which left him very fragile. He needed a lot of support and we became very close at a time when most teenagers are pulling away from their parents.

The article is behind a paywall, but I will read up on similar information

Nunya? What the hell you talking about?

You don't know me and how I care for my adult children. I'm actually the opposite of what you seem to be assuming, which is how I know what I'm talking about.

It is completely possible to still care and worry and want to help without overstepping boundaries of adults who aren't even asking for said help.

Can you the next time you see him say you were listening to something about toxic relationships and had you ever told him
about that awful one you had when you were young? Tell him it all, then leave it and draw no comparisons. Then he knows if he wants to share misgivings with you he can without judgement, but either way it gives him something to think about.

Ask one of your older children, if you in fact have any.

Being concerned isn't overstepping any boundary at all! Acting on that concern might be overstepping a boundary which is why I asked for opinions here. I have no intention of wading in and being judgemental.

But ensuring he doesn't unintentionally void his contents insurance or fall foul of his lease or end up having to let someone freeload indefinitely is just being a responsible parent giving advice that comes from experience. I don't think that sort of advice is intrusive if it's done really tactfully and subtly - with the emphasis on him checking these things for himself.

Leasehold flat

I’m imagining OP hiding behind curtains, ready to throw contraception at them in the appropriate moment.

It would be a hell of a mood killer anyway so very effective.

I’d be stabbing her in the arse with the injectable pill as she walked past in the hallway if it was me
Dreading my son getting to this stage

You can't have "tenant's rights" without paying rent.

Lodgers or flat mates sharing a house with the owner and paying rent don't have "tenants rights"

She is lazy by nature (stayed with us at Christmas but refused to help prep food, lay the table or clear up afterwards because she 'didn't want to';

I don't expect guests to do this. I think it's really quite odd to expect guests to help "prep" food. [Irrelevant to the thread but I can't stand the word "prep"]

If this was my son I’d be very worried too. I wouldn’t stand by and let my Dd be taken advantage of in this or any other way. I’ve seen several examples of parents standing back “there’s nothing I can do” and it’s been disastrous for their adult child and if children come into the mix, it’s disastrous for them too.