Lunch with another woman

[Lyingisnotok]

NC for this.

My partner has a female friend. She has a long term partner. DP and her have known each other a couple of years. We have been in a relationship for over a year and are moving in together.

During the first few months of our relationship I didn’t meet her but was fine with them being friends. They went on a pre booked holiday together (twin room). He checked if it was ok for him to go and I was fine with it. No worries at all. Honestly trust him and felt genuinely fine about it.

A couple of months ago I finally met her, along with her partner and few others. She flirted with my DP a lot (ridiculous hair twirling, giggling, dominated his time - if you had looked in without knowing us all you’d assume they were together).

She largely ignored me. Made no effort at all. She responded to my attempts at conversation with her but then shut them down. Her partner and I exchanged a couple of glances as if to say ‘are you ok with this?’.

After that I calmly asked DP if he could only meet her when me and her partner are there as it felt uncomfortable for me the thought of her flirting with him without me there. I trust him not to take it anywhere but it just felt uncomfortable. He was a bit annoyed thinking I didn’t trust him but did agree as he could see my view.

I then found out recently he’d met her for lunch alone. I found out because he’d let something slip and so I asked and he answered. He wouldn’t lie directly but has lied through omission I think.

I was upset. He got cross. He doesn’t think I should make this request of him, he doesn’t think he’s done anything wrong.

AIBU?

Ignore the poster saying you're the red flag. You've been very clear about how this particular woman makes you feel, and you're not wrong.

I don’t think it is ridiculous. If one of my male friends met my partner for the first time and pretty much snubbed him and then flirted with me, I’d totally get why it would make him uncomfortable. I’d have clocked it and mitigated it at the time but had I missed it and my partner expressed discomfort I’d have adapted. I’d have empathy. I’d certainly not hide a lunch meet. I’d have told him that I’d decided the friendship was imposed we need 1-1 time and would have been empathic but firm.

It's a deal breaker.
You don't like Miss Flirty as she makes plays for your man and you don't want to experience that.
Fair enough.

Explain to partner that you find Miss Flirty too hard to deal with and if he doen't want to acknowledge your very real feelings for very real reasons then you can not move in with him.

Consider asking your partner to speak with Miss Flirty's husband and ask whether he finds the behaviour of his wife acceptable and comfortable to be around.

Surely your partner doesn't want to disrespect her husband and you just to appease an infatuated old friend.

You are so right. Thank you. I’m ok. Thank you 🙏

Thank you all. It’s really helpful to have objective eyes on this. So easy to doubt your own judgement sometimes. Love MN for this!! The wonderful wisdom of women.

Mumsnet is not objective. People on here shout LTB for the tiniest of things. It's a sport for some to make men look as bad as possible and break up relationships. I'm sure there's genuine posters here, but I would never make a life-changing decision from mumsnet advice. Particularly in AIBU.

So she was mooning over him and flirting up a storm while ignoring you and her uncomfortable partner. You set your reasonable boundaries and he agreed to nix their 1:1 meet-ups. This, however, was lip service on his part, as he felt entitled to break your agreement and hide that from you. He’s now being defensive because you called him out on lying by omission.

@Lyingisnotok, he is clearly in her thrall, and is lying that he doesn’t notice her flirting/adoration and rudeness toward you. Lapping up the validation she provides is his priority.

Lying and subterfuge are dealbreakers for me. I would leave them to it.

I don't believe for a second he's oblivious to her flirting. No way.

While I don’t think the request to not be alone was controlling- why does it need to be there in the first place? You don’t trust one or the other or both to be alone together? Listen to your gut.

He has no boundary with her re being ‘ok’ with the flirting and in the presence of partners - where is his actual boundary?

Lying by omission - further erosion of trust

What really got me though was he was angry at you for something he had done and did not take responsibility for it or handle it respectfully towards you - would this apply to other situations eg spending/decision making more broadly.

There is a third wheel here and personally that would not be for me.

Golly, that's tricky. On one hand I am absolutely against dictating friendships. On the other hand, I am very uncomfortable about lying by omission. The right thing to do for him surely would have been to say no to your request at the time. Not to say yes to appease you and then cover up that he actually had no intention to do what you asked him to do.
Personally, I would be having a conversation with him explaining the above. That I am sorry about asking him not to see his friend, it was out of line. However, I would have expected him to be honest with me if he couldn't accommodate my request so that we both knew where we were. And then try to move forward in an open and honest way. If he is unable to do that, I would possibly be ending the relationship because there is nothing worse than double-guessing your partner.

My take would be that he wants a relationship with her. She knows this and likes the power. Likes being the most important one in his like and having him on the back burner
I have close male friends. I don't flirt or play with their hair and they know my partner is important to me
He will always run to her imo

It’s upsetting you because he’s not being honest; he’s being sneaky.

And the reason that’s a problem is because you can’t trust him. You’re saying you do trust him, but you either don’t, or you shouldn’t. This isn’t a guy being upfront with you.

On MN there is a real backlash against people not trusting. It’s used as an insult, I think because of the small demographic of people who are genuinely neurotic and deeply controlling, and who can’t stomach the notion of their partner having to interact with the opposite sex at all.

But not trusting someone with reason is a natural defence mechanism to stop us walking into traps. Not wanting your partner to be out at lunch alone with a hair twirling, eyelash flapping “friend” who largely ignored you and whose partner also was also clearly made uncomfortable by her behaviour is not the same thing at all. Add to that the fact you explained that her interaction style made you uncomfortable, and he agreed not to see her alone, and you have a situation where he is blatantly prioritising his time with this woman over both his respect for your feelings and the undertaking he has given. It’s also only come out because he let it slip, not because he thought you were overstepping and he was not going to be controlled. If he didn’t like your request, he should have said so, rather than agreeing but then doing it behind your back regardless.

Do not move in with this man: he’s a sneak and lacks the backbone to say no to either of you.

She sounds unpleasant. Who behaves like this anyway, never mind when partners are present? And I agree with you op, I do not like the hiding things, that is what causes concern. I don’t think you can demand he doesn’t see her. You can demand he is honest about it though. And the truth is, he wants to see her even though he knows it makes you uncomfortable. Do you want to move in with someone like that? I wouldn’t.

This is not for you Op and you deserve better. This is not about him having a female friend, this is about him having 'this' female friend. there is more to this or will be further down the line. Trust the evidence before you and stop thinking YABU. You are being gaslighted. Don't waste anymore time.

My OH and I have been together for a long time but in the beginning there was an ex who wanted to remain friends. I wasn't used to that but they'd ended amicably and before I met her I wasn't too bothered.

However I did then meet her and her behaviour was below my standard and was very disrespectful.

I was, by then, very invested in my relationship but this friendship wasn't one I was willing to see as part of my future.
I had the conversation, it's her or me. I'd rather my OH had nipped it in the bud without my interference but it was a long time ago and we've never seen her since.

She did kick off and make it seem like I was insecure etc, to be expected, but my boundaries are my boundaries.

My OH was fine with it, but I'd have bailed on the relationship if it hadn't gone my way.
That friendship just wasn't that important to miss out on the amazing relationship we have.
If she'd acted respectfully I wouldn't have had an issue but she couldn't and thought she'd get away with it. Hopefully a valuable lesson for her wherever she ended up.

Hey OP, there’s some batshit crazy advice/responses on here. As a guy, I can assure you that such overt flirting is noticed (unless your partner has ASD). It’s an ego boost.

Most (every?) affairs starts with relaxed boundaries. In my view, the capacity to have an affair exists due to those relaxed boundaries (on the whole). I’m guessing you may think the same.

All those cool kids on here who shoulder shrug…whatever.

I guess the question arising out of that is: now that he sees why her behaviour is concerning, what is he doing about it? Did he, for instance, shut down any flirting during the lunch? Did he take the chance to talk a lot about you and/or her partner, and make it clear that their relationship was never going to be more than a friendship?

I think they both enjoy the thrill of flirting in front of their partners and openly keeping each other as Plan B.. This combined with the lying would be too much for me
You deserve better.

…but was she flirting with him ? Maybe they were chatting and laughing like old friends do, and you didn’t like feeling excluded, so have decided it was “flirting” to justify your own behaviours, in wanting to control who he sees, and when he sees them.

Why should she have to be friends with you?

“He wouldn’t lie directly but has lied through omission I think.”

Well, he lied when he said he wouldn’t meet up with her, so yes he has lied directly.

Does he enjoy the attention?

It’s never polite to exclude people present from a conversation, even if “not flirting” and whoever is present. When you add that she’s he’s partner, it becomes even more disrespectful.

They look like they're on a first date? Suggests the behaviour is reciprocal then?

He asked you if you were ok with him going on holiday with her - you showed you were trusting and said yes. At that point you'd no reason to feel uncomfortable and say no. Do you really would have not gone if you'd said no?

Either way you then met her, she gave you reason to feel concerned - you raised those issues with him and requested he not meet her without you. At that point he could have said he wouldn't agree to that, or at least discussed conditions like he'd tell you first. He didn't, he went against what he said he'd do, he then lied to you and presumably would never have told you unless you'd found out. How many more times would he have done this?
Her partner also seems to notice her behaviour - so it's not just you seeing something that's not there.

If this is how he handles your concerns, by agreeing to what you ask and then doing what he wants and lying about it, it's not a good foundation for going forward.

She is beyond disrespectful and so is your partner for playing along with her silly flirting.

My closest friends are men and I would never act like that around them nevermind around their partners.