Advice - Our teen DS is out of control

[thetroublewithteens]

Apologies in advance for the lengthy post but we are at a loss

DS(17) has been in and out of trouble since primary 7 which escalated as he went through secondary school

Primary school contacted social services without our knowledge due to his behaviour but at the time I was so angry I pushed back on it. Refused their help.

DH & me both work full time, have done since we left school. We also have a DD who is the polar opposite to her brother and she has been around so much in her young life it's heart-breaking.

Fast forward to his first year at academy and things escalated at a terrible rate and any consequences we put in place resulting in him running away and being brought home by the police. We also had a DD at home who is 6 years younger and her life was miserable because of him. He was vile to her, really nasty. He's nasty to everyone really.

DS went into school Friday and told them I'd hit him repeatedly. It was all lies and myself and DH were contacted by CPS and demanded we come home from work to be interviewed. Whilst we were being investigated and because it was a weekend, DS was sent to my DM house to stay. The case was closed and he moved back home however we agreed to help from social work because his behaviour was so out of control. He would lie, steal, involved with drugs from a very young age (our house was searched at one point!)

Now - my DM was our main childcare, both of us work full time although in hindsight I can see I should have probably given up my job but we couldn't survive on one income at the time and I can't change the past so I need to make my peace with the choices we made at the time.

My DM has no boundaries and no consequences, DS knows this and plays her like a fiddle and it did not matter how many times we would say he wasn't allowed out as a consequence or that we were limiting his money because of how it was being spent. She would do what suited her and then lie to us. It was almost like anything for an easy life. She would buy him things that we'd said no to. Things we couldn't necessarily afford. He'd damage them, she'd instantly replace. He is spoilt beyond belief. We would repeatedly tell her she didn't have to agree with our parenting but she did need to respect our choices and sing from the same page but she would not listen. We told her she was giving him a life that was unsustainable and that we could not keep up and in turn he was playing us off one another. At one point social work even told her she is not the parent, we are the parent and she needs to start getting onboard with us.

DS picked up quite quickly that social work would send him to my DM and therefore he'd be allowed to do what he liked so he would go into school on a Friday and make up an accusation knowing he'd get sent to DMs and he could do what he liked. Eventually social work did click onto it after I wrote down every instance and pointed it out to them and then provided evidence he'd been seen out in town drinking and taking drugs.

During COVID, life was better because restrictions meant DS physically couldn't go out and could not go to my DMs house.
Social work closed us down completely because there was other children who needed more support and that was fine. In truth he was great in COVID, a much nicer person to be around. Done well with his school work. Honestly it was like night and day.

Once restrictions lifted and school returned, he was back to his old ways within 6 months. No more social work for us but he was back to skipping school, lying, stealing from us, drugs.. honestly it was horrendous. Every day was a battle but by this point I wfh full time so I am around to keep an eye on him more.

Until he met a girl and all hell broke lose, he's just shy of being 16 at this point - the accusations were back in full force along with everything else. We had an argument with him over his behaviour and he'd stolen more money from us. He shoved me down the stairs so he could get past and run away to the girls house resulting in me being in hospital with a dislocated shoulder. My DM collected him and brought him here to talk to us. We didn't go because he would not have got in the car, it would have escalated further. He point blank refused to stay here saying we were shit parents, I am a c* and a whole host of other insults. He said he would run away to the girls house so my DM said he could live with her because at least we'd know he was safe to a point although I knew (and he knew) that he would not be able to do what he likes with no consequences.

We tried our hardest to maintain contact with DS but he would block our phone numbers and ignore our messages. DM would also go through phases of blocking our number but sometimes she'd speak to us and let us know how we was. Other than that, we'd rely on mutual friends who might have seen him.

2 years down the line and he left school the moment he could, went to college and was put out and not allowed to re-apply for two years. He got a job and was let go because he is unreliable and in the past 6 weeks he's been given another job which he is barely holding onto.

He is no longer with that girl after she fell pregnant and he was vicious to her. We were in contact throughout that time and she miscarried. As cruel as this is, it was for the best because neither her or him were fit to look after a child.

Today I've had a long conversation with DM and the truth of how bad things are has become apparent. She used to make excuses for him but not today.

He's had two bank accounts stopped for fraudulently activity - large transactions that he cannot prove where the money is from or what it is for. We know it's drugs

He is dealing drugs and taking drugs, all under her roof. He has stolen a large quantity of money from her under the guise of booking a holiday which she stupidly transferred to his friend (because he hasn't got a bank account) believing they were paying but has no proof of a booking. She bought him a bike 3 weeks ago for his upcoming 18th and presumes he has sold it because it's missing and has been for a week or so. He demanded driving lessons so we halved in for an intensive course and he didn't turn up on the first two occasions so that was a waste of money. He has stolen jewellery from her house.
He invites his friends round when she is not home and they have her house a mess. When she goes to bed, he has his friends over drinking and taking drugs in her garage.
She has replaced the locks on the garage and house twice and he steals her keys and has copies made!!

Today she has said she is putting him out - neither her or us can see any way forward with him.

This all started when he was 12 years old, he is now almost 18 and things have got worse. He won't listen, has no respect and has a bad temper and can be violent.

I honestly don't see what we can do here to straighten him out. It's a waste of a young life.

Has anyone else experienced this - what can we do? How can we help him?

OP you refer to an academy he started and overnight trips and the his behavioir changed, whether you want to admit it or not its quiet possible he was sexually assaulted and something you need to look into, until you find the cause it will be impossible to help him. X

Your message im sure is a big help.i think you hit the nail on the head saying his parents were always working full time.when i was little there was only me and my mum,she worked all the time.i wasn’t a naughty kid well maybe sometimes but i absolutely resented her never ever being there for me never having the time.i still resent her to this day.i never had her love or time not once.maybe that is the problem?

Neither yourself or your mum have have him to stay. He’s a safeguarding risk to everyone. He needs to approach the council and state he is being made homeless on x date. BUT you should have sorted this out when he was 12 years old and not utilised your mum for child care.

Drugs cause this. I've seen it happen with my brother at 15, my husband's nephew at 15 and my first love at 18. Some people think they're invincible but the drugs are more powerful. Who they were before drugs is lost forever, their motivation becomes focused solely on their addiction and that's that. It is truly tragic but I've not ever seen it turn around and I am 54. It only gets worse. I am truly so sorry this has happened to you and your family.

Was he diagnosed with anything while at school? E.g. Oppositional Defiant Disorder?
Unfortunately as he is nearly 18 your opportunity to get help is limited, especially if he doesn’t want to engage. But he must be really unhappy. Is he completely unable to explain why his behaviour changed at 12?

I haven’t read all of the posts but feel that some of the posts blaming ‘poor parenting’ are very unfair. Working in an environment with people who have issues with substance use and problematic behaviours, some have had awful childhoods/experienced significant trauma - some have wonderful parents who would have done anything to support their child. Some have personality disorders. Some have been heavily influenced by peers. There is no one explanation that fits all. It must be heartbreaking to be in this situation and I really feel for you OP.
i think that until he is motivated to change, and this may unfortunately be as a result of involvement with the criminal justice system/custody/probation, there is very little anybody can do. He needs to want to change. As a parent, this can be one of the most difficult things to deal with and I hope that you are getting some support too

This sounds like a mirror image of my step daughter. She hated any boundaries put in place and would want to go and live with her mom/grandparents. When they put boundaries in place she wanted to come back and live with us. She started acting like a little toe rag from 12. She’s stolen from us and my in laws for drug money, left home multiple times and then gone to the council to say we’ve kicked her out and she’s homeless when we haven’t. We asked social services for help the first time when she was 13 and again at 15. During Covid she was a nightmare and was adamant she didn’t have to live according to lockdown rules. After she attacked me for stopping her leaving at 3am through Covid we called social services and asked them to take her as we couldn’t cope with her behaviour. They wouldn’t and as soon as lockdown was lifted she went back to her grandparents. She got pregnant last year and when the baby was three weeks old she walked out on him and went back to his drug addict dad and got pregnant again within weeks. She had a miscarriage 14 weeks in which, without wanting to be horrible, was a relief as social services had already asked us if we would take the baby as they’d have to remove it. We flat out said no as there is no way we could manage with two under 1. We have our grandson living with us full time and she is allowed supervised contact with him. She’s now decided she wants to be his mom and expects us to ask her to come every time we take him out for the day. She’s refuses to accept that she has put herself in this situation and has to live with the consequences and says that we’re throwing it back in her face.

im sorry you’re in this situation with your son and I wish it could say it gets better but he has to want to change for the better so unfortunately there isn’t much you can do for someone who wants to behave like this and doesn’t want to help themselves

You tried your best. You need to focus on your own and your daughter’s safety. Now your DM, despite her being a facilitator in the past, also now needs to be safe too.

He is an adult it is on him. In many ways its a shame the illegal activities werent caught before he became an adult and the juvenile system may have sorted him out.

Hard as it is I wouldn't let him cross the threshold again because of his violent tendencies. Let him know when he is ready to change his ways and apologise you will be there for him, not much else you can do.

wtf!! A LOT of parents have to work f/t. Don’t blame op for this.

If no county lines charities look for support from charities that help families impacted by substance misuse. For the referral to ss for dm I would suggest calling them ans raising a concern yourself but adding that you feel coercive control is impacting on her. Sending positive thoughts

Some of the comments here from the perfect parents who seem to think there’s an easy answer or poor parenting has caused all these issues should be ashamed.I only hope your perfect children never give you cause to despair and they lead perfect lives To this distressed mum and dad I hope that your family life settles down and your sons behavior improves . You have been good loving parents who tried to do their best for their children, some children go off the rails and we don’t always know why , you can only hope that he turns his life around in the future .

Just wanted to send you some support OP. It sounds like hell.

Poor kid really feel for him. That was a real big drip feed mentioning him being groomed for selling drugs at young age then when you got police involved your DS was spiked and ended up in hospital for giving names. Would say your mum giving him what he wanted was the least of your problems. Like a poster said at the start he needs to be able to talk to professionals. sounds like he could be blaming you for not being there when this started.

No idea why you care about his phone having information. Also if lots of money and drugs was left in the house poor kid could be scared hiding for his life if he was already in debt it will be worse now. He needs out of the area for a fresh start surprised police haven't pinged his phone when you say there is a warrent out for him.

Have you ever watched the film "Beautiful Boy"? It is absolutely heartbreaking but it's based on a true story about a father dealing with his son's drug addiction & there's also other children in the family.
Part of it is having to accept his that son is who he is & will do what he wants to do.

It unfortunately also sounds like your son has got sucked in to the drug world with them manipulating him & preying on his addiction.
Sometimes no one is actually at fault & some people, for various reasons, just make bad choices in life. But it sounds like you've tried what you can & you're letting him know you still love him & care about him. 💐

This. And you and your dh failed him way back then when school called for help with SS and you refused. I feel so sorry for your dd whose life is probably so deeply disturbed and traumatised because of this. You're asking way too late about what to do.
I do feel sorry for you but at the same time, you and your dh just allowed this to happen as well.

Hi, no one wants to address most factors why have my beautiful child become so angry at the world, first thing we do is put the blame on ourselves, we gave to much, I shouldn't have spoilt them , it's our fault we let them get away with it, now I want to be clear this reason I'm putting forward may have nothing at all todo with your situation, it also could be the reason. So as much as this is a taboo conversation it also could be the reason, I hope to god it's not, but have you even taken into consideration that he has been abused, a child doesn't just act out for no good reason, you said yourself you and your partner worked leaving him with who? Take into consideration how his behaviour became pleasant during restrictions who in that time wasn't around him, have you ever just asked has anyone hurt him ? Have you asked him has someone hurt him someone that was given trust and if it happened in the time you were in work then they not only broken his trust they broke yours . All the signs of anger, hate towards siblings because they are not targeted, failing relationships because for a male victim they can't understand how their body reacts to abuse, they need to understand why ! If this happens it wasn't their fault and it doesn't mean their gay. There is shame , anger, resentment and hate towards a mother and father for not noticing the abuse, questions why you left him with this person, fear of repeating an abuse .
Take into consideration his abuser could have been someone closer than close, mental abuse, emotional abuse, abuse is not just physical, as for social workers they are an absolute waste of space and unless your child/children are young enough to traffic so they can receive funding from charities. then it's convenient to say unless they want help they can't force them the help they really need, so basically its not worth it as they don't get their bonuses. There is a reason why your child became angry, careless with his own life concerning the taking and turning to drugs, if it's mental health and being pumped with medication that can have worse side effects and funding for the counseling they need at least two full sessions one is around 8 weeks and even then are not enough to getting to the root of all the disruption in your lives, having to turn to drugs can be an escape from reality to forget their real pain. I hope you can find the real reasons why he's hurting so you can heal together 🙏

But why did you refuse SS intervention when it could have made all the difference
. The school who had a good measure of him, called because they were concerned.
You blame your mum for not seeing any fault, but haven't you done the exact same??

Unfortunately op, I think you should let your son make his own way in life now and protect your daughter if it isn't too late. Your mum has reaped what she's sewn so that's her problem. At his age there isn't much you can do.

He was arrested this evening, refused a solicitor and police called us because of his age they had to contact us and let us know what was happening. We were not allowed to sit in on the interview. We offered to collect him but he did not want to see us or PIL.

He used PIL as a bail address so he has been charged and released with a court date set for 6 weeks

There's a bit of discrepancy surrounding the use of her address. PIL say they didn't okay it, DS says they did and police dropped him at their house.

We went to see him, ask him if he's okay since he's not been responding to messages and blocked me.

The meeting did not go well, DS is off his face on drugs and was aggressive and abusive. MIL says he was like that from the moment he arrived. I think she was quite shocked at how badly he's spiralled since she last saw him.

We tried to explain to him that him being bailed to her address means he must be seen to live / sleeping there but he says that's not correct.

He had something to eat, and has left the village. No idea where to.

Doesn't want our help or need or help and he doesn't have a drug problem, he has a problem selling drugs according to him.

We've told PIL that they need to notify the police he is not living at their address nor is he welcome to stay there because he will use the address as and when it suits him to come and go and until they've removed association then DD won't be allowed there because he could turn up at any time and be aggressive and violent

I'm not going to update anymore. It's time to move on

Thank you all once again xx

It was interesting he changed when there was a lockdown. He may have liked you being around.

I think you've done the right thing getting the police involved. I hope he experiences and accepts the limits this will bring and one day you can build a bridge. I also hope you all take time to process what's happened, maybe in therapy. It can happen. Good luck 🤞🏻 💐

I’m sure, that when your son is actually thinking straight, he is desperate for a way out.

The only way out at the moment is to take more drugs to blank it all out. That is what you seeing now,

I hope he manages to turn up for his court hearing and there can be an intervention, however drastic, to help him. You already know the cycle he is going through and you know how he got to this point. None of it was through poor parenting. It can happen to any of our children.

But sooner or later he will realise he has to stop and face it all. I hope he comes to you for help. I hope you can manage to keep track of him and keep talking even though 99% of it falls on deaf ears.

You are still doing all you can and have been through hell already.
I believe he still has the potential to get himself out of this. Don’t ever lose hope OP. I’m so sorry for your despair in the meantime.

Your story should be a warning to society about the evil and power of a drug trade that can turn normal children into these aggressive monsters and use them for their own evil ends, taking over their lives and the lives of their families completely. I hope, in your search to help him, you will continue to highlight your son’s story to whoever will listen.

You were not unreasonable to highlight it here and I thank you for doing so. I hope some of the suggested charities from PP’s might help be able to offer concrete help at some stage.

I'm so sorry OP. It must be agonising for you.

Wow. What exceptionally poor decisions did she make? Working full time is the norm for many people and So is relying on grandparent support. To suggest these are poor decisions is mad, to suggest they are exceptionally poor is quite ignorant and unnecessarily rude. Lucky you if you didn’t have to work full time, doesn’t make other parents bad for having to do so.

So if this was me and my son. And I have a SEN child with behaviour issues.
My first and overwhelming emotion is, I've let my son down.
Why is he like this? What help does he need and what is his behaviour desperately trying to tell me.
All behaviour is communication.
I'm not getting any sense of, really desperately wanting to know why he is behaving this way.so that you can help him.
There's alot of listing of his bad behaviour.
There is an awful lot of blame on your mother. But she wasn't his parent?
If you want to know the deep why of your son, I would suggest you also take up some talking therapy.
That's what I've done. Spent all my time and energy on doing that for the past 6 years. Trying to get to the deep why of my sons behaviour so I can help him.

It’s not so much about both parents working F/t. It’s about the description of what they do daily/weekly/yearly and no where is there anytime where she or her dh connect on a one to one basis with their dc on any regular basis.

Everything is about what the family do together

I mentioned ND, because I thought that as a family there might be some indicators
Things like not understanding what emotional landscape or emotional neglect looked like seemed like a pointer