AIBU in expecting my teen boys to have tidy rooms

[Newbutoldfather]

I have two teen boys, early and mid teens. I expect them to keep their rooms tidy. This is non-negotiable. They need to be perfectly tidy at least once a week, so the cleaner can clean them. They can take water to their bedrooms but all other drink and food has to be eaten downstairs.

They have become pretty good at it and only need the odd nudge now, Also bedrooms are not ‘private space’. Unless the door is closed, in which case I will knock, we all go in one another’s rooms.

They can express their creativity (although don’t seem that bothered) by putting up posters or painting the walls (well, not personally, without help).

I think all the above is good role modelling and prepares them well for adult life, where spills, damage and rotting food have real consequences in terms of damaging a house and financial cost.

The reason I ask is the amount of threads where teenage rooms are vile with spills, rotting food and, less importantly, old and smelly clothes thrown anywhere and everywhere. And so many posters say that you have to respect their ‘private’ space and that they are teens and can’t help it (often, ridiculously, due to ‘lack of brain development.)

I wanted to do an AIBU to see if I was in the silent majority or if most people do see teen’s rooms as theirs to neglect and damage should they so wish.

I find it really strange that you should want your home to be similar to a classroom. Home is meant to be where we can relax, switch off, enjoy ourselves and go at our own pace. If your teens are naturally inclined to be super tidy at all times then absolutely fair enough, but you having to enforce weird rules to ensure tidiness suggests they are not.

And privacy is a big deal. I'd have been absolutely furious if my mother had been going into my bedroom because it was my space where I kept my private things.

Probably means his wife, his children are only trained to tidy 😂

You also say that they can expect you to enter their rooms whenever you wish. Even when they are out. All teenagers (and most people) have personal items they don't want their families to see.

@YellowphantGrey ,

‘Probably means his wife, his children are only trained to tidy 😂’

So hilarious, love the emoji. Are you sure you aren’t on your mum’s account.

If you want to bring up a selfish misogynist, make sure that they have absolute privacy and autonomy as a teen. Their future wives will have a lovely time picking up after them as they just throw their clothes on the floor.

The OP is fortunate to have two such easy going sons who are prepared to go along with how he wants them to behave but I doubt that method would be guaranteed to work with all teenagers, human beings are not all the same and in my opinion, not always so easily controlled....

Teen bedrooms are akin to the upside down in 'Stranger things', they're not a place i care to venture into often. Their space, their rules, they need to learn how to manage their own environment.

We're you in the army? Give them some space .

@Allfur ,

‘Teen bedrooms are akin to the upside down in 'Stranger things', they're not a place i care to venture into often. Their space, their rules, they need to learn how to manage their own environment.’

Do you apply the same principle to other areas of their lives like homework, times to come home, their phone uses? Because you could. Why don’t they just need to learn to manage those?

And what if the consequence of the messy room is losing school books, chargers etc. Who replaces them?

I am a firm believer in giving teens age appropriate autonomy in line with the responsibility they are prepared to take for it. But this means building up slowly and scaffolding.

I notice the OP is extremely reluctant to say if he is ex military or not.

What would the mid teen boys responsibility be for having autonomy over his own personal space?

My approach seems to be working because homework always gets done, coming home times are easily and happily negotiated, and abided by, and stuff rarely gets lost.

Is that how your Mom raised you?

Having teens tidy up isn't the flex you think it is. Millions of women do this with their children as soon as children start walking. Only a man could be proud he has tidied up for a woman to clean.

My DS cleans and tidies and is allowed to shut his bedroom door and drink or eat in his bedroom if he wishes. He knows to live in a comfy and smooth running house, we all need to pull our weight.

He can and does cook, do the washing, hang the washing, vac, polish, can iron, can do an online shop, empties bins etc.

He isn't told to do this, he sees what needs doing and does it, the same as I do and the same as my husband.

Look, some people might say that teenagers need a safe space to call their own. Some rooms sparkle like a unicorn stables, others are a pit of hell. With two sporty boys, ours was chaos, smelly and the floor was a horizontal wardrobe. This was despite sanctions, "shame" pictures the lot. Yours sound way better but you are sending a message their room is not really theirs .I'd be concerned about that. I kind always found consolation that at least this bit of teenage kickback was soimething I could actually see. Believe me, the stuff you cannot see is what you really need to worry about...

And there you go again, mansplaining.

It's like you have to come on and impart your wisdom as though all women are parenting wrong because it's not being done your way.

Teen rooms getting messy isn't the failure you think it is.

Oh god if he is in the military.
They often make horrendously bullying fathers.
I have a few friends whose fathers were very senior officers, Colonel/Major etc.
They thought their rules extended to their homes.
Their children couldn't leave quick enough.
Not one remained in the UK, they are literally at the other side of the world, despite having lovely mums.

I think yabu not to allow them to have their rooms as private space.

The reason I give some autonomy to my teens in their rooms is because I believe in intrinsic motivation. I believe my messy son will learn in his own time that if he leaves his homework on the floor and chucks some boxers over it when he takes them off, he won't find his homework on the day it's due and will get a detention. Or if he leaves his favourite t shirt scrunched up in the corner instead of putting it in the laundry, he will not be able to wear it to that gig. He will learn that systems work and will internalise that learning and carry it forward to uni and beyond.

On the other hand, if I impose that he MUST keep the space regimented and tidy and MUST clean on Tuesday evening and MUST NOT take a plate into his room, because that is my will, regardless of his opinion on how he wants to live, I suspect that when he gets away to live independently he will probably rebel and do nothing at all. He may gorge himself on the forbidden fruits of messiness, cups and plates galore, just because he can. Because he has never really learned why. This isn't the end of the world but it means that he is tipped into a world where he is messy with zero restrictions or guidance, whereas MY messy teens do have some guidance (eg empty the bin each week, bring your plates down).

The alternative scenario is that he will expect absolute tidiness and be completely intolerant of disorganisation, which will be problematic in most student houses and lead to conflict.

I just believe that intrinsic motivation is more powerful than extrinsic.

Believe me, the stuff you cannot see is what you really need to worry about...

I suspect this is likely what will happen. There will be a knock at the door from the Police after one of them has done something seriously wrong. Like you say, far better a messy room their act of rebellion than outdoors doing all sorts.

AIBU in expecting my teen boys to have tidy rooms?

Yes

Exactly this!

Exactly the same here. My ds vacuums his room when needed etc. He doesn’t need to be told to do it. They’ve helped clean their rooms since they were one-year old.

If anything op’s kids are lazy as shit, if they need a cleaner to clean their rooms for them. Now that is pretty bad parenting. If they don’t learn to do it now, when will they.

Very well written. It’s so important.

They've learnt they need to do the bare minimum then pay a woman to do the rest.

And to feel good about having tidied up for the cleaner, as if it’s an accomplishment. Wrong signals.

Me too, exactly this. I don’t expect perfection but it needs to be reasonably tidy before the cleaner comes weekly and in the meantime dirty clothes need to go in the hamper etc. No food allowed in bedrooms. But I absolutely do respect my teens’ privacy, at least to a point. If they’re not home I will go into their rooms freely if I have a reason to BUT they don’t want their siblings in their rooms and we absolutely enforce that.

100% what @NyeRobey said.

This is a really bizarre thing to say.

If you want to bring up a selfish misogynist, make sure that they have absolute privacy and autonomy as a teen. Their future wives will have a lovely time picking up after them as they just throw their clothes on the floor.

Firstly, no-one on this thread has suggested any teens have "absolute privacy and autonomy as a teen" You are just making that up.

Secondly, as someone with dc now in their 20s, I can assure you that having a bedroom that is the pit of despair as a 13 / 14 / 15 year old does NOT mean their bedroom - or indeed house - will be like that as an adult.

As @NyeRobey has explained so very well in their post, people respond so much better to being given some autonomy to learn to make their own decisions - including mistakes - and learning from them. I would be very disappointed in myself if I hadn't given my dc the ability to think for themselves and make their own decisions in life.