Holiday with another family and behaviour of their ASD child

[upoutandin87]

Currently on holiday with my family and another family (old friends) they have 2 older children same age as my kids and they also now have a 6 yr old. We have holidayed with them before but not since the youngest was born. Youngest is ND (autism and suspected ADHD). My son is 15 and autistic so I know about ASD but there DD seems out of control and we can't cope with it. She swears spits hits and throws furniture if she doesn't get her own way - there is no routine and she basically gets what she wants - she slapped my DD earlier today and called her a f b because she didn't want to go in the pool with her - my friends answer to this was you cannot say no to her - if you don't do what she wants she kicks off so we have to let her do what she wants. My friends DH and 2 older kids can't cope with her so they go to the beach and take my 15 yr old with them - I prefer being by the pool so I stay with them and my DD 17. We honestly don't know what to do as our holiday is being ruined by a 7 yr old. She threw my bag in the pool yesterday and I was fuming. We are trying to do stuff without them but they seem to be constantly appearing - they never raise their voice at their DD or tell her to stop as negative language makes her worse. Last night their 15 yr old told my son that she has been permanently excluded from her primary school and she currently has no school place from September - I was aware she has had several exclusions for violence but only short term exclusions but her parents have not mentioned to us about the exclusion. My DH wants us to cut all ties with them until they start parenting their child properly. We are only 3 days in to a 10 day holiday and are tempted to fly home to get away from them. I feel so bad as I am an SEN parent myself but they won't take any advice from us about maybe having a routine and setting boundaries. I so feel for them as they are completely broken by her behaviour but I don't actually know what I can do to help.

Their kid needs meds.

I would be looking to change accommodation if at all possible. It sounds miserable and not relaxing at all.

All ND people are different. Maybe she is struggling with the change of environment.
That said, I’d avoid as much a possible and tell her off myself.
I also have a SEN child and not telling. Them off if not an option. It creates bratty little people.

Wow I don't blame you feeling how you do

Definitely change accommodation. That's absolute wild.

Old friends with two older kids who are ‘parented properly’ what is the likelihood they’ve suddenly become crap parents to number three?

That they’ve dropped all the routines and boundaries they had with the older ones and decided just to let her do what she likes? Versus that she has such high, complex needs that they’ve found all their ordinary discipline and boundaries and parenting don’t work and they haven’t yet figured out what does,

Sounds like they need support and kindness not abandoning and criticising by old friends.

I would be heading out every morning without them and finding a way of enjoying the holiday. If I could afford it I would look for alternative accommodation. I imagine if you said something about their parenting they would disagree.

Can you find a different accomodation locally? Booking? airbnb etc. I would try that one first.

It sounds very difficult for all parties involved. I have a highly volatile DC with ASD. Easy to say one needs to parents esp if there are PDA elements to it (sounds like it). I would just looking into getting a different roof over your head before flying home early.

I wouldn’t fly back, but I would change accommodation and continue the holiday separately to them.

They are trying to manage her the best way they can in a "different" environment.

You need to be honest with your. Friends and tell them you're finding her behaviour more challenging than you expected

Go and do your own thing.
Meet up at convenient times then go again when it gets too much

Did they forewarn you about her behaviour before the holiday?

I'd move villas/hotels rather than fly home.

I would just say that you need to separate your plans as DD behaviour is too much and completely do your own thing.

I can see why they want to go on holidays with another family, but the cheek of them going on holiday another family without discussing these issues first.

I have a child who is ND she wouldn't be violent but holidaying with another family would be a nightmare for her. She would be totally disregulated and anxious. All ND children are different and I can understand how this is affecting you and your families holiday so huge sympathies. I think they really should have expected this and said when you were making the arrangements that it wouldn't be a good idea.

Shitty to call them bad parents and want to cut contact but reasonable to not be coping with this level of behaviour on your holiday. I’m curious though how you have managed to know the child 7 years and not be aware of her level of challenging behaviour?
I would find alternative accommodation or just take your family off each day.

Sounds like they have got stuck in survival mode of constant appeasement. This means that to stop the problem that is happening now in this instant they back down, but the child then isn't learning anything about negotiation, compromise, delayed gratification, or managing big feelings.

There's not much you can do really.

If you can be bothered, you could try to relate it to your own experiences with your autistic son at that age. "Oh when Bobby was thus age he really struggled with his emotions too. We were advised to grant him his wish in imagination and I was skeptical but it worked really well. Like if he wanted an ice cream but it was nearly tea time and I didn't want him to have one, I would say 'Its too close to tea time for an ice cream, but we can get one after. It sounds like you'd really like one. Me too. I would choose a huge cone with marshmallows and strawberry ice cream. What would you choose if you could have one?'"

There's no autism specialist out there who would say never to deny anything to an autistic child, even one who is having huge tantrums, but there are ways of saying no without exactly saying no.

I think you need to let go of the idea that they can necessarily parent this behaviour away. I have two with asd - both parented the same and one was really impossible to stop at times. He ended up in residential school as it was breaking us. I think going on holiday with another family was definitely never going to work for your friend and I am really surprised that it was even suggested. I think cutting them off completely is very unkind but avoiding family days out is perfectly understandable.

Sounds like he’ll, and I say that as a mum to a 7yo with complex needs! We holidayed with a (now former) friend last year and her DD sounds exactly the same. In fact we arrived at our accommodation, dumped our bags and needed to head to the supermarket for our click and collect slot, except her DD wouldn’t allow this. So the four of us sat in the car for forty mins whilst ‘friend’ waited for her 6yo to decide we could actually go to the supermarket after all. Friendship ended a few months later but the way she “parents” her daughter and then blames it on SEN was a huge reason why.

As the saying goes if you have met one person with autism you have met one person with autism
Just because you have an autistic child doesn't make you an expert on autism or a better parent all children with autism are different
That said you don't have to put it with and let it ruin your holiday.

Their oldest child definitely has an element of ASD but he is far quieter and reserved. He is the opposite to his sister and goes with the flow - they have always given their children what they want - endless supply of food and souvenirs when we used to go away with them. They definitely find saying No hard but the older two do not seem to have the behaviour issues that their sister does. They have never had a routine though and nothing is ever planned everything is go with the flow and I think that if their DD had a little bit of an idea how her day would pan out she may able to cope better. As a family they don't ear meals either they just graze throughout the day - it was always a bit like this before child no 3 was born but now their is no mealtimes at all.

It is possible though to be both a SEN parent and a bad parent. They aren’t mutually exclusive, and it’s not helpful to excuse shitty parenting just because the child has complex needs.

Do the parents have any awareness about how their DD affects everyone else? Maybe they are so used to it that they don’t realise how much it’s ruining your family’s holiday. I would be honest with your friend and try to stay out of their way. It’s a difficult situation but you aren’t obligated to endure their child’s behaviour.

But if you have a really volatile child with PDA who can't cope with expectations - you ideally don't set them up by going on holiday unprepared like this, with another family. If when she is older she slapped a random 18 year old and called them a fucking bitch for not doing what she wanted, she could get arrested or attacked. It's a safeguarding issue. You just can't have it.

Explain nicely it's effecting your kids and you would like to do things separately fora few days.