Page 37 | To be glad that #IStandWithAngelaCarini is trending no.1 in the UK on X (Twitter)

AngeloMysterioso · 2024-08-01T15:11:39+00:00

Angela Carini is the incredibly brave Italian boxer who had her Olympic dream shattered in less than a minute after being punched in the face by Imane Khelif, a male competitor who was disqualified from the women’s World Championships last year because his testosterone levels were too high. Everyone should be saying her name. Over and over and over again.

CaveMum · 02/08/2024 10:26

NotBadConsidering · 02/08/2024 10:21

This is a good point. Why doesn’t he wear a hijab if he’s a woman?

https://x.com/coachcaroline/status/1819287723548475771?s=42

I did think that too but I don’t think it carries much water as an argument - there are 2 other boxers on the Algerian Women’s Team, one wears a head covering and the other doesn’t, so it may be a personal choice issue.

Italiangreyhound · 02/08/2024 10:30

For the record I have a trans family member and total respect for trans people and I also respect sex-based categories for the protection of females in sport and safe sex-segregated spaces.

NotBadConsidering · 02/08/2024 10:30

CaveMum · 02/08/2024 10:20

IOC daily press conference live now: https://www.youtube.com/live/8Qhq_kJZeEw?si=g77hROfRtkw153S2

Edited

I just caught a question on the boxing. Usual nonsense about trying to “balance” inclusion and fairness. Typical skirting the issue. It can’t be done Mark!

There won’t be a single one of these daily briefings that will offer any concession that there’s a problem. Deny, deny, deny.

NotBadConsidering · 02/08/2024 10:31

CaveMum · 02/08/2024 10:26

I did think that too but I don’t think it carries much water as an argument - there are 2 other boxers on the Algerian Women’s Team, one wears a head covering and the other doesn’t, so it may be a personal choice issue.

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Fair enough.

BaronessEllarawrosaurus · 02/08/2024 10:34

That press conference is annoying testosterone levels can be higher in some women than some men so we don't test the levels.

Thatcat · 02/08/2024 10:42

NotBadConsidering · 02/08/2024 10:21

This is a good point. Why doesn’t he wear a hijab if he’s a woman?

https://x.com/coachcaroline/status/1819287723548475771?s=42

Not all Algerian Muslim women do.

turbonerd · 02/08/2024 10:42

NotBadConsidering · 02/08/2024 10:21

This is a good point. Why doesn’t he wear a hijab if he’s a woman?

https://x.com/coachcaroline/status/1819287723548475771?s=42

Also, just looking at their different physiques makes it well clear which sex he is. She (with hijab) is an athletic woman. He (sans hijab) is an athletic man.

WarriorN · 02/08/2024 10:51

CaveMum · 02/08/2024 10:20

IOC daily press conference live now: https://www.youtube.com/live/8Qhq_kJZeEw?si=g77hROfRtkw153S2

Edited

Transcript of the questions asked at the conference here.

Excerpt:

Q: A decision has to be taken - would you favour inclusion or safety of athletes?
A: It's not up to me. The IOC is trying to do a balance between inclusion, fairness and safety. That's separate to whats going on here which is a woman boxer being stigmatised. Safety is our
Number One Concern.

Q: Lisa Nandy said she felt uneasy watching the fight. Did you feel uneasy and worry about Carini's safety?
A: My feelings don't come into it. It was over far too quickly,
Q: Are female boxers tested for testosterone levels before they arrive
A: No

WarriorN · 02/08/2024 10:52

Sorry, here

x.com/journalismseen/status/1819296765687804358?s=46&t=A2fpFNgDRyXF2d6ye97wEA

BlueLimeRun · 02/08/2024 10:55

That photo says everything.

They are a nasty violent cheat.

Helleofabore · 02/08/2024 10:56

Thanks warrior

FOJN · 02/08/2024 10:59

turbonerd · 02/08/2024 10:42

Also, just looking at their different physiques makes it well clear which sex he is. She (with hijab) is an athletic woman. He (sans hijab) is an athletic man.

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It's just so obvious in everything from height, fat distribution, facial bones and even thigh shape.

Runningupthecurtains · 02/08/2024 11:07

The IOC has removed the use of head guards from the male category but retained them in the female category.
In other words the IOC believe women are at greater risk of harm from being hit in the head than men are.
The IOC are also allowing boxers who have previously failed gender (i.e. sex) eligibility tests to compete in the female category without carrying out any testing.
They think this is balancing safety.

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 02/08/2024 11:08

Caerulea · 02/08/2024 09:23

Things to bear in mind for a lot of the arguments in both directions -

There's NOTHING to suggest Khelif is trans - conflating the two things is stupid & embarrassing. TW & ppl with DSDs that infer benefits should not be in women's sport but the reasons are very different.

Assuming DSD It's VERY likely Khelif, given their childhood, had no idea growing up. Was labelled female, lived and grew up believing themselves to be a girl/woman. No one knows when/if they found out but it seems likely they absolutely know now.

The IBA haven't said & no one knows what this test was & though they might be corrupt AF (like every sports org seems to bloody be) the accusations of this being Russian meddling is silly. Russia don't put a face on their shitstirring & why, of all countries, go for Algeria & Taiwan when they've 'good' relationships with them.

Both the boxers in question essentially accepted their disqualification. Surely you'd go to any lengths to definitively clear your name to avoid any future BS.

Two female boxers, at least, who know what it's like to get punched in the face (repeatedly!) by other women have said they've never been hit like that before. Whether Khelif lost or not in the past due to being mediocre is irrelevant.

There is a suggestion that DSD sufferers are being deliberately sought out & it's been going on for a looong time. It's a fantastically rare condition so why are they are over-represented in high level athletics? Do you think everyone approaching 7ft chooses basketball or that ppl say to them 'Jfc you need to play basketball!'?

It's exploitative for them & grossly unfair on women. In this case it's outright dangerous, no ifs no buts. It's no secret what some coaches & trainers will put their sportsppl through in the name of winning & we KNOW it steps over into abuse & even medical malpractice (especially when it comes to women).

Something is awry with both these boxers just no one knows exactly what, who knew & at what point. It makes zero sense that neither team have gone to extreme lengths to prove their innocence & show their athletes do not present excessive risk to other competitors. Even if you discount the idea of fairness! Just the literal physical harm to other women.

Actually I think the reasons why trans women and male people with DSDs should not be competing in women's sports are the same.

They are male and have a competitive advantage over women.

That's all.

The rest is just noise.

Fetlocksblowininthewind · 02/08/2024 11:09

WandsOut · 02/08/2024 07:54

Men punching women in the face is now an Olympic sport.

Her hopes and dreams shattered by a man who then touched her breast whilst she was devastated, in front of the whole world.

x.com/nicholelizaq/status/1819035576559120743?s=46

He's a cheat and his country should be ashamed of him and themselves for putting him forward to beat up women.

Holy fuck! 😱😡

I have reached a new plateau of anger after seeing this! WTAF?!!!

Just blatantly touched her breast in front of the whole fucking world! So beating a woman wasn't enough, he had to sexually assault her to compound the humiliation?!!

I am so fucking furious for Angela Carini - again! 😡😡

PurpleSparkledPixie · 02/08/2024 11:11

WandsOut · 02/08/2024 08:31

Punched her and then cupped her breast!

Is that also ok for all the male violence defenders in this post?

x.com/nicholelizaq/status/1819035576559120743?s=46 omg

Good. God.

😮

Needanewname42 · 02/08/2024 11:13

KnittedCardi · 02/08/2024 09:33

The IOC are not fit for purpose. Off post, but the Chinese team are again involved in doping controversy. They apparently ate tainted beef. The same defense used in Tokyo. They are winning and winning well beyond the "norm". The IOC is accepting their defense. I don't think the IOC is fit for purpose in any of these areas of contention.

Yes too many of these events and the Olympics will be no more as people won't want to compete

WickedSerious · 02/08/2024 11:16

NotBadConsidering · 02/08/2024 10:30

I just caught a question on the boxing. Usual nonsense about trying to “balance” inclusion and fairness. Typical skirting the issue. It can’t be done Mark!

There won’t be a single one of these daily briefings that will offer any concession that there’s a problem. Deny, deny, deny.

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Isn't it strange how 'inclusion and fairness' always makes things less inclusive and fair for women?

Proudtobeanortherner · 02/08/2024 11:18

Tandora · 01/08/2024 22:38

No. They are legally recognised as female, and treated/ recognised as such by the medical practitioners who support them.. the nhs website refers to women and girls with CAIS. If you met a woman with this condition in real life you would have no question she was female. This is because, although women with CAIS have a male karyotype, they have a female phenotype. I suggest that you do some proper reading and educate yourself, before you just continue to offer strong opinions on this subject.

Edited

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Please don’t flame me as I confess that I’m struggling to understand all the science but if they have the XY chromosome doesn’t that mean that their body has gone through at least some of the “male” changes that relate to puberty and that this is where the advantage stems from or does that never happen?

RoyallyEFFEDOFF · 02/08/2024 11:18

Why does everything have to be inclusive? I don’t see the benefits of XY Males, intersex or otherwise entering women’s sports

If Khelif wants to be a boxer then he should be put in the male category or not fight at all

namechangeforgoodreason · 02/08/2024 11:19

This is my take. Probably going to get me cancelled but c'est la vie, innit.
substack.com/home/post/p-147254722?r=36x6j&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web

ThisNoisyTealLurker · 02/08/2024 11:26

I am a trans ally but it does extremely unfair and more thought should have been put in to this. I feel that trans athletes do have an unfair advantage but it’s also unfair that they shouldn’t be able to compete either. Could trans women and trans men compete in their own categories? Surely that would be fairer.

FOJN · 02/08/2024 11:29

namechangeforgoodreason · 02/08/2024 11:19

This is my take. Probably going to get me cancelled but c'est la vie, innit.
substack.com/home/post/p-147254722?r=36x6j&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web

That is gloriously funny, sarcastic and very, very British.😁

Thulpelly · 02/08/2024 11:30

Fetlocksblowininthewind · 02/08/2024 00:58

It really is very clear cut. Sex is binary, DSDs fall into either male or female categories.

The Y chromosome only ever occurs in males and never in females regardless of secondary sex characteristics which may appear to look like female presenting genitalia.

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So you’re saying that you can’t really know if someone is biologically male or female unless you know which chromosomes they have?

FOJN · 02/08/2024 11:34

ThisNoisyTealLurker · 02/08/2024 11:26

I am a trans ally but it does extremely unfair and more thought should have been put in to this. I feel that trans athletes do have an unfair advantage but it’s also unfair that they shouldn’t be able to compete either. Could trans women and trans men compete in their own categories? Surely that would be fairer.

There is no evidence that either of the male boxers are trans.

Yes a separate category for trans people would seem reasonable, no one thinks they should be denied the opportunity to compete in elite sport.

You describe yourself as a trans ally but seem unaware that saying trans identified males have an unfair advantage in female sport is very transphobic. Be careful where you share such opinions or you might be cancelled!