Having an opinion on friend changing their kid's name

[Tinnedsalmonburgers]

I have a very good friend who has had a very shitty relationship with her sons father. Their son is three and the dad is a douchebag: all of the things, in and out when he feels like it, left my friend when baby was little kept pulling her strings about getting back together, falling through. Unreliable, emotionally manipulative, using time with the kid as a way to punish her, don’t even get me started on the child support—- anyway, agreed by all he’s a knob jockey.

anyway for the last 6 months he’s barely been around and my friend is accepting that he will never change and she’s doing this thing on her own. She’s stopped feeding into his drama and by all accounts he’s moved on to harass some poor other bugger.

my friend recently revealed she plans to change her sons surname to her last name, while to this point (and on his birth certificate) he has his dads.
we’re pretty good mates so I let her know my opinion (very gently and tactfully mind) that understandably it must piss her off that his name is ever present but this is a three y.o who has always had this name and it’s his name as well as pork knuckles.

I suggested it might be a decision she’s making in how she feels angry and she might regret it later if kiddo is upset that she did it and might be better to wait till he’s older and can choose for himself.

this was not well received and I’ve definitely upset her. I know we’re good enough to let it cool off for a week or two and il go round and say sorry I should have kept my mouth shut not my business but secretly sorry not sorry I said what I said.

am I unreasonable to think she should keep kids surname ?
does anyone have any experience of doing this (little people name change) and can share a nugget of wisdom with me?
I told her she’d probably need legal advice anyway as I guess she can’t just do it off her own back anyway, or maybe she can I don’t know

I would if I were her. Don't have a scooby about the legal ramifications though.

I have a friend who was so disgusted with his absentee/crap dad that he took his wife's surname when they got married.

I don't know about the legalities of whether he could block it, but if she can she absolutely should. It's an arse changing your name when you're older, as everyone's who's ever done it will attest to. He's 3. He has very little concept of his surname, and even if he does, he's 3, he'll have spent more time with his new name before he can even write it. They're adaptable little buggers, he'll get used to it within a few days. And the benefits of having them both with the same name are enormous, for travel, for identification, for anything requiring parental consent. I've got friends who had different names to their kids, it got very wearing having to constantly prove they were the parent.

I don't really understand what you see as the issue here?

YANBU to have an opinion and share it if you were invited to, you would be U to make a big deal of it or keep pushing your opinion.
There are pros and cons to both - the thing about travel and parent/child having different names is an issue sometimes even if you've never experienced it, and it could be an issue in an emergency (especially overseas with a language barrier).
Her son will always have to explain about the name change in certain paperwork (I think, though there may be an exception if it's changed while he's a minor?) so the main thing I'd advise as a friend is she shouldn't throw out all paperwork with ex's name on it if she was considering that.
Neither decision will have a massive impact on his life, plenty of people deal with both situations. She may hate being referred to as Ms Ex's Name or getting things addressed to The Ex's Name Family which some people will do if they only know the son's name, and that's a valid reason to change it IMO.

Of course YABU.

Firstly, she needs your support not judgment.

Secondly, he should have the last name of the parent who actually, you know, parents him.

In what world is it a good idea for him to keep his largely absent dad's name?

It’s not that I see it as an issue as such, I genuinely think she has decided this out of anger and hating writing the other persons name all the time - I’m not sure it will have any impact either way on her son u til he’s older- I wonder what his opinion might be when he’s older, in my experience a lot of teens with absent dads have some resentment towards the parent that stayed and how a name change without his consent would play out.

also as a previous poster had said and I had t considered, he will have to declare on everything that he has been known by a previous name anyway, which kind of negates the point surely?

anyway it’s her decision to make and I will support her but I’m curious as to so many people not giving advice or exploring issues with their friends like this?

Definitely absolutely no judgement.
a person can bother be supportive and offer a different perspective to a person they know deeply and closely.
i know for a fact that my friend feels supported by me in everything I do for her and her son.

OP I assume your friend isn’t married to this prince?

BUT is he named on the kid’s birth certificate as his father? I understand that gives him parental responsibility, which gives him certain powers/rights in respect of the child (eg she may need his permission to take the child abroad). PR is where many of the legal implications are.

I've got friends who had different names to their kids, it got very wearing having to constantly prove they were the parent

my children have different surnames and the oldest is 32. I have never had to prove that I am their mother. It will be far more “wearing” for the child to have to prove his change of name constantly.

Your friend will need the father’s consent to change the surname, or apply for a court order.

I changed mine in my early 20s and I've only ever had to declare my previous last name for my first passport and for DBS. It's really not onerous or worthy of consideration.

My son has a different last name to me and neither has that caused a problem.

OP, if he has PR she will need his consent.

I've never had to explain to anyone I am my dcs mum and not the child minder because we don't share a name. I've also never been called Mrs dc second name.

I know it can be a pain going abroad on occasion.

It might not have been a thing you've experienced, but it does happen to people sometimes at passport control. It happened to my old boss when she took her son to the US when he was little. My guess is that they probably question it occasionally, either at random or because there's something else they've noticed that makes them wonder.

It's a bit like having your bag searched at the airport or getting questioned about the length and purpose of your stay when you go through passport control. Some people fly a million times and never have those things happen, but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen to anyone else either.

The original post suggested all sorts of people would query.
in 14 years of schooling, health, travel, documentation applications, consent signatures etc etc not one receptionist, clerical staff, doctor, agent, immigration etc etc has ever raised an eyebrow at different surname. I’m sure it has happened on slight occasions to other people but I dare say society understands that not all mothers have the same name as their kids and nobody cares whether mothers are married anymore

That's good to hear! It was always a worry of mine when I changed my son's (first) name, but I don't think it will ever crop up, as it changed on his birth certificate, rather than by deed poll and his old name hadn't been used for anything official yet.

Would you be comfortable to share why you decided to change his name? And whether you had any reservations at the time? How old was he?

Declaring a previous name isn’t a hassle really (I changed my first name) and he’ll get used to it.

However, with him on the birth certificate to do it officially she’ll need his permission.

She may also find schools and doctors surgeries won’t let her change it as easily to a “known as” name as they used to - primarily because if he objects to them it could pull them into any hassle. Things like a passport will have to be in his official name.

@Tinnedsalmonburgers i suffered from name regret because we didn't choose the one I had wanted for years. He was 6 months so didn't know his name. I think about it a lot still and it bothers me but I'm so glad his name is what it is. The name regret caused my PND. This went away immediately once we'd changed it. There were various reasons I wasn't happy with the previous name and I thought he wouldn't like it too (the biggest reason!)

Also those saying she needs permission - is that only the case when changed by deed poll? When my son's name was changed (under a year old) it didn't require both parents to give permission.

If he's on the birth certificate she won't be able to do it without his permission anyway. My friend has two kids with an absolute deadbeat who doesn't have contact with them and she went to court to try change their names. The judge wouldn't allow it as he hadn't given permission.

A genuine question to people saying he'd have to declare his original name all the time... why? Specifically, why is it different to a woman changing her name when she gets married? I can count on one hand the number of times I've had to declare my maiden name in over a decade of being married.

I am genuinely interested in the answer to this, I haven't a clue. Additionally, is this an issue experienced by people changing their children's surname to their family name when they get married, or double-barrelling?

It should have required both parents if they were both named on the birth certificate as a name change requires permission of all parties with LR.

Are you married? That can also come into play (although it shouldn’t technically for a change) as one or other of you can register.

@fpurplea it won't be 'all the time' but I can imagine he might forget that he has a previous name, especially since he wouldn't have ever known it. Perhaps it's a non issue anyway though, as he was a child when it was done? It won't he on a lot of official things yet?

We are married yes. He did give his permission to me but yes, it was all done via email and the registrar didn't contact him at all!

Thank you! A name is such an emotive thing hey? Probably more for everyone around you than you yourself! I’m glad you got your happy name ending!

It’s not constantly but for official things like passports, driving licenses and DBS checks you have to declare previous names, similar to declaring a maiden name.

Some people think you can just change a child’s name and the old name vanishes forever and that’s not the case - I went to school with someone who didn’t realise until we were 16 that the surname she’d used since 2 wasn’t actually on her birth certificate as her Mum just never ever used it or mentioned it ever again!

Why would you say that when instead you could be a good friend and support her perfectly reasonable decision?