For voting Tory

[Whatismypasswordthen]

I know what the Tories are and no, I don't like it. But I'm a woman, I have daughters and I come from generations of women who've been abused and dismissed because of their sex. I want better for my girls but I can't do it on my own. I need a government who will (at least give lip service to) supporting me. Am I a Tory? no. But the last thing women need is to be fighting their own government for basic recognition, so Tory it is.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2024/apr/16/uk-culture-secretary-urges-ban-on-transgender-athletes-competing-in-female-only-events

Ok you have substantive words for some posters but not for others.

What is it about women wanting women to be treated as a sex class that bothers you?

@TooBigForMyBoots

you have accused me of not addressing substantive points.

I have some?

Do you think that men are women in certain circumstances?

Do you think women should be treated as fully human when it comes to our rights and needs?

Do you think that teenage girls should be forced to change in public changing rooms with transwomen with a penis?

Do you think women should be forced to accept rape crisis care alongside or from males?

Do you think women should be forced to accept competing against trans women in sporting competitions in the same sex category?

Why do you think getting rid of the Tories equals getting rid of women's sex based rights?

I think voting in Labour as it currently stands is a vote against women's sex based rights.

Why shouldn't I?

They expelled women with views that I hold from their party!

Reform UK, SDP, Party of Women are the choices for the single issue voter. Anyone who claims to vote Tory because of the trans shitshow the Tories inflicted on us is voting on the single issue of the candidate having Conservative beside their name on the ballot.

No.
Yes.
No.
No.
No.

All these things happened under and because of the Tory government. That's why they need to go.

Great but why doesn't it concern you that by voting in Labour you are voting actively for the opposite of your belief system? As the LP stands they say -

Yes
No
Unsure/ legal women is a grey area.

Yes
Yes

Which is the polar opposite of both of our individual belief systems.
Where we differ is that I think that they should be put to task on this now.

@TooBigForMyBoots

Anyone voting Tory on this issue is just looking for justification to vote Tory, which they would have done anyway, regardless.

I'm not a Tory voter. Never have and never will.

But I can't vote for Labour as they currently stand either so plan to spoil the ballot.

What I don't understand is why you think that women's concerns shouldn't be addressed?

If you are so keen that women's issues be addressed, why will you abstain rather than vote Reform?

Because I don't agree with their politics!

Is it too much to ask for mainstream political parties to centre women?

I don't think so.

We form 51% of the population. We are not 'non men' , we count.

What I don't understand is why you think that women's concerns shouldn't be addressed?

Don't you think a lot of women's concerns will be addressed by a proper funded NHS, education, public services, court system and economy?

'Knowing what a woman' is doesn't pay the heating bills or puts food on the table or gives you a GP appointment.

So you're willing to throw women and children's rights under the bus because you don't agree with their other policies? I thought this was import6to you.

No I don't think they can be adequately addressed when women can't be defined without including some men in the definition.

A properly funded NHS that doesn't recognise women without including some men can't assess the needs of adult human female properly.

A properly funded Education system that sees some boys as girls excludes some girls - there is already evidence of girls school refusing when on periods because they don't want boys in their toilets etc. Girls refusing to drink is also an issue for the same reason.

Public services - well how can we tell which ones women need if we can't define women. Public toilets that are now mixed sex exclude vulnerable women etc etc.

Court system - if a woman is raped should she be expected to call her rapist she if he identifies as such?

Economy - women are screwed without gender ideology. How can we measure the failures for women in terms of opportunity or pay if we can't be defined as a sex class?

Yep, just more Tory lies and bullshit.🙄

lol. you so want to us to be right wing you are pushing that way.

The left has failed women wholesale and comments like this are part of the problem.

You ARE prepared to throw women under the bus in the name of trans rights if not you would ask Labour to move over rather than women.

Is that what you would tell a woman who cannott afford to eat or heat or access a GP or has to wait for up to 8 years for her rape case to go to court or who can't leave her abuser because the local refuge has shutdown?

I would tell her to vote for the party that serves her interests the best.

I'm not trying to convince anyone to vote Tory.

I think you have misunderstood my posts.

I am asking Labour voters to ask questions of Labour about these issues that impact the woman that you have described.

If her abuser is a man and she ends up in a refuge do you think she should have to be in a refuge with men who say they are women?

All of these issues are interlinked.

Women deserve to be treated as fully human. Women need to put ALL political parties to task on this.

That is the point of my posts.

Exactly

A properly funded NHS means women are healthy enough to fight for their rights.

A properly run education system gives girls a voice and listens to them. It also frees mothers up to fight for women's rights instead of fighting for their children's education in building that are collapsing.

Women should be able to get their rapists prosecuted and put away. Something that is deeply traumatic and nigh on impossible at the minute.

As for the Economy, women are more able to fight for their rights when they have a functional roof over their heads and food in the cupboard.

I am a feminist. My feminism centres the wellbeing of women. Not the actions of transfolk.

Who are the women?

Who are the girls?

We need meaningful definitions to have rights that protect us.

I agree with your other points.

Apart from trans folk. What they do is up to them so long as it doesn't impact women and children.

Put simply women's and girls rights don't exist if women and girls mean any human who says they are one.

I realise that conceptually that is difficult but it is playing out in real time.

Which humans have been vilified and lost jobs for speaking out for women's rights in the 'trans age' ? Clue they are the women.

Which humans benefit from the redefintion of women's rights to include men? Clue they are the men?

If you are standing up for the rights of the men and shouting down women who point it out rather than shouting down the laws that cause this and the politicians who would continue it then you are an activist.

Who are the women?
Who are the girls?

Who do you think? All the women and girls in the UK. Do you need me to preface women and girls with something in order for you to understand who I'm talking about?

Labour say some women and girls have penises?

Or have you forgotten that?

I'm jot talking to Labour. I'm talking to you @lifeturnsonadime.