To think people shouldn’t have new babies when there’s so many unresolved issues with older kids

[YaMuvva]

Yes it’s very judgy but I actually despair at rate of which some people are having new children when they already have problems with their other children.

I say this because there is a girl in DD’s class (year 6, this girl is 10) that is an absolute nightmare. DD only started her new school in September because we relocated and several other girls warned her about this child. Nevertheless, DD is naive/too nice and befriended her to her detriment. I had to get VERY arsey with the school before they actually did something about the fact this girl was calling DD nasty names every day (ugly, fat etc - DD is actually skinny and this girl is overweight), making fun of the fact DD has learning support, shoving past her hard (she’s much bigger than my DD) but never hurting her badly or obviously enough to raise suspicion from teachers she always does an ‘oops didn’t see you there’ thing, and teaching DD very inappropriate things (for example she taught DD a ‘blow job’ gesture 😡). If DD didn’t one day behave however this 10yo liked - such as didn’t play with her that day - the 10yo, who has a TikTok account, would make TikTok’s about her even naming her (I actually pulled her aside in the playground and told her to stop). I know because I found her and follow her!

I didn’t like to ban DD from being friends with anyone as I think it’s important that they navigate friendships themselves but because my DD is gullible this girl would make her feel like shit for 4 days then be sweetness and light on day 5 and DD would say “Oh no she’s apologised and she is sorry for what she did.” I just thought the situation was too toxic. So I have said to DD that she isn’t to go anywhere near this girl and if I found out she did she’d be punished. The mums of other girls experiencing the exact same with their DDs and this child have said the same to their girls. This 10yo has been the same since infants apparently And has a long rap sheet of bullying, inappropriate behaviour and nastiness.

Anyway this 10yo has an interesting family tree. Her parents (who are fully aware of what she is like because I’ve told them, as have others, as have the teachers) were married and had her and her older sibling. They then split up, the mum met a new man and had a baby who is now 3. She then split with him, had a new baby with an even newer man, this baby is 6 months old. The dad remarried and had another child who is now 6, they divorced and him and his new wife, wife no 3, have just had a baby a few days ago, the dad was showing the baby off in the playground at pick up.

I suppose I’m angry because she shoved past my DD again today in the corridor and hurt her shoulder and I’m fucking sick of all this never ending. I’m here fretting my backside off about my my DD getting picked on and her bully’s parents are just in the business of churning out more and more kids. Surely a half decent parent whose existing children have serious problems would prioritise that rather than just constantly changing partners and popping out more?

DH’s sister did the same but on a different level. She split up with her DH (whom she had 2 kids with) and immediately started dating a colleague. She was pregnant within three months of them dating, they weren’t using protection because it’s a ‘mood killer’. Her existing teen and pre-teen were really hit hard by their parents split and within 4 months they were meeting a new partner and preparing to welcome a half-sibling. My niece, who was a pre-teen when this all happened, is very close to us now as a young adult and the anger she feels at her mum moving on and having family no 2 in less than a year of her splitting with her dad has just about broken her, and they barely have a relationship. She feels her mum never considered her or her sister in her plans post-split and I’d have to agree with her.

AIBU to think people should get their houses in order before they bring new people into their kids lives - partners AND babies? I feel that particularly with DD’s bully it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure out that a lot of her issues will stem from so many changes and inconsistencies in her life, and it’s people like my DD and the other girls in year 6 paying the price for that.

Also, OP, I'd mention the child's TikTok account to the safeguarding lead.

This is all sorts of wrong.

This. Sick of people having babies they can't afford. Both of those parents have 4 children each. My husband and I both earn six figure salaries and can't afford more than 2. Probably because we pay for people like them!!

It is appropriate to steer clear, to warn others, and also to report the problematic elements you have commented on to the school safeguarding lead (and also perhaps to the local social services).

It isn't a case of one or the other here, and the parents are not 'ganging up'.

YANBU

I think people assume their kids don't need them much as they get older but they are wrong. My 9 year old for example needs emotional support and attention from me but in a different way from when he was 2. Just because he can play upstairs without my supervision doesn't mean he doesn't need me.

Only today I noticed a group of kids roaming around the village unsupervised when they are too young for that tbh. and, surprise surprise, they are the ones who disrupt their classes at school.

Children need attention from their parents and when they don't get it, that often has a detrimental effect on their behaviour. Children with lots of siblings and a chaotic lifestyle are less likely to get the attention they need to thrive.

I am a single mum and I have no desire to blend my family / have more kids. I really think it would be detrimental to my children. Yet the amount of people who have said "oh it would be lovely if you met someone else and had another baby"

Interesting how everyone who seems to be in agreement is only using blended or re-partnered families as an example.

what- no married people have children too soon after each other- or do problem children only exist as a result of divorce.

Except you absolutely could afford that many children if you had the same lifestyle. I seriously doubt someone with four kids on benefits owns their own home or is having a two week ski holiday every year.

can’t believe people are still churning out the “people have kids for the benefits” bullshit. Nobody actually is stupid enough to truly believe that by now, true god.

You’re getting a lot of unnecessary stick on here. She sounds bloody awful and I’d hate it if I were you too. Sorry your poor daughter is going through this! I totally agree with people churning more kids out… it’s because they’re completely ignorant!

Meant nicely, your post is all about what you think of a load of people and very little about what your daughter is actually feeling.

It's a shame you have not mentioned how to bolster her own abilities to deal with people like this, because she is growing up and needs to practice skills of brushing off, avoiding, compromising, blanking, supporting, understanding.
At her age you ought to take a big step back and allow her to feel her way around relationships and make decisions for herself.
Not "allowing" her to mix with people is a complete recipe for disaster when her teens come, and I worry it will backfire on you, with her purposefully seeking out relationships to challenge you, rather than growing into relationships where she flourishes.
Stand back, Stop judging others. Give your kid a shed load of hugs and treats after a bad day. Rather than denigrating others, use that breath to remind her how great she is. Then send her back in the next day with the promise that some people are not nice but there are always nice ones out there somewhere, keep looking. And stop there.

@CultOfRamen www.thetimes.co.uk/article/i-earn-more-than-100k-im-paying-for-everyones-free-childcare-nc2npxxm7

It's true. People in mine and my husbands salary band are hit strongly with benefits system taxes, might not touch the sides when you earn £150-200k but we don't get a single hour free childcare. We pay £4,300 nursery fees for our children, we have no family support, we pay wrap around care if we need to work, yes we own our house and go on holidays but we don't have indispensable budget. I get taxed 45%.

💓💓That’s horrific I’m so sorry you experienced that. I don’t think people appreciate how deep bullying cuts even into adulthood

I’m 100% certain someone with 4 kids living on benefits doesn’t have an indispensable budget either.
your anger at your economic situation is in the wrong direction.
look up.

Because the bullying relied heavily on my DD engaging with her. The school have seperated them physically, and I’ve banned her from engaging with the bully.

Like I said DD is gullible and the bullying, which deeply upset her, was peppered with love bombing from the bully, which essentially tricked DD into thinking she was actually a friend because she was thrilled when this girl gave positive attention rather than negative (think Mean Girls when they all hate the nasty side of the most horrible girl but also crave her attention). I took away the opportunity for the latter to happen.

I think it’s made a significant difference yes.

@CultOfRamen they might have more money if they stuck to two children. I wonder if OP can share weather these parents both work full time like me and DH do? If not, That's why they don't have a disposable income.

Back to OPs point, why do people have children when they can't look after the ones they have.

You're right. I am annoyed. Not only do I don't qualify for a single hour free childcare because of my salary and yet because of my salary I am taxed more to subsidise other people's 15 hours free childcare and the rest.. I'm not the only one if this article has made it into The Times.

Whether

What would you do then?

Oh if it’s in the times then my bad yes, all of your problems are the fault of poor people with lots of kids.

Sadly your DD is going to come across many more people like the bully you describe in her life. Bullies don’t grow out of bullying they just become more subtle and clever about how they go about it and pick their victims. You’re doing your daughter a disservice by helicoptering in and rescuing her. How will she learn the skills to step away and/or judge how she feels about the treatment she receives from others - good and bad - if you manage every negative scenario for her? There’s something to be said for letting children sort of their own relationships. And also for not sitting in judgement of the choices made by others.

I’ve mentioned it to her teachers, who did seem concerned but ultimately they have no control or say over social media. But I do hope safeguarding steps are being taken as yes the blow job gesture is seriously concerning at age 10!

@CultOfRamen I'm not going to pity people who don't own their homes, don't go on two week holidays, or have a disposable income because they choose not to work and have 4 children. Nor am I going to compare myself to them. I will however feel like OP does, that they are irresponsible for having so many children when they can't control, pay for or look after the ones they have. Even elements like a poor diet can hinder behaviour, what do they live on food wise? I would imagine a beige diet filled with e-numbers, again have less kids and feed them better.

You’re not wrong op and it is frustrating because ultimately this is all the parents fault, not the young girls who home life has clearly been erratic and probably caused her some issues. The problem is that her parents probably had similarly dysfunctional childhoods, so to them it is somewhat normal.

Whilst it is obviously frustrating for you, I think your daughter is clearly the lucky one who has a steady home life and a mum looking out for her so try to remember that when you get angry at this girl. By all means continue to address issues with the school but I think judging/getting angry with the girl who her parents is just going to eat you up and they will be non the wiser.

I think people assume their kids don't need them much as they get older but they are wrong. My 9 year old for example needs emotional support and attention from me but in a different way from when he was 2. Just because he can play upstairs without my supervision doesn't mean he doesn't need me.

@cadburyegg this is so true. I was actually having this conversation with my friend the other day. The toddler says felt long and relentless and I longed for the days when they weren’t as needy. But now she’s 10 it’s a different kind of need and in a way it’s harder because what she needs isn’t always obvious.

Im in early peri-menopause so unlikely to have another baby but even if I did want to (and there’s always a bit of broodiness lurking!) there’s no way I’d dream of it because my DD is really gonna need me, undistracted and readily available, to battle the impending teen years which I already know are gonna be tough. I just couldn’t juggle a toddler and be the mum she needs.

Im not saying all mums of 10yo’s shouldn’t have other kids, every child is different. I didn’t feel like I ever needed my mum during the teens years but that’s because she wasn’t the kind of mum I could open up to, but my DD is very different as am I and I think she’s the type who, if she thought I was too busy, wouldn’t want to bother me.

OP I think you're doing the right things and I completely agree about the judge pants around these family set ups, its bonkers.

I'm navigating something similar with bullying currently and first thing I did was to tell my DC to stay away from the bully and not interact. If he was in a cycle that you describe with your daughter I'd be reacting the same way and doing everything to keep them apart.

I know approaching the bully in the playground is risky but i love that you did that. You're showing your DD that you're sticking up for her, it's so valuable.

Bullying has long lasting effects and while it's sad that some kids have crappy lives that they end up bullies in the first place, that's not your problem.

Cant believe some of the responses on this thread.

TBF, research shows that children are more likely to be ‘problem’ children if they’ve experienced a family split. And people who are together and only have kids with each other - yes there is such thing as have too many and too close together. Look at that ‘kids and counting’ family, it’s totally selfish behaviour. but they provide consistency that someone constantly meeting new partners and having babies with them doesn’t provide

Some people have children because ‘they love babies!!’ I’m sure they forget that babies grow in to children 🙄

Ah the imaginations of the down trodden hard done by six figure salary earners 😂😂😂