To feel sorry for my PILs and think they could have been granted a quick baby cuddle?

[MumDadBingoBIuey]

BIL and his wife have just had their first baby a couple of weeks ago. Delivery and went swimmingly by all accounts, home birth, no complications that we’ve been told about.

We were all told that they didn’t want any visitors at all for the first two weeks while they “bond as a little family”. Except it turns out SILs Mum and sister have been going round pretty much every day has been round as well.

My lovely MIL has been so excited about this baby- she’s knitted some beautiful clothes and blankets for the baby, put together a little hamper of things for SIL and batch cooked and portioned up food to put in their freezer. She did the same for DH and me after each of our DC was born.

Yesterday they were finally permitted to go and visit. SILs Mum and sister were both there when they arrived. FIL pretty much immediately was asked to fix and sort out various things around the house (he’s good with that sort of thing, BIL had no practical skills whatsoever). So off he went to do that.

MIL had taken round lunch and a home baked cake and was asked if she’d mind getting it ready. Baby ended up waking for a feed just as they were all about to eat so SIL fed her (she’s bf’ing) and MIL put her food in the oven to keep it warm. Once finished baby was immediately handed over to SIL’s Mum to cuddle while SIL ate. SILs Mum continued to hold baby while SIL opened the gifts that MIL had brought round for them.

MIL, feeling like a bit of a spare part at this point, asked if there was anything that needed doing, anything she could help with etc. Was asked if she’d mind emptying and reloading dishwasher. So she does that, gives the kitchen a wipe round, takes baby laundry out of tumble dryer and folds it up. Makes tea/coffee for everyone.

Goes back in sitting room, now SILs sister is holding baby, they’re all chatting about some relative’s marital situation while BIL and FIL watch the rugby. Once the match is over BIL starts saying how they need to start getting ready for dinner etc and basically hinting that it’s time for PILs to leave. No sign of SILs Mum and sister getting ready to go.

So they get their bits together and go home, having put in some bracket things to stop the garden fence falling down and fixed a dripping tap (FIL) and made lunch for everybody and cleaned up (MIL). But neither of them were offered to hold the baby for even a few minutes.

We’re round at PILs now for Sunday lunch and they just seem so sad about it. They’re not pushy types at all and are wonderful grandparents to my DC. I just think it wouldn’t have killed BIL and SIL to at least let them give baby a little cuddle?

It appears it did!! 🤔🤷

Well this is just bloody awful :( your poor PiL.

I despise this new type of parenting, like the baby is a possession rather than family member. This whole 'locking ourselves away, no one is allowed near! Do not touch the baby, do not breathe near the baby' and so on. It's just miserable.

I'm the 'MIL' in this situation & though 'DIL' is more reliant on her mum (who is fab!) than me I don't feel remotely shut out & we were able to visit them in hospital the day DGS was born. It's very natural to lean towards the maternal family if mum is primary carer - but not to the degree in OPs post, it's heartbreaking.

Fgs, babies are exciting! It's the literal continuation of the human race & your own family

Comprehension doesn't really help if you say something so different.
How would comprehension help anyone to understand guests are there to help out not cuddle the newborn actually meant Guests should visit with the intention of helping the new parents

The mother might feel comfortable letting them hold the baby and might not, depending on how close she is to the guests. Presumably fathers don't get a say, maybe they feel uncomfortable with someone the mother feels comfortable with or vice versa. No wonder we end up with mothers on here moaning that men don't face up to their responsibilities as a parent because they don't actually have status as a parent.

Well, yes… if you’re not able to see the similarity between those two phrases then… that’s a you problem I’m afraid

When fathers are able to grow and carry babies for 9 months, then they can have a say about who gets to hold them as tiny newborns. Until then, it’s down to the mother. There are plenty of ways for men to ‘face up to their responsibilities’ without dictating to mothers who they should hand their newborn over to when they aren’t comfortable.

All my opinion of course, but clearly something that a lot of new mothers agree with considering how many entitled grandparents posts get posted on mumsnet.

Not everyone can automatically guess this social etiquette

I honestly think they can. They don’t come more socially inept than me and even I know that when grandparents meet their grandchild for the first time they expect to, you know, have some kind of contact with them.

Well it is your problem if people don't understand what you mean or if you keep changing what you mean.

Of course fathers should have a say about who gets to hold their baby, yes it is theirs as well, mothers don't own babies although plenty seem to think they do. It means they need to agree about who they are both comfortable with holding their baby, why should someone hold the baby if it makes the father uncomfortable?

Did you realise that every single grandmother has been a new mother at least once in her life. This generation haven't invented that.

Because the father didn’t grow and carry the baby for 9 months. They don’t share the same bond as baby and mother. The relationships are not equal. You can’t have given birth or you would understand this.

I’m aware that a woman who has children that then have children becomes a grandmother, yes. But thankfully the attitude of mothers nowadays is drastically different to the boomer generation who are now grandparents. It’s no longer ok to look down on breastfeeding, leave babies to cry, or hit children, thank god.
So no, this generation hasn’t invented being mothers but they have done a far better job.

Goodness me @ttcat37 if that attitude is typical of the generation I helped raise I'd have to agree with you.

DM is ill and I go look after her, I can see what needs doing so get on with it.

SiL's DM is ill and I assume she is also being looked after by SiL.

Mil is very ill but we've always been a visitor in her house, so it's very awkward now to help out. Sit nicely, drink tea, don't linger, all enforced by Fil.

So I've been thinking about this situation and I think it's a clash of how different the family dynamics are, one lot just hangs out and would ask to hold baby, the other is more formal and waits.

It feels unfair but it's not, it's just the way things are.

It remains to be seen if you’ve done a better job. You’ve barely started. Come back to us in 20 years when you’ve finished.

We didn’t hit our children or leave our babies to cry and breastfeeding wasn’t “looked down on”, in fact the incidence has always been higher in middle class mothers and increases with level of education.

You are talking bollocks again. I’m a member of the ‘boomer’ generation. Breastfeeding was no ‘looked down on’ ( by whom, for heaven’s sake?). Most of my friends exclusively breastfed, it was promoted as being best for baby. I fed my DTs for a year.
We did not hit our children, or routinely leave them to cry.
You may congratulate yourselves on doing a better job, but I’m
not sure you have evidence for your claim.

At least we let our mums and Mil’s hold our babies @Pottedpalm. And our midwives didn’t give us shit advice to the contrary.

i Said before that I don’t think it should be different rules for her parents and his parents. Now that is unreasonable in my opinion. But just in terms of holding a baby I would respect the wishes of the mother. I wouldn’t feel entitled to ‘cuddle’ a newborn. They are the most precious thing to a mother that has just birthed that baby and may not want to pass it round to different people. I’m a firm believer of it’s your baby your choice … a mother who has just given birth shouldn’t have to worry about offending people by not offering them a hold. And whether people like it or not, the mother is more likely to feel comfortable with her own mother holding the baby rather than an in law

Obviously but I don’t quite see your point?

History contradicts you I’m afraid. Your generation are renowned for those things. Perhaps not you personally, but generationally, yes.

I forgot to mention that another really common attribute of boomer parents is the complete refusal to accept they were anything less than perfect at parenting. Your generation are famous for being scathing about breastfeeding, believing smacking kids is fine, and generally being dismissive of children’s’ thoughts and feelings simply because they are children (and therefore you know best). If you’re not aware of this, how? You’re on mumsnet. We see examples of this daily.
Millennials have learned to parent by boomers’ mistakes.

Things is @ttcat37.... .

"Millennials have learned to parent by boomers’ mistakes"

So you won't make the same mistakes. You'll just make different ones.

I strongly suspect ttcat is posting nonsense provocatively purely for attention and I suggest everyone else doesn't rise to it.

Well said

The part I find shitty is that the mum and sister were there during your PILs first meeting with the new baby.

I don’t think it’s shitty that the mum and sister were exempt from the two week wait for visitors or that they asked your PILs to do chores.

Not sure why PIL had to do chores whilst DM and sister were there though

Have you got some actual evidence of that? Generationally I think you’ll find it was actually our parents. Dr Spock who was the child guru in the 1950s advocated leaving babies to cry. Incidentally did your parents hit you @ttcat37? Is that where you’ve got this idea from?

What a crazy derailment. Some parents back then were great, some were shit. Some today are great, some are shit.
HTH.
And of course a new Mum probably wants her Mum around when she’s vulnerable. But surely that does not mean excluding the MIL? Especially one who sounds as super-lovely and respectful as this one 🤦‍♀️

That’s really sad and quite cruel to exclude you like that.
I’m very close to my DD and DGS having done 99% of the childcare since he was 8 months old - but I have always gone out of my way to include the other set of Grandparents, much as I have grown to detest the other Grandma, huge toxic narcissist that she is.
I was always acutely aware that she was insanely jealous - I gave her the opportunity to have DGS more if she wanted - there was always an excuse why not but she loves to complain she doesn’t see enough of him - well it was her fucking choice to have him for a couple of hours once a week ( as long as it doesn’t interfere with her holidays) while I get up at 6.30 x 4 to go and do the school run so DD can go to work and I have him 3 times a week after school.
I couldn’t even be called Grandma to please her.
After what her precious ( when it suits her) Son has now done to DD and DGS ( cheated on her and left them) , I’ll have some choice words for her if/when I meet her again.

I think I'd have felt uncomfortable and vulnerable having my in-laws there in the very early days.

Not because they're not nice people but because I don't have a relationship with them where I can feel ok being totally myself. I couldn't let them 'take me as I am' in a way that maybe others could. It's more formal and a bit forced if I'm honest. Maybe that's how this new mum feels too?

They're also not the type of people to come round and help like this MIL did and I wouldn't ask so that was cheeky!