Best friend only wants to catch up with me (childfree) at kid-oriented venues

[PlaygroundSusie]

Hi all - I’m childfree, so I hope it’s ok for me to post here. But I’d really appreciate some advice/perspective from parents.

My best friend and I are both 38. Met at uni. She has two children, DS aged 7 and a DD aged 3. She and her kids come as a package deal. She chooses not to socialise without them. This is because (as she’s explained) she wants to cherish every moment while they are still young. She works part-time and her kids are in loads of activities, so family time is vitally important to her.

I respect her decision and understand her kids are her top priority. I am also fond of her children and enjoy seeing them. The problem arises in where we meet. My friend never wants to stop at home. She always wants to catch up at very child-friendly venues. Usually playgrounds, but sometimes places like petting zoos, children's museums, festivals aimed at pre-schoolers, etc.

This means her kids are usually excitable, and easily distracted, and tend to race around a lot. Or they need help navigating the slide, or want to be pushed on the swings, etc. About 80% of my time is usually spent watching or helping my friend parent her children, and only 20% is us actually catching up and having a proper conversation.

On the very rare occasions we meet at her house, it’s much better. The split is more like 50/50. I happily interact with her children for a bit, but then they drift off to their toys, backyard, etc, and my friend and I chat. But unfortunately, my friend and her kids get bored at home, and prefer to get out of the house. Cafes are occasionally an option if it’s raining, or too hot, but otherwise they want the playground or some other place specifically designed for kids.

At the risk of sounding horrible, I’m tired of always catching up at child-oriented venues. I’ve been doing this for years, and there seems to be no end in sight. I’ve reached my limit. We’re catching up this weekend, and I suggested meeting at a café in a park (I figured we could maybe have coffee then go for a walk afterward). Her response was: “DS7 and DD3 would prefer to meet you at the playground. So, the playground it is – LOL!” Again, I appreciate her children come first, but I did find this a bit frustrating. Shouldn’t the grown-ups get to choose the venue?

AIBU? Is there a polite way I could tell her I’m sick of always meeting at child-oriented venues, and that I’d vastly prefer to simply catch-up at her house or a café? Any other suggestions? I feel like such an awful friend for feeling this way!

That’s the bit that gets me. From the OP’s account her friend’s kids like going out. So even though they’d be absolutely fine at home her friend wants the meet up to be the kids’ first choice or nothing! Id find that very frustrating!!

OP, by your update, it sounds to me like she's very unsubtly letting you know that she no longer feels the need to prioritise your friendship: ie, she's happy to tie up meeting you with a park visit with her kids - but doesn't necessarily feel the two of you need an adult catch-up (if that makes sense).

I would cool the friendship but not before asking her if I'm right about the above.

And wait for her to get in touch for meeting up - if she never bothers, then you know where you are with her.
And if she does, then it's a good time to say that since you don't have kids the same age, you don't want to spend your free time always doing child related activities. It wouldn't hurt for her to hear that tbh - you might give her pause for thought. No friendship can survive without any compromise .
Most of us found parks and soft play type activities dull as shit when we were taking our own kids to them - it really is massively unreasonable to expect friends to do this with us and never ever do anything they want to do.

What do you want to talk to her about that doesn’t involve children?
There are so many sacrifices you have to make and an acceptance that your life, particularly before children are in preschool, has to be on the backfoot.

Have you ever stopped to think that she may not want to hear all your news? It reminds her of the days when she didn’t have responsibilities and could always put herself first? That it may sound frivolous and unmeaningful to her now? I remember one friend getting excited about going clubbing and getting drunk and hoping she’d meet the bloke she fancied. I was sad for wishing I had such trivial things to gush about as I had just had an early miscarriage and my youngest had croup which was really frightening. I was jealous but also couldn’t be arsed with her ‘frivolous’ news. Odd combination but the thought of having to go out and listen to her whilst feeling low and scared about my child being more distressed if I was not there as exacerbating the croup, was not appealing. What did I have to talk about that was exciting and ‘light’? Outwardly I was fine but it was all about my fears and absolute tiredness and acceptance I just had to get on with it. After I had a new successful pregnancy and my child grew out of croup and could verbally express himself, I relaxed and was able to enjoy life more.

Neither of you are right or wrong you are just in different places. You both want to meet under different circumstances. If you are true friends, in a few years time you’ll still be true friends. Give her time.

Sorry but I just can’t agree with this. The friend is completely dictating all arrangements based on her preferences. There is no consideration for OP and what she gets from this relationship.

I think you’ve come to a sensible decision on your own OP. And that was after a lot of compromising for her.

You are being massively rude and unreasonable to imply that any news a non-parent might have is frivolous and appropriate to air in front of children.

OP, sadly I think this friendship may have runs its course. You're only useful as a babysitter

this. what a completely weird post that was. Childfree people's lives aren't just frivolous waltzing through the world without any care, they can have as much, or far more going on than parents, and are equally deserving of time to talk about it. Besides which who said OP just wanted to impart her own news - they could talk about literally anything - world events, TV, people they know, houses, their romantic relationships, work, reminisce on their shared history.

Tbh pretty much any conversations are more interesting and worthy than how little Robbie is getting on with toilet training.

Interesting there’s two people that think I was rude. I think it came across to my friend back then. I was probably suffering from low level depression at the time - or maybe just overwrought (deaths in family, miscarriage, ill child, redundancy etc). I couldn’t see it. It’s only looking back that I realise there was a lot going on that made me not want chat about world events/romance relationships, and spend time away from my child who I was watching like a hawk. In the benefit of hindsight I realise when people are really stressed they become hypervigilant and that’s what I was trying to get over at the ‘feeling’ in the post. And reading between the lines it could be how OPs friend is feeling about lot letting the children out of her sight. I am not painting myself in any glory here - it’s how I honestly felt and coped with an incredibly stressful time.

What I was trying to convey was the OPs friend may not be in the right headspace (like I was not at the time). I did say neither OP or her friend is right or wrong. It was coming from a sense of my feelings at the time where I was unable to enjoy talking the stuff I had before - through mental and physical strain. I hope the OP can see how it’s not her but the fact that her friend probably can’t even articulate why her life is so unrelatable.

That a child-free life is not an important life is daft and not what I said. And, hopefully like me her friend will feel better in time and she can start going out again. That’s what I meant about giving her time.

@Tinysoxxx I get what you're saying, but I don't think the OP's friend is anywhere near where you were.

" The problem arises in where we meet. My friend never wants to stop at home. She always wants to catch up at very child-friendly venues. Usually playgrounds, but sometimes places like petting zoos, children's museums, festivals aimed at pre-schoolers, etc.

This means her kids are usually excitable, and easily distracted, and tend to race around a lot. Or they need help navigating the slide, or want to be pushed on the swings, etc. About 80% of my time is usually spent watching or helping my friend parent her children, and only 20% is us actually catching up and having a proper conversation." (my underlining)

As I said back in February (And still stand by) - "She's not catching up with you. She's requisitioning another pair of hands/eyes to care for her children. I'd be done with this. She's a user."

Thanks for all the messages of support. It's actually great to know I'm not being unreasonable. Funnily enough, I found out today that a couple of our old mutual friends dropped the rope with her a year or two ago, because they believed she was being too inflexible. Even more funnily, these mutual friends are mums of young children themselves!

I've seen a few people suggest that perhaps we just need to hit pause on our friendship, and see if she 'comes back' in a few years when her kids are older, and she's willing to do things like adults-only coffee catch-ups and the like. I have mixed feelings about this. On one hand it would be absolutely lovely to have my old friend back. But on the other hand, it would also feel like me being a bit of a doormat in 'taking her back', if that makes any sense? Anyway, will cross that bridge if and when it happens!

Yeah, nah, not sure whether I can do another seven years of kid-friendly venues only!

As to your other question, as to what would happen if I had younger kids and she had older kids - that's a tough one. I suspect we'd probably never see each other, due to the conflicting needs of the kids, and her reluctance to socialise on an adults-only basis.

People do this??? 😲

She has a husband, but she doesn't really let him look their kids, as she doesn't think he'll do it properly. Accordingly, he just tends to do his own thing.

I'm so sorry Tinysoxx, that sounds like you went through a really rough time. I agree with you that my friend and I are in different headspaces, and as a non-parent, I freely admit I have no idea what it's like to feel simultaneous overwhelming love and anxiety for a child, to the point where you don't want to let them out of your sight.

The thing is though, it's been going on for seven (nearly eight) years now. It's clearly not a phase with my friend, but more a permanent way of being.

Thanks for ‘getting it’.
I think there’s a lot going on with OPs friend that she won’t let anyone see.

The friend is hypervigilant to the point she won’t let her husband look after the kids. And she feels happier having more eyes on them. Why is she so stressed? Why does the husband do his own thing?

I am probably older than a lot of you on this thread. When you have the benefit of looking back and now realising how some people lived and interacted with their partners, I expect the friend is not living a happy life at the moment. Some of the most ‘devoted’ and ‘morally outstanding’ couples I know were/are anything but.

However, that’s not on the OP to help if the friend won’t help herself. I think, looking back, if I was the OP I would just be honest and say how you feel in a kind way. If the friendship picks up in a few years, that’s great.

Weird post! massively projecting I think and literally nothing to do with the OP's situation.

I mean "What do you want to talk to her about that doesn’t involve children?" 🤔🤔

OP, well done on standing your ground and standing up for yourself. It may well be that the friendship is done but I think overall it's going to be a relief not to have do anymore unpaid child minding in the guise of 'meeting up' any more.

Did you reply to her last message OP?

I completely agree. There's been no indication whatsoever that friend is anything other than fully happy to be joined at the hip to her DCs at all times. Nor that she "doesn’t go out" - she seems to go out plenty but only with the kids. Her choice of course and OP's choice not to play along anymore.

If OPs friend goes through life thinking that her children must be everyone's priority at all times, and that her friends lives and problems are completely unimportant in comparison to being a parent, she won't have any friends left at all before long!

@Tinysoxxx there are loads of things OP might want to talk to her friend about that isn't appropriate for children to listen to. If a friend cannot comprehend this, it doesn't bode well for their relationships. Not that the friend seems to have much time for listening to anything anyway, since 80% of the time is spent actively looking after the kids! It's massively unreasonable to expect the OP to put in time and effort to see her friend but to only ever get peripheral attention, around the children's needs. No friendship can survive one party's complete lack of effort.

She has a husband, but she doesn't really let him look their kids, as she doesn't think he'll do it properly. Accordingly, he just tends to do his own thing.

@PlaygroundSusie This is so similar to my friend whom I referred to. As others have said, it might be anxiety-related-I’ve suggested to my friend that she lets her husband take them to various activities, for example, and she reacts as if I’m mad! Whereas that’s normal for DH and I.

Anyway, let the friendship go now and if she gets in touch at some point, you can decide whether you want to revive it.

I don’t disagree. I just recognise the hyper vigilance and the distant husband as red flags.

I’d never expect my child-free friends to come to places like that for a catch up, it’s quite cheeky of her.

I don’t even want to go to playgrounds myself not to mind drag a child free friend there even once!

If the OP’s friend can’t leave children who are 3 and 7 for a few hours, I’d worry she will be absolutely devastated when they naturally want to hang out with their peers more.

IMO it’s good for children to see that their parents have their own lives and good to see healthy adult friendships.

Hi again OP.

I was in similar situation to you, and it didn't end well with my friend. I was really hurt when it ended.

However, I have just started ready a book called "Single at Heart" by Bella De Paulo. Its for people who actively choose to do other things with their life rather than being part of a couple. Its helped me (so far) understand how to navigate being around people who chose the more "traditional" set up without feeling like a spare part all time, and not feeling guilty when I set boundaries on what I want to do with my time.