She said I am insinuating her 4 year old is a pervert

[Strawberrybubbble]

Hello,

My 4 year old daughter has recently started using words to describe her private areas with words I have never used before.

In particular referring to her chest as boobies (not the most offensive I know but just not a word I or her father have ever used) and more grimly fanny.

I had a conversation with her last night just to find out where she had picked these words up - she said another 4 year old boy at her school (she used his name) kept asking her to show him her boobies and fanny. I told her she should not do this and they were hers and hers only.

Anyway, I told her father who has told his cousin immediately (he does have form for not keeping his mouth shut). Said cousin, is good friends with the 4 year old boys mum so it has now got back to her.

I was going to have a chat with her myself on Monday morning just to tell her what my daughter has said (I'd want to know - he has been saying this to 'all the girls' apparently).

Well, she has hit the roof. Said we are disgusting, we are implying her son is a pervert etc., we are wrong in the head, he is 4 years old.

That's absolutely not what we said - we questioned where they were picking up this language and where he had heard it.

Now, I know you can't take a 4 year olds word for certain every time but it is not anything we have ever said, she is not left to her own devices to watch anything unsupervised where she would have picked this up and is only ever looked after at nursery and by my parents (cannot imagine them using that language for a second). She was very clear in naming this boy.

Not sure where to go from here really. I would of liked to just let this mum know myself but my husband and his cousin have jumped in.

What would you make of this? My daughter is my oldest so not experienced this yet, not sure of a suitable reaction other than reminding her, her private parts are hers and hers only.

I don't think the OP has done anything wrong here, it is normal to discuss concerns with the child's father. It is her husband who has acted stupidly for spreading this around.

I can understand the other mother being upset that her DS is being gossiped about. But she shouldn't have approached OP, who should not engage with her directly. What's done is done & I think it should be reported to the school to handle.

You husband has really messed this all up and you’re the one receiving all the abuse from the other parent. From their perspective they kearnt about this third hand and is probably thinking that everyone is not talking about their child and how he’s going around asking to see girls private parts. I can see why she has oblast reacted even though I don’t think her ranting is warranted.

it’s not that unusual for kids to ask to see each others private parts, happened a lot when I was a kid in the 80s too. It’s because we are always told that it’s private, not for others to see, touch etc. and quite rightly of course. It does create a curiosity though but at 4 there is nothing sexual at all about it.

I hope no one takes this advice. NEVER “chill out” about new language etc. You don’t need to assume that abuse has occurred but if this woman hadn’t shown curiosity about the new language she might not have learned her child had been asked to expose herself. Children very very very rarely disclose sexual abuse so unless you parents get curious you might miss out on opportunities to find out about things that are going on for them.

The words she told you are not especially unusual or rude.
I was imagining something far worse before I read your whole thread.

Maybe the boy has picked up those words at home if he has older siblings?

I don't want to minimise what the boy did, but I do know it's very common and young children don't have the same boundaries or understanding that older children and adults have about bodies, and what is private.

I'd doubt very very much if a child as young as four was in any way 'sexualised' and understood the impact of what they were asking.

It can purely be curiosity, hard as that may be to accept or understand.

You should talk to the teacher, but I think posters saying this is a 'red flag' are overreacting, because the child is so young.

As it happens, I had something like that happen to me when I was in primary school ( a little boy exposed himself.) I told my mum who immediately went to see his mum ( a neighbour) and he was given a good telling off. School wasn't involved at all.

It's inappropriate and he needs to learn it's not socially acceptable, but it doesn't mean he is on a path to be an abuser of pervert.

Indicates means points to. I didn’t say it was definitely happening did I.

It wouldn't have been pile on of people suggesting she'd heard the words elsewhere because, as has been said 100 times now, the language doesn't matter. No-one would have thought that your four old was lying about this if she'd used words that you use at home! That's just not how it works.

I'm not confused about the order of events.

I'm sorry about the barrage of abuse from the other parent, but that's the fault of your thick husband, not anyone else.

I think you acted appropriately OP but your DH has inflamed the situation and the one who unfortunately made things difficult for you.

We don’t know what was said to the other Mum but clearly it wasn’t anything helpful and understandably put her back up it’s come to her through a 3rd party.

I don’t really understand why e.g. “Minnie” is supposedly an acceptable name for small girls to refer to their vulvas but “Fanny” grim, tbh

Nor do I, but it is,

OP - go the the school as others have advised.

This child may not be being abused, or have any idea what he is asking to see, but he has certainly been exposed to inappropriate conversations. films, computer games etc

For all the children's sakes, there needs to be a (gentle) investigation of this. Leave it to people who know what they are doing and how to approach it.

Also for all those saying it might not be sexual and may be curiosity, yes that’s a possibility, but there is another possibility that it could be a child who could display harmful sexual behaviour, hence why it’s so important to highlight it to professionals.

Oh wow.
I don't know why people are piling on you about your husband telling someone else. That would naturally happen. If I told my partner something like that about my Daughter, then there is a 100% chance that he would mention it to his family and friends.

I get that he's 4, but where has he come up with the idea to ask to see someone's 'fanny and boobies'. How weird.

The Mum obviously got massively defensive, whereas she should've just been mortified and spoken with her Son about boundaries.

Your husband needs to send that woman a message. He needs to tell her that this is best discussed through the school from now on but that you couldn’t ignore it as her son is asking to see your daughter naked, so it has to be investigated but he now sees he was wrong to discuss it with anyone else, that he should not have told his cousin and they should not have found out through gossip so he is sorry it happened that way and he will keep it confidential from now.

He does owe that family an apology, and he needs to grow the fuck up.

Is your husband normally a twat?! What a stupid childish thing to do.

I'm not surprised she was defensive, it's a sensitive topic. But you absolutely need to let nursery or school deal with this.

That is a rather stupid thing to say.

OP wasn't "spreading rumours" - she was discussing a situation with her husband. She may even have told him to keep his mouth shut. She wasn't "spreading rumours" by accident or design.

I think if it's got back to her through a chain of people then I'd be angry and defensive as well because I'd feel op and her dh should have come to me directly instead of gossiping about my child.

Your dh screwed up talking to the cousin op. First point of contact should have been the school and the other parents.

I'd still speak to the nursery and let them investigate. Meanwhile I'd be teaching dd the Swimsuit rule and how to act if anyone makes her uncomfortable in any way. No matter who they are.

I don't understand how other posters are not getting that OP mentioned the language as it was the thing that alerted her? Because it is not words they use within their family and household.

Far from being torn a new one for that, I actually think it's great you've been on the ball with it and asked the questions. So well done for that.

I won't parrot everyone else on what to do next, you've already stated what your plan of action is.

So I will just say good luck with it and thank you for taking it seriously. So many sadly do not.

https://shop.nspcc.org.uk/products/pants-activity-pack-1?variant=39763112722499

Look at pantasauras and the pants rule. I've done the workbook with my girls more than once.

Good grief, a 4 year old asking girls to show him their boobies and fanny! You need to go to the headteacher, not 'speak to the mum'. That is horrendous. My daughter is in reception and I would be absolutely furious if a boy in her class said that to her.

I can imagine exactly why the mother is annoyed. Someone she knows to be a gossip is telling her someone has told him her son is asking a small girl to show him her breasts and genitals and her parents are upset by that. She will be upset about gossip and concerned about her son and what might happen at nursery.

Your husband is stupid, so is his cousin- and I'd wonder who else they both have told.

Deal with it the right way through nursery who will know how to manage it appropriately and discreetly.

I’m in Scotland. Fanny is pretty rude I’d be pretty horrified to hear a kid say that.

Eh, if you’re in Scotland, that word gets used all the time. Quite often affectionately. I’m Scottish, I hate it, have never used it and would kill my kids for saying it but in a certain demographic, it’s an affectionate very normal term.

Be strong and clear when you go to the school OP.

I had the same situation years ago and my DD was gaslight and effectively told she was lying, in not so many words. I am still livid.

Not by children though. If you’re saying that word in front of children, even affectionately, you need looking at.

CoasttoCoastlines
It's still a potential red flag, even in a young child.

More harm is picked up by lots of puzzle pieces being put together than a child making a clear disclosure.

A child asking to see private parts and using a more adult word like fanny could be indicators of harm, which is why people have suggested speaking to school. It might be nothing, or it may be another piece of information that lines up with information they have already. The safeguarding lead is the best person to make that decision though.

Safeguarding is everyone's business.

Who else have your husband and his cousin told, OP? This started in your household and now it’s out there in public. Who else knows? Have you spoken to the cousin to try and make sure this stops and find out how far it has spread?

This boy is 4. Whatever he has done isn’t his fault, it’s come from somewhere. But now his name is out there and he is being talked about. I just can’t get my head around allowing a 4 year old boy to become a topic for adult gossip and entertainment.

The c word is also used affectionately in Scotland but it’s also not acceptable to be used in front of children.