Or are most men just disgusting?

[Falalalalaa]

Works Christmas party last night. Around 20 of us, pretty equal mix of men and women.

The men are field based so live all over the country, we only really see them at events like this. At least half of them, all married or with long term partners or children, were trying it on with a couple of the single girls from the office. They all had hotel rooms and we’re inviting them back, hands everywhere, making disgusting comments, it was just so seedy and sadly predictable.

I know it’s not all men, but still, it’s really fucking depressing. Is it the same at all Christmas parties or do I just work with scumbags?

My DH and I were just on a packed train so stood in the space between carriages. As the train pulled out a lady came and stood beside us as a group of men further along laughed loudly and one of them said "fuck me drove her away quickly". One of them then called her a sour faced bitch.

For the remainder of the journey they made loud crude jokes and blocked people from moving through the train (the carriage we were in didn't open at the next station) telling them they needed to get off at the door they got on (there were several announcements about the need to move carriages).

If somebody described the above behaviour I'd have expected it to be from young lads already drinking (was about 1030). But these were 40-50ish aged men, all well dressed in chinos and smart coats. My DH commented that he was ashamed that guys the same generation as him behaved that way.

It's not all men, but it's definitely an awful lot more than people care to admit and who on the surface appear to be family men. But when not in view of their families they show their true colours.

A few years ago the company I worked for hired a big new boss. Publicly announced, all the razzmatazz, glossy PR pieces in rhe trade mags about the hire. One week later it’s the big office Christmas do. He gets too flirty and handsy with a junior member of staff during the night out and people notice/she complains and the following Monday he’s fired. Simple as that.

I think you and your colleagues should mention the behaviour of those men to your senior team, and let the junior women know that they can also do the same if they want to, and that you will support them.

It sadly is very, very common. There are good eggs, but most are just stinking piles of garbage.

That's why I don't understand the point of marriage. I can be who I want to be with shackle free and leave them free of charge if it goes wrong.

Everywhere I've worked has been like this at Christmas parties. Estate Agents were the worst for it. Something about men being in an office seems to make them hound after women they'd usually have nothing in common with at all, usually much younger. The more senior women often never went to the works' events, presumably because they didn't want to witness anything or feel they might be on the menu themselves...

Just coming on to say the same. I heard field-based and my ears pricked up. I've worked mostly in Finance and IT departments and when I've been in corporate settings NONE of the men behaved like this. Some of the worst stories I've heard of work involving drugs, general sleazy behaviour or works do 'shenanigans' from friends or colleagues pretty much always involved men who worked in sales.

What is the industry? I worked in media/advertising when I first left uni and it was rife with this sort of thing - many men openly cheating, hitting on all of us young ones, etc.

I left that industry and haven’t come across this as a ‘culture’ anywhere else, though of course there are a few outliers.

I'm sure the majority of women (and men) only stay with their partners out of a fear of being old and alone. I do know happy couples, but they are the minority (though a fairly large minority). I often wonder what will happen if we really do find a way of slowing or reversing ageing, as some now predict. If a new drug appeared tomorrow, that guaranteed the user 500 years of healthy life, two-thirds of people over 60 would immediately divorce their partner!

I think you work with some sleazeballs. I like to think most of the women that I know would not be the same. I agree it's pretty grim.

Sadly thats just men!
When they are together in a group they are herd animals and those that stand by .... "to remain silent is to be complicit"

Not my experience, men like this are the outliers where I work and it's a heavily make dominated workplace.

It wouldn't be tolerated and I genuinely think at least 80% of them are decent people.

My male friends aren't like this either. Yes, some men are sleepy assholes but it is not the majority.

If every man you encounter is a sleeze, then it's the company you keep.

"Hands everywhere" qualifies as slightly more than "gross," it's straight out sexual assault and thus reporting and firing territory.

My 1st husband was one of these. Obvs, I had no idea when I married him! Total sleaze. My current husband would never behave this way, thank goodness.

I was at an office Christmas do once, at a big hotel. Lots of different companies there, so each table was a different company and we didn't know the other people. On the way to bed, our team of 5 ladies was approached by a man who asked if anyone wanted sex. He said he would leave his door open, for anyone who fancied it. We ranged in age from about 30 to 60. Some attractive, some not so. All body shapes. As we passed his room, he had indeed left his door open.....for any vagina owner to come in....anyone would do. 😮

This kind of behaviour was commonplace in my industry 10-15 years ago but I’m happy to say it’s been brutally stamped on and got much better.

That only means it’s got less socially acceptable though. Doesn’t mean male colleagues wouldn’t do it if they thought they could without getting disciplined for it.

I worked in a House of Fraser as a student, I went to their christmas party where one of the storemen exposed himself to me. A group of us went back to this girls flat and this older married quite posh woman who worked in Electricals went out into the stairwell of the flat and had sex with a married man who operated the car park booth, they did it right outside the flat.

I tried to lie down and sleep and the same storeman started feeling me up so I left and walked home at 3am.

Another Christmas party, different place we had a colleague who did a special drunken dance and ended up by flashing his arsehole at the CEO, who had flown in from Germany specially to attend our party!

They're adults and if the girls were ok with it then fair enough. If not then that's a different story.

Personally I don't think it's ok to tell people off for flirting etc at a work night out unless it's disturbing actual work. If they're married, says a lot about them!

My work used to be exactly like this. I was horrified as a twenty-something. So blatant and often senior men with young women. Fortunately we got a new (female) CEO and a completely new senior management committee and it just wouldn't happen now thankfully.

That 'any vagina owner' comment seems to be very true in these situations. I've heard married men talking about their wives as if they are a side business they run at home and the real work goes on elsewhere. A few months ago in a business hotel in Amsterdam an Irish guy spent 2hrs trying to convince me to go back to his room even after telling me about his family, to the point I had to physically stop him trying to kiss me and pretend to go to the loo to escape. A friend of mine in a very low patch went on Tinder for a month and said she was often depressed when they'd clearly be married and pop in for 5/10mins, not caring if she had washed and be on their way straight after the deed. Some didn't even bother asking her name. Another reason I'd never do OLD - too many men see it as free prostitution.

I'm tempted to say to record names, talk to the girls being hit on, and report to the wives!

What you describe sounds boring as shit to me...

I used to work in an environment like this in the 90s when it was accepted as part of the culture and those targeted eg the secretaries did have the power and the nous to cut them down with an icy remark if they weren’t up for it, tho many were. I never felt threatened at all by these pathetic men, just sorry for their ‘not my Nigel’ wives.

Whyyyyyy would you want to involve yourself in that level of drama? The wives might be angrier at you than the colleagues.

You did say most men - which implies a majority.
Of course MOST men are not like this - and you are being sexist if you believe that based on a few, mostly single, young men who are in your company represent MOST.
I have worked in a predominently mens workplace in my career and there are always one or two who will be a bit 'handy' at a party - just as there are women who get bawdy and drunk.

Do try not to generalise about men.

Most, most men are so disappointing.

They were raised on porn and view women as fuckable, prudes, sluts, frumps, trophies, bitter x wives or "psychos". Men are just trying to live their best lives. they can barely disguise how they categorise women at work.

I work in a female-dominated workplace and have found that most of the straight, married men are like this when they come on a works night out. Flirting and wandering hands etc. I rarely go to large work dos anymore and stick to smaller ones where only women are attending.