To want to slap people who say 'it doesn't get any easier' than having toddler and baby.

[TwoBabas]

Not an actual slap as I don't condone violence, just a virtual one.

If I had a pound for every-time some smart arse has smugly told me 'it doesn't get any easier you know'. Grrrrrrrr. To put into context I had two under two with my second child being well let's just say 'spirited'. That little bundle of joy nearly cost me my sanity and the first year of his life and it was the most challenging experience of my life to date.

I have seen many mums-netters resorting to the dreaded sentence. A brutal response to a mother on the edge. And imagine my delight to be told it face to face many times too. Once by a local lady whilst shopping in the co-op. She was queuing with a bottle of wine in her hand and a half-pissed daft expression on her face. I at the time, had the two year old in the shopping trolley and the newborn hanging off me both children wailing in synchrony. She 'had teenagers' at home. Already showing me that in some way it will get easier as one day I might get to drink some wine again (without breastfeeding guilt) and that mine might also be at home locked in their bedrooms doing teenagery stuff whilst i'm schmoozing my way around the co-op wine aisle in peace. There's also that little thing called school, let's not forget. But obviously your kids being out the house 5 days a week is no easier than then being under your feet all day demanding every second of your time.
(In all seriousness I actually love my kids being little and at home with me but you get my drift)

More bearable would be 'it get's easier but it can get very hard again in peaks and waves'. I can accept that. Just. That is kinder and more TRUTHFUL than It NEVER gets any easier. Like everyday between newborn and 18 will be as draining and challenging as it is in the first few years. Pleeeease.

Ive heard there are golden years when they get a bit more independant and you can leave the house without taking a boot load of stuff with you.Im already on the cusp of that and I can feel it starting to get a bit earier. Granted teenagers are a pain in the arse and I know it might feel impossibly hard again in the future but just incase anyone out there is worried. It gets easier! It absolutely get easier. The middle part after toddler and before teen is easier I don't care who might say otherwise.

Now pass me the wine.

I'm in the it doesn't get easier, it gets different camp. I would never say this randomly to a mum struggling with little ones though.

Completely depends on the kids you have. Some kids are very high needs.

Physically it gets easier but in lots of ways it's harder. The worrying can take over- school, bullying, friendships, self image etc. then there's driving them everywhere and they don't go to bed at 7pm anymore.

Depends which toddler and which baby.
Toddler and baby was easier than just baby. Would have been different if they had arrived in the other order.
...and I am guessing you have not reached the teenager stage yet. That could go either way.

You said yourself she was pissed and talking at a stranger (you) in the co op in the middle of the day so things are probably not going great for this particular woman.

I'd file it under "things people say" - those remarks that people make when they want to be heard and aren't about you at all. Quite often they can sound a bit spiteful or bitter but it's usually coming from a place of unmet need.

Nobody knows if your life is going to be easier or harder as your children get older. For sure it won't stay the same as nothing does.

Another load of shite. Honestly the ableist comments are disgusting. You can be an amazing parent from day one and still have trouble with your teenager. There are so many outside influences, social media, expectations, peer pressure etc now for young people. Calling parents lazy because their child suffers from mental health issues is such a smug and ill informed view. Mental health problems can happen to ANYONE at ANY TIME for so many reasons. Tell the mother who sits up all night with her anorexic daughter that she is lazy when the issues arose from bullying in school. Tell a mother who is trying every avenue to help her child in school when they have acute anxiety because they were sexually assaulted that she is lazy. Tell a mother of a ND child that she is lazy when her child is struggling to fit in and find friends due to their autism. Tell a mother she is lazy when her child can’t leave her room due to depression.
These are the mothers who are fighting their kids, who are great parents but circumstances have made things much harder for them. They have done all the right things in all the right ways but things still went wrong.
Not every well brought up child ends up well rounded and reaching their full potential. Mental health issues are vicious and can come out of the blue due to NO fault of the parent.
Your smug view is detrimental to good parents trying to navigate these waters in the times we live in.
You don’t know what is going to happen to your kids in the future. You may be blindsided yourself if one of them becomes less well rounded than you so perfectly made them. Pride comes before a fall and nothing in certain. See where your judgement and smugness gets you then.

It does get harder to carry things, because you don't have a buggy to hang everything on the handles! 😂

I kind of understand more what you mean now about parenting affecting teen years being difficult. But I think that's just one aspect.

As an example my DD is 11.5. I kept reading on hear/hearing in real life how from Y5 girls often start struggling with their friendships. I thought I'd got away with it but the end of Y6/beginning of Y7, we've had some issues. I don't think I can blame my parenting for that if it is so universal.

Also my parents would have told you they found parenting easy in the teen years. That was because they weren't good parents. They didn't see all the struggles I went through.

You have obviously woven your own interpretation into my post that was not intended.

Getting your child to reach their full potential regardless of SEND or the curveballs that are thrown in is the aim of all parents. You don’t seem to understand that "full potential" is very individual to each child.

I never called any parent who supports their child to reach their full potential that they are capable of while managing curveballs including MH, or outside influences lazy. It is exactly why parenting beyond the baby years is so much harder because you have to manage so much more that sleepless nights.

I have a late teen, he is far from perfect, I have never met anyone who is, but I am proud of what he has achieved and it was a difficult journey for both of us , in hindsight there are some things I could have done very differently. That is the hardest part of parenting.

Beyond that it depends on how you parent. It is piss easy to be a lazy or disney parent

I think you will find you did. You clearly state it depends on how you parent and then go on about being a Disney or lazy parent. Then you top it off by saying hard work doesn’t start at teenage years implying it has not been done before that.
You also waffle on about how rewarding it us to raise well rounded kids who reach their full potential. Not every well parented child is well rounded nor reach their full potential, rewarding as that may be and absolutely none of that will be due to a parent being lazy.
So no, it doesn’t always boil down to how you parent. It doesn’t make you lazy. Circumstances can take over and absolutely piss all over your good parenting and there is very little you can do about it except continue to be a good parent and navigate it as best you can.

If infancy were easier than the semi independence of older children, evolution would have made it last longer. As it is, it lasts about the absolute maximum that humans (women) can endure - any longer and the rates reaching adulthood would reduce, because that's how natural selection works; pregnancy lasting longer = increased mortality, evolution meant that pregnancy duration reduced in exchange for a longer period of dependence/development outside the womb, dependency lasting longer than that would mean reduced survival (on a biological/evolutionary scale) due to them being unable to maintain that intensity of protection, feeding and care.

They're 'only babies for a short time' because on evolutionary terms, population scales and durations, humans would not be able to ensure their survival (due to the emotional and physical demands) if the dependency period lasted any longer.

It DOESNT get easier, it gets different - and people who say this to you are well within their rights to voice their experiences, just like you do don't see why you have to take it so personally and want to slap someone over this.

I'll take babies over teenagers any day.

I dont know how to say it to make you understand what I am trying to say without you over analysing, misinterpreting and attacking every word.

Input from a fully engaged, pro active parent vs a lazy parent will significantly improve the outcome for any child. Outcome, like full potential can mean many many different things for individual children. It doesn't mean perfection, it means better than it otherwise would have been.

I am sure you will do your best to misinterpret that too so will leave the conversation here.

Enjoy your Sunday.

That’s some serious backtracking there.

Enjoy your Sunday too.

So if a teenager struggles with their mh whether it's caused from genetics or a traumatic life event like a parent dying or suffering from childhood cancer or another horrific illness or disability that has meant spending the majority of their childhood in and out of hospital. Or maybe the trauma of an attack from a stranger or being in a car crash, a fire or been evacuated from a war torn country. Thats the parents fault is it ? Nobody is exempt from suffering from mh issues it can happen to anyone. Even you and your children.

I really want @Fernsfernsferns to tell me how me going to therapy would stop my DS getting cancer. I'm all ears.

It does get easier in some ways, but harder in others. Having older children is much less physically demanding, and there is a golden age (though depends on the child / children) of between 6 and 11-12, when they have increasing independence but still want to hang out with you and you could do lots of lovely child-focused things and they're fairly easily pleased. I honestly don't miss the toddler years. As soon as both mine got to around 4 it did get easier.

But the older they get the harder it gets emotionally and in some ways you worry more. Added to that there is a lot of stress around screen time, protecting them from inappropriate content, bullying, academics, competitive parents, discipline, sibling rivalry, complex friendships, influences outside of your control, and this is just the tween years.

So yeah, I do prefer not being woken in the middle of the night or having to potty train or having to watch what they're doing all the time. But there has been a whole lot of other worries that has not made it 'easy'. So it just depends on what you consider to be hard I guess (and that might not be the same for everyone).

I never said it would.

Worth reflecting on whether you REALLY think I did and if so where that is coming from in you.

Deep sympathies for what you are you family are going through.

@Differentstarts never that said either. Clearly life events, luck, can and does happen to anyone.

However, some kids that experience those difficulties will navigate them better than others, and emotionally mature parenting gives them a better chance of getting through ok.

e.g I have two close friends who lost their mums in their teenage years. One had a great support system and warm empathetic dad. She's doing great and is a wonderful parent. The other had a cold controlling family and she's having a really hard time, which shows up in her parenting and is PART of the reason her kids are having difficulties.

It is one factor. I didn't say it was the only factor.

But as a parent it's one worth reflecting on as of all the factors at play, it is something we are in charge of and can change for the better if we have the courage to.

To give an example, an earlier poster said something about year 6 difficulties (obviously different to a cancer diagnosis to spell it out)

Yes many / all kids face those changes and challenges around yr 5/ 6. AND how you parent through it matters then and for their future.

calm and supportive, reassuring them its normal and they'll get through it, and advocating for them when needed?

or catastrophising with / about them?

saying its trivial and you don't want to hear it?

etc.

You said

those issues are a manifestation of earlier mistakes.

Please tell me how my child's mental health issues as a result of ASD are a manifestation of my earlier mistakes.

Please also tell me how issues related to childhood cancer are a manifestation of my earlier mistakes.

Thank you.

calm and supportive, reassuring them its normal and they'll get through it, and advocating for them when needed?

Tell me you've never had a child with cancer without telling me you've never had a child with cancer. it's not fucking normal and no, they might not get through it.

Fuckksake.

You say your friend is doing great after losing a parent at a young age but how do you actually know. You are definitely not someone I would open up to about my mh struggles because not only are you judgemental you just don't get it. The majority of people struggling with their mh, self harm, eating disorders, addiction, suicidal thought do so in secret. The way you view mh is actually a very dangerous way to parent and could be quite damaging to your children if their currently struggling or do so in the future. It's OK to struggle with mh it isn't anyone's fault just like diabetes or asthma isn't you don't need to place blame.

@benefitsterrified I literally said year 6 social difficulties is a very different circumstance to parenting a child with cancer, to make it really clear I was talking about one not the other.

you are twisting what is written.

@Differentstarts you are also projecting and assuming a lot about what I do and don't know, and have or haven't lived through.

the whole point is our own mental health comes through in how we parent our kids.

And warm calm empathetic emotionally mature parenting that is neither permissive nor authoritarian, that can hear our kids struggles and support them without getting enmeshed with them isn't really possible if as parents we haven't sorted out our own mental health

Not twisting at all, you're being abelist.

Well mine go to school, no longer breastfeed, don't have tantrums at the check out , can be left alone , don't wake me up in the night etc, all things the op thinks will make life easier so 🤷‍♀️

I understand your point, I'm not debating that it's true for you.
I just think we cannot extrapolate that it's therefore universally true.