To want to slap people who say 'it doesn't get any easier' than having toddler and baby.

[TwoBabas]

Not an actual slap as I don't condone violence, just a virtual one.

If I had a pound for every-time some smart arse has smugly told me 'it doesn't get any easier you know'. Grrrrrrrr. To put into context I had two under two with my second child being well let's just say 'spirited'. That little bundle of joy nearly cost me my sanity and the first year of his life and it was the most challenging experience of my life to date.

I have seen many mums-netters resorting to the dreaded sentence. A brutal response to a mother on the edge. And imagine my delight to be told it face to face many times too. Once by a local lady whilst shopping in the co-op. She was queuing with a bottle of wine in her hand and a half-pissed daft expression on her face. I at the time, had the two year old in the shopping trolley and the newborn hanging off me both children wailing in synchrony. She 'had teenagers' at home. Already showing me that in some way it will get easier as one day I might get to drink some wine again (without breastfeeding guilt) and that mine might also be at home locked in their bedrooms doing teenagery stuff whilst i'm schmoozing my way around the co-op wine aisle in peace. There's also that little thing called school, let's not forget. But obviously your kids being out the house 5 days a week is no easier than then being under your feet all day demanding every second of your time.
(In all seriousness I actually love my kids being little and at home with me but you get my drift)

More bearable would be 'it get's easier but it can get very hard again in peaks and waves'. I can accept that. Just. That is kinder and more TRUTHFUL than It NEVER gets any easier. Like everyday between newborn and 18 will be as draining and challenging as it is in the first few years. Pleeeease.

Ive heard there are golden years when they get a bit more independant and you can leave the house without taking a boot load of stuff with you.Im already on the cusp of that and I can feel it starting to get a bit earier. Granted teenagers are a pain in the arse and I know it might feel impossibly hard again in the future but just incase anyone out there is worried. It gets easier! It absolutely get easier. The middle part after toddler and before teen is easier I don't care who might say otherwise.

Now pass me the wine.

I thrived on the baby stage and I never had any family help at all. I was young and had loads of energy. I don't think I could do sleep deprivation as well now.

The middle years are pretty straight forward. I think it gets harder as the issues are bigger and more critical. A toddler tantrum will never carry the weight that equipping our children to deal with issues like bullying, sexual issues, making good choices, peer pressure, drinking decisions, driving decisions, drugs, social media issues, and whatever the world decides to throw their way, does.

I think there are a lot of variables that go into whether we find different stages hard. I don't think someone is wrong because they found a different stage harder or easier. We're all different. I would say it gets harder because the stakes are higher in some ways. How easy or difficult your teenager is doesn't change that you have to communicate and equip them to deal with all that stuff. The world is a minefield. A tantrum will pass, we'll catch up on sleep again, but sometimes young people make the wrong decision with lasting consequences, or experience things that hurt our heart for them. I, for one, found younger ages more physically tiring but so much easier in many other ways.

I think the challenges just change and each time there’s a new one it seems hard again.
For example, I remember always being told the newborn stage was hardest. Flash forward to when DC was 6 months old and transitioning to his own room and I’m thinking ‘no way was newborn harder than this!’
In reality it probably was but I’d had enough experience with a newborn by that point to know what worked and what didn’t for my baby. I didn’t have experience with getting him to sleep in his own room so that seemed harder to me at that point in time.
Now he sleeps in his own room fine and I’m sure there’s another challenge round the corner for me to find tough. Right now it’s teething!
Plus I think we tend to block out the harder parts when they’re done. Take childbirth as an example - most of us probably wouldn’t do it again if we truly remembered the whole experience!

I am hugely sympathetic to anyone having a hard time, whether their child is five weeks or five years or fifty five.

But there’s a world of difference between ‘oh god, my teenager is just awful - please help me!’ and coming onto a thread where someone’s two year old brought them to tears and saying ‘just wait till he’s fifteen.’

I am really sympathetic to the first. The latter is just horrible and I have to say I only see it that way round, I never see parents of toddlers telling parents of teens how much harder they have it but perhaps they do.

Most people who have mental health issues adult or teens, at least part of it is rooted in their childhood experiences and the ways their parents behaved and treated them.

Even with ND kids how their parents have responded and parented them when they are younger has a big impact on how the teenage years (and then adulthood) go, yes.

i read Hadley Freeman’s book on anorexia. She has a whole chapter on mothers and daughters (though tactfully isn’t that specific about her own mother). But her central advice to mothers of anorexic girls is for the mother to go to therapy ASAP to face up to her role in it. Often there is a co-dependency there which may have worked for a young child but becomes toxic and unsustainable as she grows up.

the parent / mother created that and it’s her responsibility to face up to that and change it. Much harder in the teen years though, when short term they will try to keep you in that cycle and resist you changing it.

hence my saying those issues are a manifestation of earlier mistakes.

it can be hard to hear if you are living through it. But it’s the truth - the parenting is always one part (often not the only part).

don’t be a stately homes parent saying ‘well I did my best, how can you be making me feel so bad’?

go to therapy and examine your own role in it. It’s one thing YOU can do to change things for the better.

That’s a very harsh take on it though @Fernsfernsferns and I also don’t think it’s true.

I do think there is a trend on Mumsnet at the moment for very authoritative sort of approaches and I do feel that approach can be damaging when children become older because as someone said up thread children become teens who can argue back. Ideally mutual respect is what we’re aiming for but sometimes it is difficult whether that’s a stroppy, arsey teen or a tantrumming toddler. Blame is never helpful.

@Summermeadowflowers

its not blame, it’s taking responsibility

if your teen is struggling you owe it to them, as well as yourself , to sort out your own contribution to that, and figure out what you need to change or do differently to help them.

things will get better, faster for them if you do, even if it is the less comfortable road for us as parents.

much easier to shrug and say ‘well there isn’t much I can do’

I’m currently in the thick of it with a 2 year old and 8 month old. Sahm, husband is wonderful but no other help. Absolutely love my life with them but my 8 month old doesn’t sleep much (I’m talking maybe 8 hours in 24 and all of them in contact and 30 minute stints) and my 2 year old is quite active and demanding, as toddlers usually are. My body is exhausted the carrying and breastfeeding and running around after my 2 year old.

I feel a bit better reading some of the responses that it’s easier in some ways and harder in other ways (such as mentally) and I will need to prepare to get through that. But surely it isn’t as relentless as this?! I’ll at least get a few hours away each day while they are at school and I’m at work where I can speak to other adults, have a wee in peace, not be worried they’re going to hurt each other when they are fragile if I turn my back for a minute and be happy to see them and spend quality time with them
when they’re home?!

No one is suggesting that. I think most of us do blame ourselves when our children are unhappy and while no one is perfect, it is rarely conducive.

This is so out of date. There can be a genetic tendency to eating disorders. Current thinking is more along the lines of the role of peer influence. Peers are often more influence in the teen years than the parents. The mother and father both had a decade of being blamed for eating disorders. Now we know it is so much more complex than that.

Kids don't come with a manual. There are different temperaments, different experiences outside the home. It's just rubbish that parents can control every aspect of their child's experience, especially as they get older (which is one way the younger years can be easier). Not that parents can't be an influence but it's not that simple. Parent blaming is so yesterday.

People generalise and talk rubbish. Everyone’s experience is different.

Not all babies keep you awake all night, not all toddlers tantrum, not all teens are stroppy…

Absolutely it gets easier!
Very soon sleep often gets easier. Also your child can express what's wrong so you can fix it quicker. They build more ability to entertain themselves. Then they start to be able to be safer with a tiny bit less supervision. Then they become more even and have more self control of their own moods. Then they start to be able to do more things for themselves. Then they disappear to nursery or school for hours..... then generally some golden years kick in.... they can chat to you in interesting ways, do some basic self care, they love you and think you are wonderful, and they are at school and entertain themselves with peers. (They stop wanting you to crawl around with them in soft play and are happy you dropping them at parties where they hang out with other kids while you have a coffee and a natter. Etc)

Around 7 they can start genuinely being able to help with tasks- tidying their rooms, fetching the mail, puting their own dish in the dishwasher.

Then another breakthrough - around 10-12, when you can actually leave them alone for a short while, then they start taking themselves places....

Yes, most teens get grumpy and don't want to spend time with their parents. This can be an extremely easy period with few demands on you (They say teens like to have you around to ignore you). SOME teens have serious emotional and health issues, causing you to worry greatly. However, that may not be the case, and if it is, you have likely had a good few years to recharge before then!

Of course every parenting journey is different and if your DC have SEN it can be radically harder, long term, but I'd say this is the typical journey......

The unremitting exhaustion and lack of ownership of your own time and own body is short lived! There is every reason for hope, OP!

It gets physically easier 100%. No lugging around of half the house everywhere you go and plenty of sleep makes everything easier. It gets more worrying though. Why are they late home, where are they, how are they going to do in their exams, arguing about going to parties (not soft play 😂), cockiness, oh god theyve got a girlfriend - please dont let them knock her up......but for all of this, yes, I still think they are easier when they are older!

Give me a newborn any day over a preteen or a 19 year old!!

they stay where you put them, they don’t answer back, far less drama. Very much easier.

I had three under two and in some ways it was easier than now.

It definitely gets easier. Mine are 15, 16 and 17 now.

3+ was a million times easier than anything that came before for us. He's 18 now and an absolute joy - when he was 1 though I thought I had completely ruined my life.

Others though have a dream baby and absolutely love that stage - to them things then probably seem harder after that.

YANBU. Even if that's genuinely been your experience, its not helpful to say it to a Mum of babies or young children who is struggling.

I have two DC (9 and 5) with SEND. Although their needs mean they both probably require more 'hands on' parenting than other children their age, and some days are still very challenging, life has definitely gotten easier and more fun.

The daily challenges of parenting are much easier to cope with when you're not chronically sleep deprived for a start. DC2 woke every 1-2 hours and was up for the day by 5am for the first 4 years of his life. Now, he has the occasional bad night, but he mostly sleeps through which has improved all our lives immeasurably.

The DC's SEND means that we still have to be very routine-driven, events have to be carefully planned and we have to anticipate their needs in various situations. But we are used to doing that, because we've always done it, and not having to faff about with changing bags, pushchairs, bottles and nappies definitely helps when it comes to things like trips out. When they were toddlers I dreaded going out with them because of the potential for explosive tantrums and the herculean effort it took to get them both ready and out the door didn't seem worth it. Now we understand their needs better, we can predict when things are likely to trigger them and have strategies to deal with it, so the meltdowns are much less frequent and days out are mostly a pleasure.

Of course, there will be children with SEND who have much higher support needs than mine, and I am also fortunate to have a supportive DH who does more than his fair share, but I do think that life gets easier for many parents as DC get older.

I work with teenagers so am under no illusions that those years won't be challenging. But nothing could persuade me to go back to the relentless physical exhaustion of the early years where I couldn't sleep for more than 2 consecutive hours, finish a meal or shower more than once every 3 days because they were totally dependent on me to meet their most basic needs.

In the last year I have started to read books again, I have the energy to socialise with friends in the week for the first time in years, and the last family holiday we had, (although I wouldn't go as far as to say it was relaxing) was definitely fun rather than feeling like a test of endurance! I feel like I am gradually getting back to myself.

Show quote history
Most people who have mental health issues adult or teens, at least part of it is rooted in their childhood experiences and the ways their parents behaved and treated them.

Even with ND kids how their parents have responded and parented them when they are younger has a big impact on how the teenage years (and then adulthood) go, yes

What a horrible thing to say. So my child has mental health issues because of my parenting, which I have always, like the majority of parents, put my all into? Nothing to do with the neurodiversity that she was born with? Anyone can develop mental health issues - often there is a genetic predisposition.

There is nothing more frustrating than smug parents who had an easy time because they got lucky criticising those whose kids have had more challenges, regardless of the age of the child. You wouldn't blame a parent if their child had physical health issues.

So it's my fault my child is autistic and it's my fault my eldest got cancer. Got it

This is ableist.

There are different kinds of 'difficult' . The physical starain goes diwn but at the sane time tge emotional strain goes up.You can protect tgem from nearly everything negative when they are babies, but as they get older you have less and less ability to do this

I think people forget what it’s truly like. My mum has such rose tinted glasses that it’s pointless asking her for her experience of raising me and my sister as we apparently never had tantrums etc. I’m skeptical that’s the case as a young relative of hers asked her about dealing with siblings fighting and she again said we never ever fought which I know isn’t true.

I think to those people they look at the cute photos and remember the simplicity of having young children without all the dependence and difficulty.

What an absolute crackpot view. The voice of perfect parenting. Ableist claptrap. Absolutely mortified for you. There are thousands of wonderful parents on here who struggle greatly with the teenage years for a vast number of reasons even though they have done a fantastic job raising their kids. The smugness is nauseating.

Baby and toddler years were physically exhausting but that was about it.

Beyond that it depends on how you parent. It is piss easy to be a lazy or disney parent.

Much harder (and more rewarding) to be a parent that raises well rounded children that reach their full potential navigating all the curveballs that are thrown at you along the way.

That hard work doesn't just start at teen age, that is just when you see, with the benefit of hindsight, you might have got some of it wrong.

Just as an example, I've just been at soft play for two hours and I was able to sit at the table and didn't have to take my shoes off and scramble round ballpits sweating my arse off 😂😂 it does get easier