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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think people don't actually understand the difference between Anti Zionism and Anti-Semetism in the context of the current conflict?

540 replies

Fruitandclottedcream · 11/10/2023 09:40

Every time someone criticises the Israeli State or Zionism ideology, there is always someone who comments shouting about Anti-Semitism and how anyone who questions, criticises or condemns Israel's behaviour is Anti-Semitic. And it's really annoying because it's not true.

The definition of Anti-Semitism is "Prejudice or Hostility towards Jewish people".

Anti-Zionism in the context of the ongoing conflict between Israel and Palestine is being opposed to Israel's decades long oppression, genocide and apartheid of Palestinians. Including but not limited to leaving people stateless, giving Palestinians less rights than Israelis and creating the open air prison that is Gaza, depriving the people there of water, electricity and food, and bombing relentlessly while not giving anyone a way to escape.

Plenty of Jewish people practice their faith, but are anti Zionist and condemn what the Israeli government are doing.

And plenty of Zionists are Anti-Semites, but support the behaviour of the Israeli government (including a decent chunk of British MPs according to Google)

Disclaimer before anyone jumps on me: I absolutely condemn and despise Hamas and their actions. I've not mentioned them as they're not relevant to my point.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
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Thisisnotlikehim · 11/10/2023 09:45

I think you are right. What Hamas has done is evil and abhorrent and should be completely condemned.

Jewish people have been treated badly historically and were ‘there first’ and have a right to a homeland.

However, there were decisions made, as you rightly point out, in the pursuit of that homeland that should be judged as wrong too.

It’s complex though with lots of layers of history and context and I can’t profess to understand it all. I just wish there was a way for people to live together in harmony.

Safarisling · 11/10/2023 09:47

This reply has been deleted

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FatherJackHackettsUnderpantsHamper · 11/10/2023 10:01

Also, purely semantically speaking, the Semitic peoples extended to far more than just Jewish people, including many Arabs too, so I don't understand why the term is widely used rather than the much clearer 'anti-Jewish'.

Unless I'm missing something big here, wouldn't it have been like the British calling the Nazis fighting against us 'anti-European'?

Not wanting to detract from focusing on and challenging any ingrained prejudice or hatred in any way, but I don't see why we would use a wide term to refer to just one sub-group that the term includes, when it quite probably also applies to many of the aggressors as well.

FatherJackHackettsUnderpantsHamper · 11/10/2023 10:09

I do agree, though, that there is an awful lot of muddying the waters between 'anti-Jewish' and 'anti-Zionist'. One of them is hating people for who they are, which is always very wrong; whilst the other is hating what people choose to do (and their politics), which I think is a very valid perspective, whether you agree or disagree with them.

I detest and despise a lot of what the UK governments do (all of them - not just the Tories). I am outraged that people were arrested and locked up for peacefully protesting with 'not my king' banners at the Coronation. In fact, I consider it mendacious double-speak to even dare to refer to the UK as a democracy when we have no say whatsoever in our ruler at the top. But none of this in any way means that I hate the British people as a whole - of which I am one!

BCCoach · 11/10/2023 10:17

Anti-zionism is a long held position among the Haredim (ultra-orthodox Jews).

To think people don't actually understand the difference between Anti Zionism and Anti-Semetism in the context of the current conflict?
OneTC · 11/10/2023 10:31

Some people do use it as a diversion for sure but I think lots of people are also pretty willfully blind to the actual anti-Semitism that is dressed up as anti Zionism as well.

Fruitandclottedcream · 11/10/2023 12:52

FatherJackHackettsUnderpantsHamper · 11/10/2023 10:09

I do agree, though, that there is an awful lot of muddying the waters between 'anti-Jewish' and 'anti-Zionist'. One of them is hating people for who they are, which is always very wrong; whilst the other is hating what people choose to do (and their politics), which I think is a very valid perspective, whether you agree or disagree with them.

I detest and despise a lot of what the UK governments do (all of them - not just the Tories). I am outraged that people were arrested and locked up for peacefully protesting with 'not my king' banners at the Coronation. In fact, I consider it mendacious double-speak to even dare to refer to the UK as a democracy when we have no say whatsoever in our ruler at the top. But none of this in any way means that I hate the British people as a whole - of which I am one!

You've summed up how I feel better than I have. I don't have any prejudice or hate for who anyone is. I just completely and utterly disagree and opposed what they choose to do.
And it frustrates me that I'm branded as an anti semite when I'm nothing of the sort!

OP posts:
CoughingMajoress · 11/10/2023 13:24

If you aren't Jewish just shut up. It's not appropriate for people who aren't minorities to lecture to minorities about what is and isn't racism.

Society is generally very poorly educated and bad about recognising antisemitism because a lot of antisemitism is insidious and uses propaganda and stereotypes, in ways society doesn't always recognise as damaging. For example, one of the most dangerous stereotypes about Jews is that we're money grubbing and I've had a lot of people not understand why that's a bad thing, because "surely being good with money is a good thing?" But to understand why this trope exists and why it's so dangerous, requires understanding literally centuries of Jewish history. This stereotype IS very very dangerous and it's literally been used to justify multiple genocides. After the Treaty of Versailles, the German government weaponised this stereotype via massive propaganda campaigns to blame Germany's poverty on Jews hoarding the money, rather than acknowledge their own responsibility for the huge financial penalties forced upon Germany after WWI; that propaganda campaign (which would not have existed if not for centuries of Jews being cast as money grubbing, a stereotype that goes back to the era when Jews were forced into jobs as money lenders, then penalised by Medieval Christians for the jobs they'd forced Jews into) very directly led to the Holocaust.

And I bet anything someone will come along in a minute and accuse me of being yet another Jew who won't stop blathering about the Holocaust.

There's a huge amount of antisemitism wrapped up in antizionism, and a lot of people frankly don't give a fuck about Palestine and are just using it to have a pop at Jews.

Every Jewish person is expected to have an opinion on Israel, is held responsible for Israel, there's been a big wave of antisemitic attacks in the UK over the past few days, in a way that would never happen in any similar situation. The Chinese government literally have concentration camps were religious minorities are tortured and mass murdered (including being killed to order for the illegal organ trade) and it gets almost zero media attention and no Chinese person in the UK would be judged or asked their opinion about the actions of their government, yet Jews - many of whom have no connection to Israel - don't get the same grace.

That's why so much antizionism is antisemitic.

And yet you can't talk about Israel without understanding the history of how Israel was created, and how it's been used as a weapon by geopolitical forces (eg the way the US and USSR used the Middle East as a staging ground for proxy war during the Cold War, or how the USA is using Israel to prevent the Middle East from becoming one big Islamic fundamentalist superstate, or how the US is using Israel as a tactical intelligence centre in the Middle East and how this relates to oil wealth, or how the US religious right extremists support Israel because of Biblical Literalism which is not exactly Jewish-friendly) and how much Jews have been abused and exploited in that process. Israel was created because Europe wanted to get rid of all the Jews after WWII, and not give back all the land and wealth that was stolen from European Jews during the war. I mean Israel was nearly in Uganda for God's sake, no one cared about Jewish people, only getting rid of them.

And people don't understand just how minuscule a minority we are. Jews make up just 0.2% of the world's population. Muslims make up 24% of the world's population, and Christians make up 31%. That is an INSANE disparity.

Plus, Jews only have one single miniscule country to call our own where we can be safe (after centuries of non-stop persecution and multiple genocides). There are nearly FIFTY Muslim countries, and many of those countries are extremely wealthy and could protect and home the entire population of Palestine if they wanted to. The rest of the Arab world has either turned its back on Palestine, or is (in the case of Iran) actively bombing infrastructure in Gaza and funding terrorism that will actively harm Palestinians because Iran wants to kill all Jews, and doesn't care how many Palestinians are hurt or killed in the process.

I'm not defending the actions of the Israeli government, no one I know agrees with the violent oppression and apartheid of the current government. Everyone I know has serious concerns about Israel's swing to the far right and the growing power the ultra-religious have in Israeli politics. And this systemic violent oppression is not just of the Palestinians, but of minority groups within Israel, such as Israeli Bedouin. Systemic violent oppression of Israeli Bedouin by the Israeli government is just as bad, yet somehow the world media don't give the tiniest shit. Most people outside Israel have never even heard of this! And that raises the question, why is the plight of some oppressed people (like Palestinians) a massive worldwide issue, while the plight of other equally oppressed people (like Bedouin, or Muslim Uyghurs in China) goes totally ignored? What political agenda is being served by this cherry picking?

Teder · 11/10/2023 13:30

In a roundabout way, you are telling Jewish people to “stop using the race card”. I’ve yet to see an anti Israel thread not immediately descend into ani semitism. Even if one wanted to discuss Israel political policy, it quickly becomes derailed. Many people seem to act like they have knowledge of the very complex history and political situation. They don’t. They like to stick their oar in. Half of them cannot even spell Israel correctly.

There are non Zionist Jews but they manage to have healthy debates without anti semitism. MN has always allowed overtly racist discussions to continue, so why should threads about Jewish people and Israel be any different? I’ve challenged it before. Sometimes I get tired.

MooseBreath · 11/10/2023 13:36

I am Jewish.

I am absolutely against the Netanyahu government's treatment of Palestinian civilians. I am against their decision to refuse food, water, and medication to Gaza. I am against the bombings and attacks on Palestine by the Israeli government condoned by the US (amongst other countries).

I am also absolutely against the actions of Hamas towards the Israeli civilians. I am against their ISIS-style approach of holding hostages and executions. I am against the bombings and attacks in Israel set by Hamas and condoned by Iran (amongst other countries).

As far as I'm concerned, both parties are terrorists. Jewish and Muslim civilians are victims in this shitshow. I am so glad my family does not live in Israel and is safe in their community.

indianwoman · 11/10/2023 13:49

CoughingMajoress · 11/10/2023 13:24

If you aren't Jewish just shut up. It's not appropriate for people who aren't minorities to lecture to minorities about what is and isn't racism.

Society is generally very poorly educated and bad about recognising antisemitism because a lot of antisemitism is insidious and uses propaganda and stereotypes, in ways society doesn't always recognise as damaging. For example, one of the most dangerous stereotypes about Jews is that we're money grubbing and I've had a lot of people not understand why that's a bad thing, because "surely being good with money is a good thing?" But to understand why this trope exists and why it's so dangerous, requires understanding literally centuries of Jewish history. This stereotype IS very very dangerous and it's literally been used to justify multiple genocides. After the Treaty of Versailles, the German government weaponised this stereotype via massive propaganda campaigns to blame Germany's poverty on Jews hoarding the money, rather than acknowledge their own responsibility for the huge financial penalties forced upon Germany after WWI; that propaganda campaign (which would not have existed if not for centuries of Jews being cast as money grubbing, a stereotype that goes back to the era when Jews were forced into jobs as money lenders, then penalised by Medieval Christians for the jobs they'd forced Jews into) very directly led to the Holocaust.

And I bet anything someone will come along in a minute and accuse me of being yet another Jew who won't stop blathering about the Holocaust.

There's a huge amount of antisemitism wrapped up in antizionism, and a lot of people frankly don't give a fuck about Palestine and are just using it to have a pop at Jews.

Every Jewish person is expected to have an opinion on Israel, is held responsible for Israel, there's been a big wave of antisemitic attacks in the UK over the past few days, in a way that would never happen in any similar situation. The Chinese government literally have concentration camps were religious minorities are tortured and mass murdered (including being killed to order for the illegal organ trade) and it gets almost zero media attention and no Chinese person in the UK would be judged or asked their opinion about the actions of their government, yet Jews - many of whom have no connection to Israel - don't get the same grace.

That's why so much antizionism is antisemitic.

And yet you can't talk about Israel without understanding the history of how Israel was created, and how it's been used as a weapon by geopolitical forces (eg the way the US and USSR used the Middle East as a staging ground for proxy war during the Cold War, or how the USA is using Israel to prevent the Middle East from becoming one big Islamic fundamentalist superstate, or how the US is using Israel as a tactical intelligence centre in the Middle East and how this relates to oil wealth, or how the US religious right extremists support Israel because of Biblical Literalism which is not exactly Jewish-friendly) and how much Jews have been abused and exploited in that process. Israel was created because Europe wanted to get rid of all the Jews after WWII, and not give back all the land and wealth that was stolen from European Jews during the war. I mean Israel was nearly in Uganda for God's sake, no one cared about Jewish people, only getting rid of them.

And people don't understand just how minuscule a minority we are. Jews make up just 0.2% of the world's population. Muslims make up 24% of the world's population, and Christians make up 31%. That is an INSANE disparity.

Plus, Jews only have one single miniscule country to call our own where we can be safe (after centuries of non-stop persecution and multiple genocides). There are nearly FIFTY Muslim countries, and many of those countries are extremely wealthy and could protect and home the entire population of Palestine if they wanted to. The rest of the Arab world has either turned its back on Palestine, or is (in the case of Iran) actively bombing infrastructure in Gaza and funding terrorism that will actively harm Palestinians because Iran wants to kill all Jews, and doesn't care how many Palestinians are hurt or killed in the process.

I'm not defending the actions of the Israeli government, no one I know agrees with the violent oppression and apartheid of the current government. Everyone I know has serious concerns about Israel's swing to the far right and the growing power the ultra-religious have in Israeli politics. And this systemic violent oppression is not just of the Palestinians, but of minority groups within Israel, such as Israeli Bedouin. Systemic violent oppression of Israeli Bedouin by the Israeli government is just as bad, yet somehow the world media don't give the tiniest shit. Most people outside Israel have never even heard of this! And that raises the question, why is the plight of some oppressed people (like Palestinians) a massive worldwide issue, while the plight of other equally oppressed people (like Bedouin, or Muslim Uyghurs in China) goes totally ignored? What political agenda is being served by this cherry picking?

Thank you for this. I've been educated. It's hard to get more info for regular non Jewish folk who don't have much knowledge about this.

fioritura · 11/10/2023 13:57

I think this soon-to-be released film is aiming to address this issue, it looks like it will be an informative watch. It must be so tough for the Jewish people fighting back against this.

Mochudubh · 11/10/2023 14:07

I meant to watch this and forgot about it until now.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m001k3wj

According to the Jewish Chronicle it's an unsettling but basically even-handed programme

BBC Two - The Holy Land and Us - Our Untold Stories

Jewish and Palestinian families explore the impact of the founding of the state of Israel.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m001k3wj

justteanbiscuits · 11/10/2023 14:18

MooseBreath · 11/10/2023 13:36

I am Jewish.

I am absolutely against the Netanyahu government's treatment of Palestinian civilians. I am against their decision to refuse food, water, and medication to Gaza. I am against the bombings and attacks on Palestine by the Israeli government condoned by the US (amongst other countries).

I am also absolutely against the actions of Hamas towards the Israeli civilians. I am against their ISIS-style approach of holding hostages and executions. I am against the bombings and attacks in Israel set by Hamas and condoned by Iran (amongst other countries).

As far as I'm concerned, both parties are terrorists. Jewish and Muslim civilians are victims in this shitshow. I am so glad my family does not live in Israel and is safe in their community.

I think this is the clearest post on it all. It's a a heartbreaking shit show on both sides.

steph97 · 11/10/2023 14:25

Can I suggest you read this book which considers, in-depth, whether anti-Zionism is simply the latest manifestation of anti-semitism

www.waterstones.com/book/israelophobia/jake-wallis-simons/jake-wallis-simons/9781408719275

MyrrAgain · 11/10/2023 14:44

CoughingMajoress · 11/10/2023 13:24

If you aren't Jewish just shut up. It's not appropriate for people who aren't minorities to lecture to minorities about what is and isn't racism.

Society is generally very poorly educated and bad about recognising antisemitism because a lot of antisemitism is insidious and uses propaganda and stereotypes, in ways society doesn't always recognise as damaging. For example, one of the most dangerous stereotypes about Jews is that we're money grubbing and I've had a lot of people not understand why that's a bad thing, because "surely being good with money is a good thing?" But to understand why this trope exists and why it's so dangerous, requires understanding literally centuries of Jewish history. This stereotype IS very very dangerous and it's literally been used to justify multiple genocides. After the Treaty of Versailles, the German government weaponised this stereotype via massive propaganda campaigns to blame Germany's poverty on Jews hoarding the money, rather than acknowledge their own responsibility for the huge financial penalties forced upon Germany after WWI; that propaganda campaign (which would not have existed if not for centuries of Jews being cast as money grubbing, a stereotype that goes back to the era when Jews were forced into jobs as money lenders, then penalised by Medieval Christians for the jobs they'd forced Jews into) very directly led to the Holocaust.

And I bet anything someone will come along in a minute and accuse me of being yet another Jew who won't stop blathering about the Holocaust.

There's a huge amount of antisemitism wrapped up in antizionism, and a lot of people frankly don't give a fuck about Palestine and are just using it to have a pop at Jews.

Every Jewish person is expected to have an opinion on Israel, is held responsible for Israel, there's been a big wave of antisemitic attacks in the UK over the past few days, in a way that would never happen in any similar situation. The Chinese government literally have concentration camps were religious minorities are tortured and mass murdered (including being killed to order for the illegal organ trade) and it gets almost zero media attention and no Chinese person in the UK would be judged or asked their opinion about the actions of their government, yet Jews - many of whom have no connection to Israel - don't get the same grace.

That's why so much antizionism is antisemitic.

And yet you can't talk about Israel without understanding the history of how Israel was created, and how it's been used as a weapon by geopolitical forces (eg the way the US and USSR used the Middle East as a staging ground for proxy war during the Cold War, or how the USA is using Israel to prevent the Middle East from becoming one big Islamic fundamentalist superstate, or how the US is using Israel as a tactical intelligence centre in the Middle East and how this relates to oil wealth, or how the US religious right extremists support Israel because of Biblical Literalism which is not exactly Jewish-friendly) and how much Jews have been abused and exploited in that process. Israel was created because Europe wanted to get rid of all the Jews after WWII, and not give back all the land and wealth that was stolen from European Jews during the war. I mean Israel was nearly in Uganda for God's sake, no one cared about Jewish people, only getting rid of them.

And people don't understand just how minuscule a minority we are. Jews make up just 0.2% of the world's population. Muslims make up 24% of the world's population, and Christians make up 31%. That is an INSANE disparity.

Plus, Jews only have one single miniscule country to call our own where we can be safe (after centuries of non-stop persecution and multiple genocides). There are nearly FIFTY Muslim countries, and many of those countries are extremely wealthy and could protect and home the entire population of Palestine if they wanted to. The rest of the Arab world has either turned its back on Palestine, or is (in the case of Iran) actively bombing infrastructure in Gaza and funding terrorism that will actively harm Palestinians because Iran wants to kill all Jews, and doesn't care how many Palestinians are hurt or killed in the process.

I'm not defending the actions of the Israeli government, no one I know agrees with the violent oppression and apartheid of the current government. Everyone I know has serious concerns about Israel's swing to the far right and the growing power the ultra-religious have in Israeli politics. And this systemic violent oppression is not just of the Palestinians, but of minority groups within Israel, such as Israeli Bedouin. Systemic violent oppression of Israeli Bedouin by the Israeli government is just as bad, yet somehow the world media don't give the tiniest shit. Most people outside Israel have never even heard of this! And that raises the question, why is the plight of some oppressed people (like Palestinians) a massive worldwide issue, while the plight of other equally oppressed people (like Bedouin, or Muslim Uyghurs in China) goes totally ignored? What political agenda is being served by this cherry picking?

👆 this totally. If you read nothing else please read this 👆
It should be printed out and hung on the wall.

LastTrainEast · 11/10/2023 14:51

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MonkeyHarold · 11/10/2023 14:52

"Due to the root word Semite, the term is prone to being invoked as a misnomer by those who interpret it as referring to racist hatred directed at all "Semitic people" (i.e., those who speak Semitic languages, such as Arabs, Assyrians, and Arameans). This usage is erroneous; the compound word antisemitismus (lit. 'antisemitism') was first used in print in Germany in 1879 as a "scientific-sounding term" for Judenhass (lit. 'Jew-hatred'), and it has since been used to refer to anti-Jewish sentiment alone."

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisemitism

AskNotForWhomTheBellCurves · 11/10/2023 15:38

I think you can be against the actions of the state of Israel without being an antisemite, yes.

I also think there's no obligation for anyone to to take an even-handed interest in every geopolitical issue, which would be impossible anyway. As an individual it's fine to feel more invested in one conflict than another, especially at times like this when it's all over the news, and no-one should be derailing legitimate criticsm of the Israeli government's actions with 'why aren't you condemning crimes against the Uyghurs/Armenians/Rohingya just as strongly?'

That said, I think it's worth examining why the British left as a whole has such a disproportionate investment in this particular conflict.

Why did I used to see 'free Palestine' stickers everywhere in my very left-wing hometown, but none condemning, for example, the treatment of women in Saudi Arabia, gay people just about anywhere in the Middle East, the numerous other repressive and sometimes genocidal regimes that existed at the time?

Why were BDS and the boycott of Israeli products so much more successful than any similar contemporary campaigns against countries with questionable or downright repressive policies - if indeed there were any other such campaigns, I don't know, as if so they weren’t successful enough for me to have heard of them?

Why did my student union have a Palestinian flag hanging outside its headquarters, when I don't remember them saying a word about any of the many atrocities taking place in other countries, and the Palestinian cause had nothing really to do with student politics?

I don't doubt that most if not all of the individuals behind those things sincerely believed that they were campaigning for a right and just cause, and would condemn open antisemitism almost as sincerely (although they might be privately of the view that Jews do have a tendency to bang on about the Holocaust just a tad, and yes, of course everyone knows it was terrible, but it was more than 70 years ago, after all...) But if there was nothing else influencing individuals' priorities except the fact that no-one can be informed about all world affairs, wouldn't you expect that on a population level it would even out?

For what it's worth I personally don't actually think antisemitism in itself is the primary cause of this collective preoccupation - I think the main factor is that people erroneously see Israel as a predominantly white, almost Western country, while the Palestinians are portrayed as poor downtrodden brown people who can't really be expected to understand that violence is wrong. During a previous flare-up of the conflict I heard a (white British) woman on the pro-Palestinian side actually say in response to a question about violence against Israeli civilians that the Palestinians aren't to blame for that because they're too uneducated to know better, which was a real mask slip moment. If anything I think it's just as much Islamophobia/anti-brown racism as antisemitism, although it's a different type of prejudice in both cases - even though the truth is that even people from the region can't tell Sephardic Jews and Arabs apart just by looking.

And before anyone brings it up, yes, I'm aware that the far right also has a huge problem with antisemitism. But most of them will openly admit that they hate Jews, at least amongst themselves, and also I don't think they're the ones tweeting 'from the river to the sea' from NUS leadership positions. I'm more interested in the left because I think a lot of their issues in this respect are unconscious and therefore more insidious, and because they're the ones more likely to be reading this here.

lookingforMolly · 11/10/2023 15:39

It's true though.. you wouldn't lecture a Black individual on what is & isn't racism so why would you tell a Jewish individual what is and isn't Anti Semitism... ?? Would you?

AskNotForWhomTheBellCurves · 11/10/2023 15:44

Having said that I don't think it's primarily down to antisemitism, I also completely agree with everything @CoughingMajoress said, especially with regards to all Jewish people automatically being assumed to have an opinion on Israel when we don't expect other ethnic minorities to have strong views on the actions of some random government. (Though I think ethnically Arab Muslims do get some of the same treatment, though perhaps not from the same quarters.)

feralunderclass · 11/10/2023 15:55

I am staunchly anti Zionist but not anti semitic at all. Many Arabs are semites, and many Christians are Zionists. I follow a lot of Jewish people on social media and I don't think a single one of them can accept the fact that someone might be against Israeli policy without them being a "jew hater". Someone on another thread questioned this anti zionist=antisemitic thing and a Jewish poster said that as the vast majority of Jews are Zionist by creed they feel extremely defensive and reflexively 'lash out' with the antisemitic accusation. It's an effective way to close down any discussion.

thecatsthecats · 11/10/2023 15:56

I mean, quite frankly I think it's bloody obvious that people don't understand. It's not a normal subject to be expert on.

Speaking as an ex-genocide scholar myself, it's very much the norm that people don't understand the subtleties and nuances, and react accordingly.

In fact, speaking as an ex-genocide scholar, I'd say the nuances and subtleties are actually pretty irrelevant, because the basic human psychology of any prolonged inter-tribal conflict is the same. Having performed comparative studies, it's always pronounced how each conflict is regarded as a specially unique tragedy by those concerned. They're tragedies certainly, but they're not one of them unique. The behaviour patterns on both sides (and international responses) are 100% typical.

But people don't like to think this behaviour is part of the normal range of human behaviour. They like to think that it's a special kind of evil that can be avoided if you express enough disgust, or obsess over the context in enough detail.

feralunderclass · 11/10/2023 16:01

lookingforMolly · 11/10/2023 15:39

It's true though.. you wouldn't lecture a Black individual on what is & isn't racism so why would you tell a Jewish individual what is and isn't Anti Semitism... ?? Would you?

I would absolutely tell (not lecture) a Jewish person why I believe me being anti Zionist is not antisemitic. I really don't see the problem. Racism is so widespread and can be so nuanced that not everyone from the same race will always agree about what is racist.

feralunderclass · 11/10/2023 16:04

And just to be clear, I'm anti Zionist across all contexts, not just the current conflict.

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