To have lost it at DS aged 11

[FluthyFeaffers]

I have yelled at him this evening.
He is 11, soon to be 12.
Started Yr 7 in secondary school 3 weeks ago.
He is struggling so much with his (lack of) organisation in the mornings before school, I am at my wits end.
I spent the whole of year 5 and 6 battling, absolutely battling with him to get ready for school, but never succeeded. We were late every single day for 2 years.
"Eat your breakfast" gets distracted eating breakfast.
"Clean your teeth" goes upstairs to clean teeth but wanders around doing something else.
"Get dressed" goes in to bedroom to get dressed but ends up doing something else.
Etc. Etc. All through year 5 & 6.
It made us late because whilst this was going on I'm racing around trying to get myself ready for work and trying to get my other younger DC ready. Then I'd go and check on DS and he'd never ever have done what I'd sent him to do.
Nothing worked to motivate him. No reward system, no sticker chart, no amount of explaining about the repercussions of not doing as asked, no amount of explaining about the knock on effect of being late for school. I tried it all for 2 years. Nothing worked.
But because it was primary school, all that happened to him was we missed the school gate and had to go roundcto the front reception to be let in. He got a warm friendly greeting from teachers and I got a look of "Why can't you get your poor child in to school on time" and then I'd arrive late for work and get reprimanded for it.
So I spent the whole summer drilling it in to him that in Yr 7 he must must must get to school on time, because in secondary school if you're late you get a detention, because you're causing your sibling masses of stress by making them late for school every time you're late for school, because I am getting in to serious trouble at work because of arriving late every day because I drop you in late because you're not ready to leave on time, because it creates SO MUCH STRESS when you won't get ready in time to leave on time for school.
Yes yes yes yes yes mum, he said every time I brought it up over summer.
I promise, promise, promise I will change, he said.
4 weeks in to secondary school, and it is a nightmare every single morning.
He cannot, cannot get himself ready for school in time to leave.
I spell out for him every single morning what he needs to do. It's soooooo eeeeeasy. It's the same god damn things every single day! Nothing changes! Do x, y, z.
"Yes mum" wanders around.
"Have you done x, y and z?"
"No, sorry, I forgot. I'll do it now"
Wanders off.
"Why haven't you done x? Ive asked you twice now"
"Sorry"
"Do it now"
"Why haven't you done y? I've asked you 3 times"
"I'm sorry. I'll do it. I'm trying my best"
Last week he needed to take his PE bag on 1 of the says.
"Remember to take your PE bag today, it's hanging in the cupboard " I said.
"Oh yeah!!!!! PE!!!!! I forgot!!!!!! Thanks for reminding me!!!!!"
20 mins later:
"Have you got your PE bag?"
"Oh No! I forgot! I'll get it now...."
15 mins later, after non stop constant continuous marshalling to get ready, do this, do that, do this, do that:
"Right, come on, we're late again, pick up your rucksack and your PE bag we need to leave NOW"
DS hovers around putting on tie and blazer which I'd asked him to do the the past hour sling with all his other things he needs to do.
"NOW" I raise my voice, as he's making my other child late for school and me late for work.
He runs out the door, jumps in the car.
We get to school.
He turns pale and says "I've forgotten my PE bag"
"Tough" I say. " I have told you 3 times this morning to take your PE bag. I reminded you for the 3rd time right before we left home."
DS starts crying
"I will get a detention!!!!!!!!!"
His worst, absolute worst fear, is getting a detention. He's never had one, and is terrified of getting one.
"Maybe you'll learn if you get a detention " I say.
Then he starts begging and pleading with me to take him home to get his PE bag. He's crying sorry over and over again. He looks physically ill, sweating, clammy, pale.
So I drive him home to get PE bag.
My other child starts crying because now she is horribly late for school (different school) and is too young to go in by herself plus she has SEN and isn't mature enough to cope with going in by herself.
I drop him back to school. He's late. I drop DD toschool. She's late. I get 'the look' from her teachers. I drive to work. I'm late. I get disciplined by my boss.
That evening, I talk to DS for a very, very long time about the impact of his disorganisation in the mornings.
We work out that it would help him if I wrote down for him everything he needs to do in the mornings.
So I write it all out in very clear, bullet point steps. I show it to him, he thinks it's really helpful.
Great, I think.
Why didnt I think of this before.
1 week on, it's of no help at all.
This morning, he's wandering around telling me he's ready whilst simultaneously having forgotten 7 instructions in his morning list. I pointed each of the 7 things on the list out to him, staring each thing that was on the list that he hadn't done.
I told him to do them.
Went off to get other child ready to leave, I'm ready to leave, DS still not ready to leave. We were all late again.
Yesterday, he had something really important to take to school. His timetable. I askedchim SIX TIMES to put his timetable in to his rucksack (he'd got it out at home and I'd seen it in theclounge). I told him the night before, and again in the morning, 6 separate times in total "Put your timetable in to your rucksack now, otherwise you will forget" . 6 times. The 6th time was just before we left. I mean, I was getting more and more stern each time. "Put. Your. Timetable. In. To. Your. Rucksack. NOW. NOW!" We got to school. He turned pale. Panicked. "Mum I've forgotten my timetable!!!!!!!".
I point blank refused to go back and sent him in to school without it. He was really upset. Told me after school today that he'd gone to the wrong classroom at one point in the day as couldn't remember without his timetable. So I said "Go and put it in your rucksack now then, do it now".
"Ok" he says.
Dinnertime:
"Did you put your timetable in your rucksack?"
"Oh No! I got distracted! I'll do it now!"
Evening time
"Is your timetable in your rucksack?"
"No.......I forgot......."
"Go and do it immediately "
"OK...."
Bedtime, he's in bed, reading:
"Darling, is your timetable in your rucksack, did you do it?"
"No, sorry, I'm sorry mum, I forgot"
And that was that.
I lost it.
Yelled at him. For ages.
I have NEVER yelled at him before. Never.
He was devastated. So remorseful. Said sorry over and over again.
And finally, he broke my heart by sadly and quietly saying "I'm so sorry for being me. I really struggle with my short term memory mummy. I know it causes problems butvi cant help it".
He's soon to be 12.
He has not got SEN.
He's bright.
He's average at school except for maths where he's below average.
He's amazing in every other way.
He's such a good boy.
He tries so hard all of the time to do his best.
He's a clever boy.
He's a wonderful personality.
Fantastic sense of humour.
Loving.
Kind.
Affectionate.
Funny.
Friends love him.
Teachers complimentary about him.
What the hell is wrong with him in tbe mornings?????????
Am I being too hard?
Am I expecting too much????

He has not got SEN.

This jumped out at me. Are you absolutely sure, because this sounds very much like a couple of people I know, one with ADHD and the other with dyslexia.

ADHD screamed out at me too, is that at all possible?

If his working memory is this bad, then actually he will almost certainly have SEN. Why are you so sure he hasn't?

You should've let him get the detention. I would have.

I think you just need to leave it up to him. Don't stress yourself out.

Don't let him have TV, gaming or his phone until he is 100% ready in the morning.

If he's late, leave him and make him walk. You'll only have to do it once or twice and he'll buck his ideas up.

He himself recognises that he struggles with short term memory.

It sounds like he needs additional tools to help him manage this.

Adhd.

Realistically the only way to stop being late is you work out a morning routine that includes you bring in the same room as him most of the time or alternating between rooms.

Set up a tick list with the routine.

Then do the routine.

He clearly can't do this on his own. Shouting is making no difference.

You need to do it with him.

This will unfortunately probably mean you getting up earlier.

You have described a child with major issues with working memory and executive function. His sister has SEN… he almost certainly does too.

That definitely sounds like adhd that's not been caught yet. I think you need to do more prep the night before. Everything should be in bags at the door ready to go so all he needs to do in the morning is eat, dress and brush his teeth? Can you spend some time in the evening with him and just be there while he does the prep work himself. That way you can keep him on track but he's still doing the tasks he needs to do to set himself up for the morning. I'd have breakfast prepped etc on the table so you've as little to do in the morning as physically possible, same for yourself and dd.

I'm not a morning person and my time keeping isn't the best so it's like a military operation in my house to give myself the best chance.

It doesn't sound just a bit of trouble with short term memory, sorry but this sounds really, really difficult. More like an absolutely huge problem with his short term memory, way outside normal forgetfulness.
I think it should be looked into by a specialist or someone?

Sounds exactly like my daughter- she has ADHD . Her working memory is not the same as many of her peers.
Giving an instruction and leaving her to it doesn’t work so for us- clothes out and ready done together the night before, shoes and weather appropriate clothes ready, she cleans her teeth same time as me, I sort the pe kit and ensure it’s in the car (and then leaves the car with her) I check the timetable and homework and sit together while it’s done etc.

Can he not get himself to school if he isn't ready on time? Walk? Get the bus?

you've described my morning with my two kids. one year 6 one year 4. The younger ones on the waiting list for adhd the other I suspect adhd too. Both have dyslexia. all I can say is I feel your pain. Leaving the house is so unbelievable stressful.

This actually made me cry. This was my middle school years. Couldn't do anything right. Always messing up. Forgetting everything. My parents thought because I was bright I couldn't possibly have SEN.

I wasn't diagnosed with ADHD until I was 34 and my life was on fire.

He can hyper focus on things though.
He can spend hours focusing on things that he's interested in, or is enjoying.
To me that's not consistent with ADHD, is it?
Or am I wrong?
He's gone through the whole of primary school with nothing ever being picked up. His grades are always average. He's amazing at reading and spelling, above average in my opinion but school says average. Poor at maths.
And his long term memory recall is phenomenal. Shocks me with the details he can remember long term. But can't bloody remember an instruction from 2 minutes ago.
He said tonight that he needs help because he thinks he's got "listening problems". I don't know what this means.....😞

Mine is similar. Is on the spectrum with specific diagnosed learning difficulty regarding inability to retain a large amount of information or instructions (eg can’t follow even basic directions and forgets something she is told to do within minutes)
Solution for us…everything gets packed the night before (apart from lunch box) and put by the front door. School uniform gets hung up on front of wardrobe including underwear and socks.
morning routine has same steps

1. get up and have breakfast
2. wash and clean teeth
3. put on school uniform
4. do hair/makeup
5. get lunch box from kitchen
6. Shoes and in car

We have to have a routine and it has to be simple - otherwise she still forgets things.
When she was younger we had a timer but now she works through an Alexa playlist! 2 songs for getting dressed, 2 for hair and makeup etc
We are still late occasionally but it used to be every day
You we’re not unreasonable to shout. It’s very very frustrating and has a huge impact on the whole family
But you do need to try to find something that works

Hyper focus is completely consistent with adhd.

Innatentive ADHD? My now adult son was like this as a child. He was bright, did well at school, but forgot or lost so many things. We were always late or just about on time. He was eventually diagnosed at university. Try not to get mad, it's just who he is.

He knows he has short term memory issues and he is crying out for help. The only thing shouting is going to achieve is stress throughout the family.

There is something wrong and it's your job as his mum to find out what it is.

(Edited as I tried to quote another post)

How do you know he doesn't have SEN?

If you're SURE he doesn't have SEN (which I think he does), then:

The mornings don't need to be this way. A tick list in plain sight for everyone to see, and a time that he has to have each task completed by. Anything not done he goes to school as he is and learns the hard way. Let him get detention, it might make him learn.

Have you had him to the GP about his memory?

Are you letting him have technology of a morning?

Does he get to bed handy and get enough sleep?

Yep sounds like my son. Inattentive type adhd

Yes, ADHD hyperfocus is a thing: https://www.additudemag.com/understanding-adhd-hyperfocus/

Would definitely be worth looking into this further

Echoing what others have said here he really needs to be assessed for ADHD.

Hyper-focus is absolutely consistent with ADHD. It's not part of the diagnostic criteria but loads of people with ADHD hyper-focus on tasks/areas of interest.

He's got ADHD. Hyper focus is definitely a trait.

I would just get more involved. I’d put his timetable in his bag. Put his PE kit in the car the evening before etc etc. There is no point demanding independence if the child hasn’t got the maturity yet. You just have to step up until he can take over.

As you have experienced, putting things off is the crux of it. He’s acknowledging what you’re saying and completely believes he will do it but even a moment’s hesitation or diversion means it’s forgotten.
so the night before he needs you to stand over him while you tell him to do things and he does them straight away. Before this starts he needs to agree this will happen and he will accept your help with it.
Don’t expect him to improve much very quickly I’m afraid though, but at least if he knows he must do it straight away and not just say yes, it’ll help the action. The list helps too.
i still had to tell my ds to clean his teeth at 18. Now he’s probably stinking people out at uni and forgetting everything there.