To let my dad go home at the cost of my mum's well being?

[JustAllRoundShit]

A couple of months ago my dad (mid 80s) had a stroke. He requires full time care as he is very weak, can't get up or walk or do anything else himself. He's fully there cognitively but very apathetic in the day. Just wants to sleep all the time. When he is not sleeping he is very agitated, aggressive and very quick to anger with lots of shouting.

He is currently in a rehab home kind of thing. He seems to be slightly improving there but he absolutely hates it and wants to go home. I totally understand why. He's always been very independent and also very dominating. It must be terrible for him to be so out of control and helpless, completely at the mercy of the carers. I would hate it as well.

I think we could organise staff to look after him at home. It would take a lot of planning, lots of staff, money, etc but it's doable (we are not in the UK). The problem is it will be a massive burden on my mum. Massive responsibility, massive mental strain because he keeps yelling for her (and not very nicely) and I'm worried that she'll spend the last few years of her life (she's early 80s) being stuck by his bed, caring for him and basically just getting yelled at all the time.

I don't want that for her. She's done her bit for him her entire life (he hasn't been the best husband. Good father but very dominating, borderline abusive husband). For my mum it would be much better if he was in a home. Then she would be free. But he'd absolutely hate it. He keeps crying, begging me to let him go home. I just don't know what to do.

What would you do?

Yanbu: bring him home, while trying to set up the house so that he will trouble my mum as little as possible

Yabu: let him stay in a home and give your mum peace. She's done her bit and we can't expect her to take on this burden.

You've answered your own question. Put him in a home.

He can’t come home. You can’t sacrifice your mum to meet a need that could probably be managed more successfully else where.

I should add that I don't live in the same country and as I have young children I can't move here either. I have just come here for a few weeks to help out my parents.

Surely it's not your decision, it's up to your mum. And I'd be strongly supporting her to say she can't manage him at home.

What does she want?

He needs to go into care. Your Mother's health is at risk given her age and her needs should be considered too.

What does your Mum want? It's her decision if she wants to be his full time carer surely?

But from what you've written, I'd be encouraging her to leave him where he is - assuming he is safe and well cared for.

From my very limited experience, his behaviour is likely to deteriorate not improve - and I'm sorry if that sounds harsh but it needs to be considered.

Why has this become your decision?

The usual situation would be for your dm to make this decision. It’s a shocking situation to put a dc in, even a middle aged adult dc.

It’s not your decision to make, it’s your Mums. Saying that though if she agrees to have him home I’d only agree to help with the arrangements on the condition that he stops shouting at her. Let him know that cannot continue and it will stop either by him choosing to do it himself or by him being kept in the care home.

I wish my df went into a home, but my dm wouldn’t let him. She did everything for him to the detriment of her own health. Both passed away now, but looking back on it, it was crazy. I’ve told dh I won’t be looking after him and he shouldn’t look after me either when we’re older.

On that basis I have said YABU and it’s your dms decision not yours. Your df has had a stroke, like mine did, it’s unsustainable.

If your country’s laws are like here, if your father is deemed to have capacity, it’s his choice- your dm can choose not to provide care, but it is his choice….

He can't go home, it would be unbearable for her. You can't expect her to deal with that sort of behaviour day in and day out. I know he's ill, but he sounds very far past 'borderline abusive' now, not just bad tempered to a degree that can be excused by illness.

I really think you should be supporting her to give her the strength to say no, he can't come home. She'll probably be feeling like she has to have him home, against her wishes, and it's really not the best thing for either of them. He'll get much better care from trained professional carers, he sounds very much like he'll try to make your mum do his care even if you have carers going to their home. That's just a recipe for one or other of them getting hurt if she tries to do things that require physical strength or stability.

For reasons I can't explain it kind of is my decision. Well, I told my mum that ultimately it's up to her to decide but I know she won't.

She wouldn't be his full time carer. We would employ staff for that. She wouldn't be doing any practical caring herself but she'd be be compelled to give emotional support, listen to him raving and shouting, maybe hold his hand. I told her we can only bring him home if she can grow thick skin, ignore his yelling and continue going about her day, just looking in on him for a an hour or two in the morning and afternoon. When he's in the home she would visit him there as well for half a day so it's not like she'd be completely free of him.

I'd like to bring him home for a week to see if it can work and if it doesn't or if my mum says so then he'll go into a home but I feel I owe it to him to try. I just can't imagine leaving him in a home for the rest of his life (most likely) when he's so desperate to go home.

It doesn't sound like a difficult decision to me. Your mum has spent most of her adult life being dominated by her husband. He's likely to get worked not better in his behaviour and manner towards her.
His needs must be met but this doesn't mean he gets to go home.

You need to have an honest talk to your mum - independently of your Dad. You need to make her aware of what bringing him home will entail. If he has been domineering and borderline abusive in the past, his frustration, anger and behaviour will worsen.

She can still care from afar

I'd like to bring him home for a week to see if it can work and if it doesn't or if my mum says so then he'll go into a home but I feel I owe it to him to try. I just can't imagine leaving him in a home for the rest of his life (most likely) when he's so desperate to go home.

If you bring him home, it'll end up him staying there. And no - you don't owe it to him to bring him home. From what you have said, he needs the kind of care that only being in a home can give him. It must be awful for him not being able to go home, but sadly, it happens to many older people

I just can't imagine leaving him in a home for the rest of his life (most likely) when he's so desperate to go home

Your poor mum. She'll likely give in and have him home when you feel like this but I really feel that she deserves better than this.

You don't owe him anything, he can cope just fine in a home with your mother visiting him, it's unfair to bring him back and force his horrible way of being back on to her.

How much is he desperate to be in a familiar environment, how much is he desperate to have your mum there to bully and shout at to do his bidding, and how much is he desperate to have not had the stroke? Only one of these is a valid wish, isn't it?

I used to work in care. And in the main, the person doing the caring always died before the person with the illness/medical condition. Simply heartbreaking.

You would be seriously compromising your Mum's quality of life allowing her to be his slave, because that's what the reality would be. Carers are in and out in the shortest time possible, and often do the bare minimum. It's not the answer.

I watched my mum look after my dad who was in no way abusive and it still nearly broke her. He sadly died last year, mum is now in her late 70’s and has just been diagnosed with a degenerative disease. She spent the last few good years of her life caring for dad. I really wish she’d had the chance to live a little.

Has he capacity to understand: if you shout at Mum you are not staying there. She is not well enough for that.Sometimes cranky men can rein it in if they know they are under threat. But will your Mum be able to relax if he is there and if you return home who will know?
It's a very difficult situation but as he has been difficult all along my sympathy would be with your Mum.

" When he's in the home she would visit him there as well for half a day so it's not like she'd be completely free of him. "

No but she'd be free to leave when he starts shouting and at least have a safe space at home that she can enjoy.
She will be well and truly trapped if you take him back home, she will have nowhere to escape him and his horrible ways.

You absolutely CANNOT dump this level of responsibility on your poor mother.

The only way to possibly allow it would be if she is absolutely adamant that she wants him to come home and the family is able to afford for 24-hour live-in care. Otherwise, no. You will make her life a living hell.

Support your mother to make the best decision for herself. Sounds she will have a miserable life of he comes home and a bearable one if she can escape-at least to a place of peace and calm at home alone at last.
No brainer to me