Barbie movie: America Ferrera’s speech on being a woman

[ClairDeLaLune]

“It is literally impossible to be a woman. You are so beautiful, and so smart, and it kills me that you don’t think you’re good enough. Like, we have to always be extraordinary, but somehow we’re always doing it wrong.

"You have to be thin, but not too thin. And you can never say you want to be thin. You have to say you want to be healthy, but also you have to be thin. You have to have money, but you can’t ask for money because that’s crass. You have to be a boss, but you can’t be mean. You have to lead, but you can’t squash other people’s ideas. You’re supposed to love being a mother, but don’t talk about your kids all the damn time. You have to be a career woman, but also always be looking out for other people. You have to answer for men’s bad behavior, which is insane, but if you point that out, you’re accused of complaining.

"You’re supposed to stay pretty for men, but not so pretty that you tempt them too much or that you threaten other women because you’re supposed to be a part of the sisterhood. But always stand out and always be grateful. But never forget that the system is rigged. So find a way to acknowledge that but also always be grateful. You have to never get old, never be rude, never show off, never be selfish, never fall down, never fail, never show fear, never get out of line. It’s too hard! It’s too contradictory and nobody gives you a medal or says thank you! And it turns out in fact that not only are you doing everything wrong, but also everything is your fault.

"I’m just so tired of watching myself and every single other woman tie herself into knots so that people will like us. And if all of that is also true for a doll just representing women, then I don’t even know."

Brilliant. That is all.

But the point is lost because AF makes this big speech about how women are seen and how everyone should strive to be what they want to be not what they're expected to be in order to regain control in Barbieland .... Only for everything goes back to how it was except MR goes to the real world ... So what was the point?

@Lapflop ,
Well, starting off with “thin” and “pretty” is not going to resonate with me, who doesn’t really aspire to these, as I don’t value these at all.

Society does though whether you do for yourself is somewhat irrelevant.

Is that as far as you read though? I was (clearly not very well, for which I apologise) pointing out that in my view (and those of all my circle of friends and colleagues), the values such as kindness, trustworthiness Etc. were, rather depressingly, missing, leading to the conclusion that these aren’t valued very much - by anyone!

It's true if you give a shit about all that stuff.

Some of society does. The women I know who have made it into management, academia or executive positions are not notably thin, pretty or young. They got there through talent and hard work and brains. If you want to argue they had to work a lot harder than a man to get there, I might agree. But that isn't what the speech says. If by society you mean industries like the media and film, where looks are judged important, yes women and men will be judged. Many less than perfect looking people find partners, friends and meaningful work. The speech has no nuance. It insists on some unnameable, invisible force that makes women have to worry about how they look. On a subconscious level it even introduces worry to women who might never have thought their appearance was what people valued, by telling them they 'have to' worry. But think about it. Do you really care how thin or pretty the midwife is, the doctor, the scientist, the writer? Of course, looking after health and being clean is valued, but the obsession with looks counts for very little in many areas of socisty.

PP seem very focused on what the speech has to say about appearance but there is a lot more in it than that.

Maybe barbie wants a vagina so she can have great sex with a woman, not all vaginas are for men

Tbf, the whole speech is about being worried about how you appear to other people. I find it very self obsessed, egotistical even. I think a lot of unhappiness results from focusing too much on oneself.

Hounded how? 😂 I would say you’re more guilty of this and even that’s a stretch. You just seem to be taking offence at everything.

Don’t be silly. Of course I’m not .

One can say their own opinion, doesn’t mean they are offended.

And I wasn’t talking to you.

I’m confused. You quoted me.

Back to the original point though - this soft core feminism is important for the young girls to see - it introduces them to the idea of patriarchal society and how we can break free without completely burning them out.

I honestly think we need to break away from this idea of who can be a more hardcore feminist and who can shout about the many times of women in the same speech and just come together and support one another.

Yes she didn’t say you don’t have to have kids, you can be childless, but she also didn’t say you HAVE to be a mother.

someone mentioned you seem to be gatekeeping, and I agree with that on some level. Do you agree with a feminist society?

Of course it would be nice if women, or feminist could and would support each other, but it seem quite impossible, perhaps because we are all different, with different expiriences, so expirience misogyny in different ways.
I’ve had no support right here on this thread, on a contrary, even though I’m strongly pro-women.

I don’t believe in ’gatekeeping’ it’s a lazy term for lazy people, who want some kind authority on what is the right opinion everyone is allowed to have.

What kind of feminist? What kind of society would that be? If it’s actually pro-women, support women - even the women who don’t follow the life plan and do as been told, then I can’t see why there would be a problem.
If it’s the type that, for example just from this thread, says that women are ’ugly’ if they don’t perform to the male gaze. Then no thank you. That kind of ’feminism’ doesn’t interest me.

That’s why it wans’t feminism.
The movie makers woudn’t risk being called ’kink shamers’, or ’anti-women’ ’choice’ re: plastic surgery.
They didn’t even mention the part of being childfree.

The movie was just punch of young pretty women, in their safe male-gaze way whining about things (real as they may) and just being upset about it. Mostly about looks.

I agree with this completely. Barbie going in for an abortion at the end, rather than a gynae check-up, would have been bloody amazing.

Wouldn't happen in a million years.

Safe, non threatening fake feminism that does precisely fuck all to challenge the real problems facing women and girls today.

Safe, non threatening fake feminism that does precisely fuck all to challenge the real problems facing women and girls today.

I don't get this attitude, so is it better to do absolutely nothing unless you can challenge and fix all of the issues?

This thread reminds me why I dislike a lot of feminism these days though, judgemental and divisive rather than anything else, ew.

But it doesn't challenge or fix anything at all. I took my 12 year old daughter and one of her friends, along with my 9 yo son and one of his friends.

Talked to them all about it afterwards walking home. None of them "got it" or were remotely empowered or helped or educated by it.

Fine to say it's just Hollywood money-making bollocks that looks pretty. Not fine to pretend it achieves anything of any value.

Thinking that feminism should actually have some meaningful impact on women and girls isn't a new concept "these days". It's sort of the foundational idea of feminism.

The movie didn't have to fix the patriarchy but it didn't really help the cause either with the fake feminism focused around appearance.

In your opinion it doesn't achieve anything, who are you to tell other people what is 'fine'. I liked it but I can see why some didn't, I wouldn't be as ignorant to say it's not fine to dislike it. 12 and 9 year olds probably aren't the target audience, with your attitude perhaps your daughter will benefit from hearing it again in a few years. It's also a film and not claiming to be world changing, keen to hear what you do to progress things for women and girls that has a wider reach and impact than this though?

with your attitude perhaps your daughter will benefit from hearing it again in a few years.

what on earth do you mean by this? My daughter's grasp of feminism is already way beyond this nonsense.

keen to hear what you do to progress things for women and girls that has a wider reach and impact than this though?

are you? OK, great. I run a programme for young care leavers primarily from global majority backgrounds that supports them to enter the workforce, including financial support for travel, clothing and childcare, and support with applications for apprenticeships and benefits.

I donate money and time to organisations that support women's reproductive rights, including access to contraception and abortion.

I financially support two small local charities that help women escaping domestic violence and leaving prison to build new lives for themselves and their children.i volunteer at a drop in for refugees and asylum seekers and help them to fill in forms, provide them with food and hygiene products, etc.

I support both financially and vocally organisations and individuals that seek to protect women's sex-based rights to privacy, dignity and safety. I donate to campaigns that seek to end FGM and forced marriage.

Perhaps none of this has the 'reach' of a Hollywood studio film with a billion dollar marketing budget selling faux feminism to the world. But at least it has the potential to make a real, permanent difference to the lives of women and girls.

A pretty Hollywood actress spouting some 'live, love, laugh' level superficial bullshit does precisely fuck all to help women. However convenient it is to think it does.

Why? How so?
What do you want from feminist?
For all of us to smile and giggle and nod how fun this mivie is?
To lie and say yes, worst thing about being a woman is how I’m not thin enough and what make-up fashion is on trend now?

Can you explain why you need women to silently support women who just uphold the patriarchy?

How has a thread about a speech in a film become so toxic 💀

A very small part of that speech is about physical appearance. Why are so many posters focusing exclusively on that part?0

Quite aside from the fact that it introduces anxieties to those who have never fixated on the issues raised, a lot of the speech is utter nonsense.

“You have to have money, but you can’t ask for money because that’s crass.”

Literally no one says or thinks this anymore? They still struggle to, but women ARE increasingly and everywhere encouraged to be as confident as men in asking for pay rises.

“You have to be a boss, but you can’t be mean.”

A very reasonable expectation of bosses.

“You have to lead, but you can’t squash other people’s ideas.”

Another reasonable expectation of leaders.

“You’re supposed to love being a mother, but don’t talk about your kids all the damn time.”

Another very reasonable expectation - maintain an identity and interests beyond motherhood.

What is the speech even saying at this point. Life can be complex and complicated for everyone. It’s just a tirade of endless problematisation. It’s also defensive and passive - where’s the bit where they say ‘and please STOP giving a fuck about all of the above?’

It reads like the first post of an AIBU thread where a woman complains about working to the bone plus having to sort out Christmas arrangements and presents for all her and her DH’s family. Except it misses the next 20 pages of that thread where tens of posters rally around that woman, bolstering her and telling her to stop being a doormat.

Give us the the rest of that fucking AIBU thread. At least show us that it exists!

Thinking that feminism should actually have some meaningful impact on women and girls isn't a new concept "these days". It's sort of the foundational idea of feminism
Agreed.
It's why I struggle with feel-good, you-do-you, celebrate every choice as empowerment styles of 'feminism'.

They sound nice and fluffy, but fail to consider the big questions about WHY women are socialised in a certain way, WHY beauty standards are as they are, WHY girls are brought up with a set of values and ideas that are likely to limit them unless they have parents and friends who actively challenge norms, etc.

If something gets new people thinking about feminism, great. They're might go on to learn more and ask bigger questions.

If it is just another road to "you do you " with a side note of claiming feminists who questions the impact of systemic issues on women's behaviour is anti-women" then I've not got time for it. Rebranding female oppression as empowerment and female liberation as oppressive was one of the best moves the patriarchy has pulled

@Prrambulate That's a great analysis