AIBU to not want the naughty child in my son's class

[Bingolocco]

My DS is about to start reception and is moving over with a group of children from his preschool. There were 26 in the class of these 13 boys are going into one class while my DS is going into another with only 4 other boys from the preschool
One of the boys is known amongst the parents as being particularly naughty, always in the thinking chair and my DS says he has "nasty hands" and on more than one occasion my DS has been upset from this boy being unkind/rough with him.
My DS would be one of the youngest and I am annoyed that this child has been placed in the same class as my son while a lot of his other friends have gone into the other class.
AIBU for being annoyed about this? It's too late to speak to the school as the children have had their settling in session but I just wish this boy was not in his class.

We all knew in Reception who the 'naughty children' were.

You did not. You just thought you did because the majority of primary school teachers knew sweet fuck all about SN/SEN at the time - I use those abbreviations though prefer additional needs myself because that was what was en vogue at that time. It may be better now but certainly when my ds went through the ringer of mainstream in around 2008, most teachers didn't have a clue - I believe SEN was an elective option in teacher training and most teachers didn't do it.

My ds was spotted as one "the naughty kids" turns out he had autism/dyspraxia/sensory processing disorder/hyper mobility and I ended up having to remove him to home educate at age 8 after he was assaulted by a teacher in school. After removal, within weeks he was a completely different child who returned to college at age16 and did brilliantly with never a complaint, only high praise, from any education professional who has had contact with him since.

This happened with my child and I was gutted.
The ‘naughty’ kid ended up in his class and some parents were pretty gutted.
A few years down the line and the ‘naughty’ kid is on of the nicest boys in his year and also class monitor. He’s such a lovely boy and my son has a great friendship with him.
There’s loads of kids with challenging behaviour and SEN needs that change throughout the school years plus some terrible parenting 🫣🫣
Stop worrying and let the school deal with things. They are the most experienced and pick up on behavioural challenges fairly quickly.

My son had several 'naughty' kids in his class, some with SEN which made it a bit nore complicated, and I honestly counted the years until he went to secondary. They spoiled so many classroom lessons and trips etc, and were disruptive on a daily basis. Of course, the teachers couldn't do anything about the presence of these kids any more than the parents could, but that whole class (whether they were more or less naughty) were failed in terms of support and access to education).

That's fair enough until your child is hit or bullied regularly as 'communication'.

'These kids'... really?

This.

The problem I have is when 'but they have SEN needs' is used as a licence to fail to safeguard the other children from violence or emotional abuse.

School have a duty of care to all children and to balance the needs of all kids.

Yanbu, but there will always be a naughty child. In my reception class the naughty child moved away 😃 so the school in its wisdom decided to take a naughty child from the year above and stick him in our class 😡 so that it was fairer for the teachers.

The school’s priority is not what’s best for the children, it’s what’s easiest for the teachers. It does seem really unfair that almost all of the preschool group are going into one class while only a few aren’t. Our school did that too, I don’t know why. They also tried to put all the middle class children into one class and all the working class children into the other. This led to problems - that school was very strange.

My advice to you, as you go into this phase of your life is: don’t be afraid to be the difficult parent. If this boy becomes a problem for your child, or any different problems occur, ask for meetings with the school / write to the head. Pressure for change until the school does something.

Your child is your priority but the harsh truth is, he isn’t a priority for the school, well behaved children never are. 😢

Yes, although I will clarify that this sort of behaviour comes from 'non-SEN' kids too, just in case anyone thinks I want to blame 'SEN' for every issue in schools. As already stated, SEN kids, kids with other 'issues' and apparently 'normal' kids are being let down by the way things are at the moment, as are teaching staff.

How else would you want me to refer to a group of children?
The term 'these' is commonly used to describe a group of anything, and if someone assigns deeper meaning to that when it's not there then that isn't my problem.
Edit - are you perhaps confusing the term 'these kids' with 'these sort of kids', a different and more judgemental expression entirely?

@Springwillcome Your child is your priority but the harsh truth is, he isn’t a priority for the school, well behaved children never are. 😢

Your statement is unfortunately true, however I think that's because the current situation with schooling almost forces it to be that way.

Wow wasn't expecting the thread to pick up again
To clarify the "naughty child" seems to have settled and I've not heard anything but obviously I was initially worried as the child had been quite rough with mine and didn't want him to not enjoy learning.
Naughty doesn't necessarily mean SEN and can't jump to that conclusion or use as an excuse.
Interesting the response someone put that their SEN child was labelled naughty and hit out at others but then thrived in a special needs setting. That's the point SEN children should not be placed in a mainstream classroom without an additional support staff as the other children are the ones who suffer

But funnily enough, it’s never our own. Interesting.

greenmarsupial

I think what is unreasonable (and what should be your focus) is that there is an unfair split of the children from preschool.

I was going to say this. Why have so many boys in one class and so few in the other?

You carnt just say all SEN kids carnt be placed in a mainstream class. The majority of SEN kids aren't even diagnosed when they start reception. kids can be waiting years for a diagnosis. Then if a child needs to be moved again it can take months or even years for a child to be moved due to not enough places in more suitable schools. Yes in more extreme cases children some children need 1-1 in mainstream but again this comes down to funding, even if they get it those 1-1 teachers often will be used for the whole class to specifically for that child. Lastly all SEN kids don't need to be in a special school when their needd can be met in mainstream.

I know children who are mute, who still wear nappies full time,who can not do anything for themselves and are still in mainstream school because there isn't any sen schools to go to.
They are full! This government has not put any money into schools esp sen!
My son who perhaps count as a naughty child has ASD,tic disorder and under investigation for ADHD he is 9 and we have only just got an EHCP for him.
Myself and school have been fighting for this!
I don't know what else parents and schools can do.

I'm so glad the other child is now worthy of sharing a classroom with your perfect specimen.

Well that is a ridiculous statement

Yes glad he made the grade 😂

But I just posted for a bit of reassurance from other parents, I know most won't admit it but you'd prefer a disruptive child who hits not to be in their childs class

I think people get this and would agree, but you are never going to know all the children in your child's class anyway! There might be another 'hitter' coming from another pre-school. Sometimes it's better the devil you know!

All behaviour is communication, my daughter is non verbal and autistic and this is what u r taught , its a shame its not Universally known, as ur comments is not nessasery right. If a child is acting out then there is a need. They may not have a disability or condition but they may have trauma at home like abuse or neglect. Which wouldn't be child's fault. I'm not excusing behaviour I'm just saying it could be reason. If a child is getting all their needs met they won't be lashing out. And yes children with a SN should definitely get the extra support with staff and put in right setting ( somtimes SN settling) but in the real world them things just doesn't happen when they should and it takes a lot of fighting and can take years! That's fault of government who has slashed SN funding !

in around 2008, most teachers didn't have a clue

I started teaching in 1996. We had Send registers then and a Sendco. We also had training.

Wanted to add if anyone doesn't want a 'naughty ' child in their children's class dont vote Conservative in the next big elections. As they have cut funding so much over the years they have been in power, there are not enough special schools and 99% around country are already full with 2 years plus waiting lists. And their resent answer to the SEND crisis is to just try and cut giving children EHCPs (education health care play, that is legal document to show what is going to be provided to support the child) by 20% so instead of trying to help by putting more money to invest in more special school places and more support in mainstream schools to help these children who desperately need it and to help alleviate the pressure for teachers and classes. They are just going to refuse to provide child support in the first place. (By giving them an EHCP) absolutely disgusting. So more 'naughty ' kids will be in mainstream classrooms not less.