If you are a "working mum" or a "career mum", would you make the same decision again?

[SchoolFairNostalgia]

This is inspired by another thread (but not a TAAT) about how many women end up "doing it all" in the process of trying to "have it all".

I'm a mum with a career. Busted a gut to train with babies and toddlers, and am now the main breadwinner in our house and work more hours than my DH (and earn the large majority of our income). Very lucky to have a great husband - truly one of the good'uns, and a fantastic dad to the DC. However, I still think a disproportionate amount of mental/household/family load falls on me, inevitably, as the woman. Of course there are exceptions, but on average, I reckon it's pretty indisputable(?) that this happens in our society, for mums who work for money outside the home as much or more than their husbands/partners do.

My question: is it still worth it?
If I'm honest, I might have tried to work out something different, if I had my time again - something with more traditional sex/gender roles.

So, for other "working/career mums":

YABU - no, I would totally go for a career/job/breadwinner status again

YANBU - yeah, given my time again, I'd not focus so much on career (and look for alternative like try to get DH to earn more/train, etc.??)

Interestingly, one of the dads in our group has been incredibly career focused. He is now extremely senior and earns a fortune.

His younger DD has just finished her second year at University and has struggled with her mental health. Last time we met he said how much he regrets devoting so much time to his career because he has missed his daughters growing up. He could have missed the last 4 promotions and been home more. Much to everyone's amazement he has handed his notice in and is on 6 months garden leave.

He is looking for a part time job so that he can be there for his daughter.

So in answer to your question, even men can regret too much career focus.

Nah, sorry but no.

It’s the weight of history that you are talking about, not some kind of innate ability.

I do agree that men tend to do it differently , and women - because they reckon that’s their realm - find that hard. But decent men can do it fine and it only makes decent men miserable if they aren’t given agency to do it their way.

Seriously, if he’s a decent guy, do a list, sit him him down say I’ve got 64 jobs and you’ve got 13 and this has to change because I’m writing sexist posts on mumsnet.

There are many threads on this but the easiest thing is to divide areas not tasks - he does medical, you do parties, you so packed lunches, he does laundry. And then you need to sit back and let him fuck up a bit maybe, but find his way. It won’t be your way, but you can deal with that.

It will be much better for everyone if you do this. It doesn’t work with crap men but it will with a good one.

I absolutely love being a working mum. It’s hard as fuck but I personally feel much more confident and motivated than when I stayed home for a brief moment back in the day. I know sahms who feel the same but opposite though!

You might be right. I used to think this. I just don't think it at the moment, and the older I get and the more different family set-ups I see, the more I think there is something innate about females. Why would there not be? We carry, feed, physically commit to our kids. Certain behaviours/personality traits seem (again, on average) shared across females across cultures (including lower aggression, etc). Why wouldn't there be innate differences which make us better equipped in some areas? But maybe I'll change my mind again.

(Of course, there are equivalents for males (and maybe some of the more financially valued "world of work" traits are suited best to them - which is a problem)).

Career mum - wouldn’t do it again. I’ve scrimped and saved, worked two or three jobs at times and ye I’m pleased to be where I am now. I’m comfortable, minimal financial worries, can do things I only dreamed of before. It’s just suddenly hit me in the last few months though that I’ve got a nearly teenager and just feel like I’ve missed out on so much on the way!

If I had my way again, I’d have taken things a lot slower and worked a lot less and just been a lot less stressed out.

Aah I see! Yes I'd have needed another DH too and there are days when I wish I'd made that decision 😂bloody good jobs the resulting children are fab!

The only thing i would do differently is have children with a man who respected himself and our family enough to go out and maximise his income the same way I have had to so that the pressure hasn't always fell on me all of the time to be the main earner and breadwinner

If I hadn’t worked and made a career for myself, and done everything for the house, kids and myself, then who do you think would have provided for my kids? Not every mother has a partner to provide / help them provide.

The problem isn’t working mothers. It’s shit husbands and fathers.

Even if I hadn’t been a single parent, I’m very glad I did build and maintain my career. I’ve enjoyed it and I think I’ve provided a good role model for my DDs.

There aren't innate differences. It's cultural/social conditioning. A lot of women think that they know how to raise a child 'properly' and then they want men to help but 'do things their way'. This is the issue.

Women should just 100% leave men with a child and let them handle it. Everyone is perfectly capable of looking after a child and carrying the mental load. There is no right way. There is no better way. It is just done by the person who is left to do it. There are homosexual couples who raise perfectly balanced children, there are single parents (fathers) who raise perfectly balanced children.

Men and women can both do everything, whether that's being a parent, CEO, nurse, doctor, anything. I appreciate this is not everyone's view, but unless people truly believe that men and women are equally capable, it is difficult to share tasks 50/50, because underneath there is always a belief that one sex should be doing more or something than the other.

It was hard when the kids were little but I wouldn’t change a thing. Final kid has left home now and I have a great career and pension. I have options if the worst should happen to my marriage. My job has kept me mentally active and allows me to meet all kinds of people.

My husband has shared childcare equally. We have done the same number of drop offs, picks ups, share cooking and laundry. V v few people we know have managed to share this stuff.

I made the decision that I would never do all the housework etc age ten when I saw the imbalance and tensions at home. I achieved what my ten year old self set out to do.

You're right, of course - this doesn't apply to lots of people, and lots don't have a choice (especially single parents). Just wondered about people who could muse on this choice (which lots do make, at least on some level, I think)

I feel sad now because I haven't achieved what my 10-year-old self set out to do. Well done to you and those who have, though.

@jooon
I agree totally. We we're sold a lie. I craved being a SAHM when I had DC, but just never had the choice. Unless you are independently wealthy or can claim enough benefits to stay home you need a DP willing and able to support you. The stress of those early years, rushing to nursery, sweating in traffic, being made to feel less than at work for not staying over, guilty at home for being tired and stressed. Judged for not being more involved in the endless - middle of the work day - school events.
Spending all weekend trying to get the house organised.
When EXDP left us for someone else though, as the higher earner I could take over the mortgage on the house and didn't have to worry about it bieng sold from under me at a later date. When I look at my pension forecast I am glad I don't have to worry about retirement at least.

I would never want to be a SAHM. I was for a few months and hated it. Plus I’m terrified to be dependent financially on someone else.

I had my DD a long time ago, but if WFH/hybrid was an option then I think that’s what I would’ve preferred. I’m a much better mom when I’m working. ☺️

We earn about the same, similar hours, stress etc and I think that's the ideal. No-one can complain about doing their fair share when they're bringing home 50% of the money.

I wouldn’t do a thing differently. DH is a gem and probably actually does more than his fair share because he wfh and I’m out of the house. I also work in an industry where you have a lot of flexibility which helps. But he has been supportive of me and my career every step of the way, and says his only regret about parenthood is that we didn’t start earlier.

@andHelenknowsimmiserablenow surely it's not about being sold a lie but the fact you couldn't afford to do what you wanted to do? You were never going to be happy working if you "craved" being at home? I did all that rushing around and working but have never felt like it was a lie, or I was being duped or whatever else, I was doing what I wanted to do; have a family, and have a career.

I only had a job when my kids were small and worked around them. But I had them very young. I’m not yet 40 and one dd is an adult and one kid teens.

when my kids were secondary age I changed my job, completed a degree and will soon earn more than DH and be more of a career woman. I feel that I may have done things the best way round despite mumsnet horror at younger parents, I really feel like I got the best of both worlds and wouldn’t change things.

I think it’s far more acceptable for both men and women to work from home these days. It was unheard of (in my and DH’s) industries anyway back 14 years ago when I was trying to juggle anything.

I remember a woman in my office said it had taken her 5 years to negotiate leaving at 4pm on a Friday to actually see her kids a bit earlier.. Nice place to work that was!

So hopefully a bit easier for women with kids now. If only childcare could be cheaper..

Totally disagree and this opinion is the problem. Men and women can both do all tasks, mothering etc. Believing that women are better at certain things is the absolute core of the issue.

Also agree with this 100%.

Women have been led to believe by history, society, culture that they are responsible for the quality of child related activity - if school books are forgotten or swimming not booked or vegetables not eaten then women feel they will be judged (by other women usually) not the men. This is what we need to change. Men can step up and we need to let them.

My ideal would be two part time working parents who. 0.8wte with high quality childcare.

I probably don't count as a "career mum" because my work, although incredibly important to me and socially useful, isn't very well paid so DH is by far the higher earner. I'm happy with what I've got, which is a job that I'm passionate about but that I can do 4 days a week term-time only, and be home in time to have dinner with the kids every night. But I'm very aware that having a DH who is a high earner allows me to make that choice. If we were in a precarious financial position maybe I suppose I might well regret my choices.

My own DM always worked FT and had a successful career that involved long hours and a lot of travel. She was a great Mum, we are very close and I don't believe it damaged me in any way. But she has confided that she feels she missed out when I was growing up, that she felt stressed a a lot of the time (she hid it well! I had no idea) and that if she had her time again she would have said "sod the money" and gone part time.

yes, I am old, and it was unheard of in my time. Was born about 20 years too early.

Im a working mum. Soul carer or children so no choice in it not being a career. I cant compete/take on more

I'm a working mum. FT plus on call. I do most of the mental and physical load. It's tough when mum friend don't work have lovely clean houses and and have loads of free time. But I would say over the past year or so I thought about leaving my DP for various reasons. Being a working mum means I am financially independent and able to freely make that decision. I wouldn't change that for the world.

WFH makes a big difference for us. We both WFH and the lack of commute and being in the house makes life a lot easier, as we can get chores done during the odd break, and then once work is finished we are instantly in 'family' mode. It would make life a lot harder if we both worked out of house and I think I would find it much more of a balancing act.