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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU - Transgender 'athletes'

440 replies

HappyHippo1234 · 06/04/2023 00:38

To start off - I have no issue with trans people at all. The only issue I have is transgender females (male to female) competing in women sports.

Yes, they may have been taking hormones and they have lost some muscle and gained some fat. But, they have stronger bones and bigger spines, hands, feet, lungs and hearts. Basically trans females have an advantage over biological females.

What I absolutely HATE about the situation, it the trans athletes attitude, it honestly disgusts me. Did they never take biology as teenagers or learn about puberty?
For them to sit there with their wins and say that they have no advantage just p*sses me off. Are they stupid or ignorant? There's no way they don't know they have an advantage. Do they not realise they are taking wins away from girls and woman who have spent their whole lives training for a sport only for it to be taken away from someone who was a mediocre male.

Look at Lia Thomas, she was somewhere in the 400-500th best college male swimmer or something like that. She is now trans and BAM she is number 1 and winning everything.

It just annoys me to no end. Especially the trans woman who you can tell that they KNOW they have a major advantage and are cheating the system and then sit there with a SMUG GRIN on their faces. I mean every Caitlyn Jenner said it's wrong.

Sorry for the rant. My DD15 has been upset all week as on the weekend another girl beat all the girls by a huge stretch in her cross country meet (her team is usually 1st but were bumped to 2nd). At first everyone thought this girl was great, until one mom heard the group the girl was with discussing the results and how it was great for the team that this girl came out as trans and was boosting their results etc! Fair to say that news travelled quickly and there were MANY parents complaining to officials. But surprise surprise nothing was done about it. So at the award giving ceremony everyone waited as everything up to 1st place was given out and as soon as they got to the 1st team, I would say 95% of people walked away. It felt harsh but necessary!
(Also the girl was 16 and had only recently transitioned from what we could gather and when you actually looked at her you could tell she had gone through at least some portion of male puberty). Again nothing against the girl just don't think she could compete.

And to get around all these discrimination lawsuits, I think they should change the categories! Have an XX category and an XY category, that why there is no debate and no 'discrimination' as you can't identify as XY if you are XX! (And then also have an open category where trans, non-binary etc. can compete).

SORRY THAT WAS SO LONG. NOW FOR THE VOTE:

YABU - Trans (XX) women are woman and should be allowed to compete with XY women, even though they scientifically have an advantage.

YANBU - They will always have an advantage and so should not compete with XY women.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
21
Helleofabore · 07/04/2023 19:29

wicked

The confusion around this current usage of ‘women’ does lend itself to thinking that this poster was referring to female people. But alas, I do think they were referring to male people. Despite the denial.

It is incredibly harmful for any person to deny their sex category. And those who repeat the lie in an attempt to ‘support’ them are continuing the harm. It is not inclusive. It has deadly consequences to encourage any human to deny their sex in the way that that poster has done today.

If they repeated that to a doctor at emergency, the repercussions would be serious. Say they are male people taking estrogen and reducing testosterone. Never, ever encourage someone to deny the sex that person was born.

Helleofabore · 08/04/2023 09:52

Here is Riley Gaines’ account of what happened to her in San Francisco at a university where she was invited to speak about her experience.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11950063/RILEY-GAINES-hit-face-man-dressed-woman-speaking-against-trans-movement.html

After assaulting her and intimidating her, protestors had her blocked in a side office for three hours, trying to get in to her and would not let her and the campus security team out.

A female swimmer who speaks about her experience competing with a male in her female event and encountering that male watching the women in the change room and exposing their penis.

RILEY GAINES: I was hit for speaking out against trans movement

GAINES: I was shaken and exhausted but not deterred. Because for all the rage and intimidation, that mob failed. This only encourages me to speak louder.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11950063/RILEY-GAINES-hit-face-man-dressed-woman-speaking-against-trans-movement.html

Flowerly · 08/04/2023 11:51

They will kill a woman. That is what they are whipping themselves up to do. Horrifying.

MarshaBradyo · 08/04/2023 11:53

Unbelievable

Pure male aggression

Flowerly · 08/04/2023 11:53

MsJD · 07/04/2023 13:57

Trans women are women. If the science supports that, then you guys will just ignore it and post links to the science that doesnt support that. We are just going to have to agree to disagree. This is like going onto the Manchester United supporters discussion group and trying to persuade them to support City.
Happy Easter.

Utter nonsense. And EVERYONE knows it.

WickedSerious · 08/04/2023 13:13

Does the science that says men are women also tell us we can get pregnant if we sit on a damp mattress?

MovedByFanciesThatAreCurled · 08/04/2023 13:18

MsJD · 07/04/2023 13:57

Trans women are women. If the science supports that, then you guys will just ignore it and post links to the science that doesnt support that. We are just going to have to agree to disagree. This is like going onto the Manchester United supporters discussion group and trying to persuade them to support City.
Happy Easter.

No. They are men. Everyone knows this. You are living in a fantasy world - one which you wish others to be complicit in. Again, no. No. No. No. No. No. Never.

SquidwardBound · 08/04/2023 13:22

WickedSerious · 08/04/2023 13:13

Does the science that says men are women also tell us we can get pregnant if we sit on a damp mattress?

It’s presumably the same science that male humans can grow cervixes.

SidewaysOtter · 09/04/2023 17:54

SquidwardBound · 08/04/2023 13:22

It’s presumably the same science that male humans can grow cervixes.

Show quote history

And is it the same sort of science that says that women can 'shut down' their reproductive system if they're raped?

Issania87 · 10/04/2023 13:21

Justalittlebitduckling · 06/04/2023 07:35

I agree with you. The other thing I really take issue with is when they take up limited spaces designed for women eg they are the woman on a conference panel, or they are the womens rep for a student Union, or take a place on an internship that is designed to encourage women in industries and fields that are traditionally male dominated. Because they’ve had all the advantages of growing up male, and never been told they can’t do those things or faced barriers and stereotypes. Also, they’re just not representative of the majority of women.

Other than that, not bothered.

Agreed, that really annoys me as well. They have not had the experiences that women have while growing up etc to be representative of us, just like I wouldn't speak at a panel on what it was like to be transgender.

You cannot ignore biology and sport needs to remain clearly based on people's biological sex and not their gender. To argue that there is no advantage for transwomen to compete against biological women is a pure fallacy. Why else do you not see trans-men competing against biological males? Because they would have no hope in hell of winning.

Issania87 · 10/04/2023 13:30

Lamplit · 06/04/2023 08:39

So once trans women have accepted that they cannot compete fairly in races with biological women, that they cannot enter protected spaces solely for the use of biological women like bathrooms, changing spaces and domestic abuse refuges etc (all perfectly reasonable) are we happy or at least accepting enough to call them by their chosen female name, respect their choice to present superficially as a woman (whatever that means) ? Not all trans folk are rapists, violent, fetishists are they ? Surely if you know and like the trans person or they are a random person you meet for a second there's nothing wrong with going along with their wishes and addressing them as she...or are people wholly opposed to the idea of trans people and have no intention of going along with it all ?

Absolutely not, if someone wants to live as female and be addressed as she to live a happy and fulfilled life then of course they should. But that should not disadvantage biological women, or result in the erosion of women's rights.

BuHao · 10/04/2023 13:37

Fancylike · 06/04/2023 07:07

Transwomen need to compete in the male category with all the other males. If this means they need to drop down a few levels or stick to social sport, so what, that’s exactly what everyone else undergoing performance-reducing medical treatment does.

Seeing it’s just about a love of the sport, and not winning, it shouldn’t be a problem, right?

Choices have consequences. You want to identify as the other sex and suppress testosterone. Fair play. But if that means you aren’t quite as good at sports as you were, then so be it. That’s life. Doesn’t mean you get to infiltrate female sports.

BuHao · 10/04/2023 13:39

Oops @fancylike, tried to quote…thought I’d failed but obviously not! I completely agree with your post.

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