To try to ‘copy’ private education in state school

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My daughter goes to a good state school. I’m thinking of sending my younger son (he is currently 7) to private secondary school - he is quite bright so would probably pass the entrance exams and also due to salary progression we will be able to afford it in 4 years time - we can’t at the moment send my daughter. Also - she is very smart but not academic so would probably not pass the exams( I’ve had a look at past papers)she is oblivious to all this I’ve never mentioned it to her at all

I don’t want my daughter to feel like i didn’t prioritise her - what can I do to give her similar ish opportunities to that of private school ? We can’t afford fees but can pay for clubs/tuition etc

For parents whose kids are in private, what would you recommend ? A tutor / musical instrument/ drama club / debate club /?

any ideas please ? Or AIBU?

I just want to give them both the best I can :( it’s hard bring a parent I feel guilty all the time

All this chat about innate and acquired advantages and the (un)fairness of it all, and the most obvious point is being overlooked.

Is the DS pretty? If he is, he'll be able to marry well. His future partner will in all likelihood have a great job and will provide for him. I wouldn't waste money on an academic education though - far better to ensure he can sing, dance, perhaps play the harp? He needs to know of the world, but not too much. Mustn't risk upstaging his future partner. Make sure he has a good online presence and garners plenty of likes on social media while he's still young and before the ravages of age afflict him. Only if he's plain would it be more important that he be set up with a skill or trade - this is so he can manage to live independently even if no-one wants him and he becomes a lonely INCEL renting a squalid one-bed basement flat in his 30s.

This is the only basis on which I would even contemplate differential treatment between two children ... if one was so ugly that they essentially have special needs requiring preferential advancement as they'd not otherwise find a suitable partner. It goes without saying that the OP's DD must surely be fabulous - hence the concern for the DS, right?

Lots of MH issues and bullying in non-fee paying and usually not dealt with seriously or swiftly.

I didn't mean to say that at all.

It's unfair to treat your DC differently (unless there is a good reason for it, such as special needs).

I and my siblings were treated differently and we have all had difficulties with it. But our actual grades at O and A level were all pretty similar, so it really wasn't about the outcome. It was about the journey.

Not worth paying for them then?

Please don't do this. My parents did - 4 children - half to state - half to private. We're all in our 30's now. All have at least a masters and decent careers. But it really fucked us up. There is still so much resentment. And none of us speak to our parents. It our case it was just one of the very fucked up and unfair things they did. But it contributed to the whole situation.

Please don't do this to your daughter - you'll make her feel less worthy all her life.

It's unfair to treat your DC differently (unless there is a good reason for it, such as special needs

Ethelswith Yes but surely it’s only unfair if one child gets an advantage.

In what way were you and your siblings treated differently?

Can you fake the social connections they would have made going private? If not then you’re wasting your time.

In my experience Independent schools are much more concerned about their own reputations than the welfare of individual pupils when it comes to bullying, issues etc.
They circle the wagons to protect the name, the brand and the money.

they have the luxury of being able to get rid of children when there are issues whether that ‘issue’ is that they’ll drag down the school’s result’s with poor academic ability or harm the schools reputation with accusations of bullying being badly handled.

State schools can’t just bin pupils they find inconvenient, private schools can and do.

The issue, as I see it, with trying to replicate private education is that your options eat into free time. The additional educational support, the extra curricular activities (dance, extra languages, tennis etc) are contained in school hours so the kids can get home and chill. If your option is to do school and then tutors and then extra classes/sports that's time away from chilling and pottering about which is often overlooked in terms of value.

I went to private school from age 15 and my sister went to state all the way through.
I had a scholarship and a bursary and then went on to uni.
I have a good relationship with my sister and she has never said it but I wouldnt be surprised if she blames some of her life situations (still renting, old banger cars, going bankrupt etc) on the fact that she did not have the same opportunities. I along with my husband own our own home, I have an ok job, DH earns treble what I do, newish cars - becuase DH work pay for a car, etc

Private school honestly is not all it is cracked up to be. DS1 is really intelligent and we did say we would consider private school for 6th form but now he is in year 11 we are going to stick with state as his school is good and he has better odds of getting into oxbridge - DH colleagues son went to the local private school and all the parents are moaning that less are getting into oxbridge because more are from state schools. They seem to think private education buys you your preferential uni place!

I do think there's a difference between 'advantage' and an education being 'superior'. The ideal is a mixture of both!

At my friend's DS's private school he rubs shoulders with some MPs kids, some kids whose parents run businesses that are doing very well, some with very academically bright parents and kids whose parents are overseas (it's a day and boarding school).

When he had to get a week or two's work placement for one of his courses, the companies he had offers from via his school friends were amazing! That's rarely available for the average state school kid. That's 'advantage'. For context his parents have very similar jobs and backgrounds to ours so the advantage is coming directly from the school and the contacts he and they are making.

His school's name and those contacts will open the doors for him after university that my DS will have to push hard against to get his foot through the door. That's 'advantage'.

But he still didn't do as well in his GCSE mocks as my state school DS. Would he have done better at state school or worse? I don't know, no one knows. The perception is that, without additional tutoring, his private school education is probably pretty equal to the state school DS attends. So DS is getting the equal or possibly 'superior' education (looking from the outside and mock GCSE results as the only indication) but my friend's DS is getting the 'advantage' because of who he is rubbing shoulders with and the doors they will help him open.

OP are you from the UK originally? In my view, in the UK people mostly view themselves independently not as a family unit. In most non western countries and traditional communities people especially teenagers and children are viewed and view themselves in terms of their family.

So in these families for example, sending the first child or brightest child abroad to the UK or US to study or to an expensive school is for the benefit of the whole family and is usually celebrated and supported by the siblings that don't get to go.
Or even sending one child to school and the other to work as an extreme example.

However in the UK the govt is the parent in a way and people even teenagers are 99% of the time viewed independent of their own family and so view other members or siblings in a way as competitors or temporary house mates and will move out of the house as soon as they can afford it financially.

This system works for big govt, govt that wants control of people's lives (of course they're freely elected reps so it's within the context of a "free country")
So they work, pay high taxes and then the govt determines who needs help most and disbursed that way.

You could be damaging the relationship they have with each other and with you if you don't tread carefully with this.

It would be better to send them both to state schools, instil a habit and love for learning and spend that money giving both your kids opportunities. Get them tutors, music lessons, get them involved in sports and volunteering.
Take them to places where they can learn about the world, history, geography and science.
Travel to places.
Give them chores and responsibilities from a young age.
Talk to them, value their opinions, let them make choices.
You don't need private school to be successful in life.

You're in good company. If a family send one child to private and not the other, it's almost always the boy that gets the money spent on him.

Don't teach those kind of lessons to either of your children 😔

See my post at 09:25

It wasn't my parent's fault that a change had to be made but the outcome of how that change was dealt with, was that we were treated differently. And it caused issues for all of us (regardless of which sector we had been in and for how long).

I think your son might also feel a bit pissed off as an adult when he realises that his sister has been given 100k in lieu of a private education!

Send your son to a state school, and provide both with extra curricular activities and tutors.

Truth is OP that you can’t. Independent school has clubs etc but what it is really about is small (and very well behaved) tuition groups and a lot of individual personalised attention from the teachers. Plus spending your day in a beautiful setting. You can’t just stick her in drama/debating club and decide that’s the same as private school, especially if she’s spending all day in a noisy class of 32 kids 20% of who have SEN.

If you can afford to get her tutors, do.

If you really want to be fair, either (1) send neither of them or (2) work out the cost of private school secondary for your son, mentally allocate that amount to him AND then do the same for your daughter then deduct what you spend on tutors and clubs but recognise you won’t be able to give her the balance of the money until some distant date in the future ie as a house deposit in her twenties.

Also do reflect on whether sexism is playing any part in this. I’m sorry to raise this but I’ve met so many sexist successful men who sent their sons to expensive private schools and their daughters to state schools all for wishy washy excuse reasons but basically because they assumed her career will end when she has babies and thus isn’t worth investing in. (Funnily enough all of those men ended up with very ambitious driven daughters and sons who were into spliff and music 🤣🤷‍♀️)

It's caused resentment over the years in various forms from each of us!

Ethelswith so the state educated siblings resented the privately educated ones and vice versa?

Send neither.

get a tutor to enrich each of them individually if you like - but treat them the same

Mine have done state and private. Regardless we do extra at home. I supplement cgp books, audio books, topic learning etc

I don't think any club / activity can mirror a private / independent school experience. I'm also of the view that private/ independent schools are not just for academic children. Additionally it's the entire set up from class sizes to the curriculum.

From a different angle, fairness aside, the privately educated children I know are far more confident, regardless if their academic achievement, they interact with adults better, have more social skills and better discipline.

That gives them an advantage when it comes to college or job interviews, it’s like a grammar school education with or without the exam results. Personally I don’t believe in extra tuition, better coaching social skills, self discipline and conversation, a child having a conversation with an adult rather than the grunt you often get.

Parents can make a big difference without paying for private.

I think the confidence often is a side effect of wealth rather than schooling alone.
DH has a very rich brother and his little girls were talking to wait staff etc like little grown ups long before starting their private school.

The clubs and extracurriculars have not much to do with the experience of going to private school. Other than all the sports my son didn't do any and my daughter none other than the club she set up herself.
It's the atmosphere and expectation of a certain level of behaviour and academic rigour that makes a difference. Also how they are spoken to and taught to address the teachers, looking them in the eyes, shaking their hands. Having to be school ambassadors during open days. Participating in public speaking. Having to take on responsibilities with younger years. Requirements to do D of E or Cadets. An emphasis on service - my children were required to volunteer on Saturdays if not playing in a match, my daughter helped with autistic children taking music therapy for example. I'm not sure how you could recreate these experiences.

We aren’t very wealthy but my DC go/went to Private school.
we were at an event recently with a few Teens the same ages as them and they were so much more sociable and able to interact with the adults than the other kids there - quite a few people commented on it.
Not sure it’s down to just a Private education but they are very good at holding doors open and general manners because they are constantly pulled up at school if they don’t behave really well.
I am sure dc from State schools can and do behave similarly but in general I think Private school does equip you to go into most social situations pretty well