are we all just wank material?

[piqueen]

I've been speaking to a few different people online in a group for my hobby.
The women are all normal, the men have mostly been normal. (age from 20-50)
I've been speaking to 3 men, very polite. Everything on topic. As soon as the sun goes down, all 3 become rude, sexual innuendos and asking if I'm alone in bed.
Why?!
It is so boring and predictable and now I feel like leaving the group because its so fucking insulting.

This is a group where people can message privately only, and I get mostly messages from men, there are maybe 10x the amount of men on here than women. Now I'm wondering if they all come on just to talk dirty to women.

that was for you. maybe you should shut your boots Trap

I have 3 sons and I'm absolutely terrified that they will be like this.
my Dh isn't that bad but there were a few things I had to overlook when we were first together. He was much less of a creep than other boys but he still put his hand up my skirt on our first kiss. But he was 16 and never tried it again so. 🙄 it's shit its really fucking shit

Yup @piqueen - if a woman is going to be so brazen as to exist anywhere as a woman, it is her own fault when the tiiiiiiiny majority of men who are wrong uns go on to sexually harass, insult, intimidate or generally dehumanise her.

The fact almost any woman - or girl - of any age has experience of this, is not true! No man - or some of the women on here - knows a real life man who behaves like this so it’s clearly either all in our imaginations or it’s other women doing it to sully the good name of men.

Simple really.

And don’t bother asking the defenders of men, turning themselves into human pretzels with excuses, why they aren’t on male forums challenging this behaviour because it just means you hate men.

@Over40Overdating you are so right. We exist and so we must be sexually interested in all men. Of course we are here to be groped.

we need an army of gay men to show heteros their genitalia and see if it it still 'just natural'

The worst part about your post was I used to be a man lover and a girl that's not like all other girls when I was younger. Oh if I could only slap myself in the face now. Every single one of my male friends either came onto me or dropped me for being a slag for daring to date or get into a relationship whilst knowing them. Can't have a male friend and a boy friend. Unless f course "your boyfriend isn't like me, I really love you".
So many films have this line. The less attractive 'friends' love for the super hot girl is some how more true than her better looking boy friend.

Funny how the average men all love the hot girl but the hot girl is shallow for falling for a hot guy because we all know hot girls should settle for average men and average men should aim higher.

Ooh i got maybe 20 messages as a woman in the first few hours and precisely 0 as a man.
I've messaged a few women and men... let's see

I have 3 sons and I'm absolutely terrified that they will be like this.
my Dh isn't that bad but there were a few things I had to overlook when we were first together. He was much less of a creep than other boys but he still put his hand up my skirt on our first kiss. But he was 16 and never tried it again so. 🙄 it's shit its really fucking shit

@piqueen but surely if you stand by AMALT you have to accept that your sons will DEFINITELY be sexual predators? And that your husband, despite the slightly gauch never-to-be repeated attempt at a teenage fumble, is also actually a dangerous sexual predator?

Surely by hoping your sons will turn out to be decent men (which I'm sure they will be/are, by the way) you are in fact accepting that NAMALT??

I wonder how your sons would feel if they read some of the vitriol on this thread? Would you be happy for them to read the hatred that some women on here seem to have for all men?

I've grown up in the world, I know some men are shit. I have a daughter, I worry for her. I also know many amazing men whom I care about deeply.

I don't get the anger over NAMALT. It's just a fact 🤷‍♀️ you clearly agree with me otherwise you would surely have given your sons up for lost?

It only seems to be Men Who Are Like That who are arguing that AMALT. Nobody else is.

If AMALT then why don't you disown every male in your family?

That's for anyone who would seriously argue that.

It’s almost as if men with a proclivity to reproduce are more likely to reproduce. It’s an evolutionary trait. Decent men hide or cover up the urge.

You said the messages were asking are you alone in bed etc. Is this sexual harassment?

It is.

On behalf of ‘females’ we’re very relieved you aren’t inclined to sexually harass us because you aren’t Shakespeare.

Believe it or not there’s a middle ground between being a sex pest and being Shakespeare. It’s called being a decent person who treats women as human beings and not sex objects.

That you seem unaware of that speaks volumes.

Unless I’m imagining things I’m fairly sure that Mark crops up on these types of threads to call so called man haters bots and unhinged. Because he cannot get his man brain around the fact that many women have experienced men in a way that puts them off.
I count myself in this number. There are men in my life who I love, but when their facade slips and the misogyny comes tumbling out (which tends to happen with most men, but it’s usually done in the form of jokes or bants or in a way that can easily be dismissed) I lose respect for them and the society that has set up this system that makes it so invisible and accepted.
Girls and women are conditioned to be the care givers, the mental load carriers (even from a very young age), the acceptors of mediocrity, then when we realise and move away from it we become unhinged apparently. That’s not to say women can’t be bad, of course they can, but when it come to sexual assault, harassment and unsolicited sexual advances they are the outright winners. Women are barely on that playing field.

Calling women man haters for wanting to avoid men and for calling out shitty behaviour is so very male. Like it’s such an insult to them, when at the same time women are dealing with rape, harassment, trying to retain our rights and the immense fallout from all of that.

As Margaret Atwood once wrote “Men are afraid that women will laugh at them. Women are afraid that men will kill them.” And there lies the difference. I don’t much like men but I want to stay away and have as little to do with them as possible. If only men would do the same.

I think men fall into one of four categories.

1. the kind who will harass women
2. the kind who disapproves but will never call it out
3. the kind who will call it out but sees himself as some kind of beloved saviour of women and takes advantage of his position
4. the kind who genuinely wants women to be safe and calls out poor behaviour every time he sees it.

I’ve seen so many I think are category 4 but turn out to be 3. I think 4 is a tiny minority. I believe the majority of men are category 2 - can’t say no to going to a strip club as his mates will laugh at him, listens to his friends telling rape jokes and laughs along, acts like a decent man but cannot follow through to actually call out this behaviour. I also believe that most women are so conditioned to not see this that they will defend them and happily NAMALT until the cows come home or until they reach their limit and see it clearly for themselves.

why do you even have to let the group know what sex you are?

Stop playing games and wasting women's time.

I think there's also an in between of your categories 2 and 4, Tobe.

A man who disapproves and will call it out sometimes/if he feels it's appropriate (e.g. among friends) but most of the time will ignore it.

Or maybe category 4 is just incorrect, I don't think somebody could possibly call it out every single time. If you thought the bloke doing it was violent and nuts then you probably wouldn't challenge him. If it's your boss or your client you're meant to impress then you probably wouldn't challenge him. But if it's your mate or you're watching a comedy gig and the comedian makes a joke about it then you might.

Oh look. We have a live one. Seedy little man thinking he’s playing the ‘gotcha’ card.

Tedious.

Call it out OP Showa the messages on the group. We need to keep showing them that we don’t want this behaviour!

Why would you need to know what room she's in full stop? Why would that be important information?
If I'm texting someone about a group or shared interests, the room they're in or whether they're alone is of no concequence to me, unless of course I have an agenda, other than talking about the shared interests or group.

@TobeLeRone sweetie - you know nothing about the people you opine on. I've lived through more waves of feminism than most of the AMALT brigade have had have failed relationships. That includes meeting and listening to some of the greats tell of their perspectives on feminist issues in person. Even the most radical were far more thoughtful and nuanced in real life than the uncompromisingly hard lines being advanced by some posters on these threads.

Anyone who can't see beyond the first four letters of a username and takes a very broad brush to generalise away every disagreement they face online does come across as rather unhinged. Some basic reading comprehension might also help ... the accounts I suggested might be bots are the ones posing as men asking for nudes and sending dick pics - not the women complaining about those interactions. It is well known that scammers are looking for suggestible people. Nobody really thinks the Nigerian Prince hoping to share his inheritance with a lonely widow on an online dating site is genuinely representative of any real man in real life, do they?

Having got that off my chest ... those four categories seem right to me. And through simple logic we seemingly agree that NAMALT (as Cat 4 implies). If any woman wants to live her life avoiding men because they fear the next man they meet may be like that, I fully support that choice. 100%. But if they then also feel the need to denigrate other women who haven't made the same choice, and if they feel they have the right to slander men they've never encountered, then I will call them out for what they are - deeply unpleasant and prejudiced misanthropes. Withdrawing from an activity that makes you unhappy is good self-care. Working to prevent anyone else from enjoying that activity by going online and deliberately salting the earth is sociopathic, and morally indistinguishable from much of the online conduct of the men in Cat 1.

Direct quote
'are you alone in bed?'
...
'I should join you'
...
'are you shy?'
...
'I am naked'

Also this person earlier told me they were single for a longtime. I should have heeded the red flags.

Its always 'just my culture' or 'I was just trying to be truthful with you, you are very pretty well you have my babies' Arite mate I just wanted to know your view of Heaney now stick your dick back in-between the cushions of your moms sofa and have at it.

Maybe opportunistic is a word for it and of course there would be different levels of that.

One of the very few studies of perpetrators, 90% said they did it for fun and excitement. Those interviewed admitting harassing women ranging from ogling to stalking to rape.