To think many women don’t want their ex involved?

[SpinningFloppa]

My ex doesn’t see our children because he doesn’t want to be involved. No real reason he just doesn’t want to be around. When I mention this to people they will usually fall over themselves to tell me how lucky I am that my ex doesn’t bother, and how they wish theirs wouldn’t bother. I’m not talking about cases of abuse that would be understandable (my ex however was not abusive to our kids) but they always go on to say that they hate “sharing” their kids with their ex and that I’m lucky I don’t have to and get to parent my own way. It’s always about how they feel and never any acknowledgment over how their kids would feel if their father didn’t want to see them.

Yet at the same time dead beat dads who don’t see or bother with their kids are rightly slated but it seems many women prefer the dead beat dad! So is it any wonder many men don’t bother when women make it clear they would prefer it if they weren’t around? 50/50 is apparently bad for children and they feel like they don’t belong anywhere but EOW is then considered not good enough and an uninvolved ex who only wants to do the fun parts of parenting but none of the hard work, so basically a Disney dad. What is the ideal contact set up or would most women just prefer if if their ex disappeared?

(Just to clarify again as I know people will comment on abuse but that’s not what I’m talking about, I’m not mentioning to people that my ex was abusive and now doesn’t see our kids and they are telling me I’m lucky, I’m simply saying he doesn’t see them and get met with “you’re lucky he doesn’t bother with them, I wish my ex didn’t bother!”)

But most fathers love their children and want to be involved.

If the men want to be decent fathers they can do that. They have a choice and often choose to be lousy which in turn makes the women wish they would just disappear.

Believe it or not, it’s not women’s responsibilities to change a man’s behaviour or to make them decent parents. Get out of here with that misogyny.

Seems many would prefer it if they wasn't decent father!

Even the ones trying to be decent and trying to see their kids 50% of the time are just trying to reduce maintenance payments 🙄

I often thought I wanted my ex husband out of it altogether.

But only because he played such stupid games. He had to do the opposite of everything just to play some silly game with me, even when it was detrimental to ds.

He’s still at it now ds is a young adult. For example, we both always said we would hate ds to ride a motorcycle. Ex h uncle had a motorcycle accident which left him in a vegetive state for 20 years until he died. My grandfather lost his leg in a motorcycle accident.

So what did ex do? Encouraged ds to not learn to drive a car, but to ride a bike instead. Really pushed him into it. Said he would pay for a bike. So ds did.

And on the day he passed the test, ex sent me a message saying “when he ends up a vegetable with you wiping his arse for the rest of his life, it will serve you right. Ultimate revenge to see you suffer and have you worry that he will die everyday he’s on that bike.”

(Serve me right for leaving him 15 bloody years ago).

You can imagine all the other examples over the years from that one.

When ds was little and was with him, he would text me to say he’d lost him in shops or in theme parks. Just to make me panic. Then he would say I was unstable for worrying. I soon got wise to it.

He’s fucked up ds in so many ways and honestly, I think it would have been better if he’d had nothing to do with him.

Since OP has felt free to make sweeping generalisations based off a few comments on social media I will do the same.

Look at the number of threads on here where the father has basically abdicated role of active parent and allowed the mother to do all the work. All the heavy lifting.

The role of default parent nearly always gets put in the woman’s camp. Regardless of family set up. I challenge the notion that there are huge swathes of men vying at the courts for full custody of their children. I think that is a myth and a fairy tale.

I don’t doubt that there are instances where the mother is unfairly granted role of primary caregiver when the children may be better off with the father. However that is probably not as common as you would like to make out.

I read a study many years ago that showed that where men apply for full custody they often get it but it’s simply the fact that they don’t often apply for it. That was many many years ago now so statistics could have changed.

Stop trying to pretend that all men are these hard done by brilliant fathers in waiting who are being shunned not only by their exes but by society too.

You seem to be missing @SpinningFloppa that abuse of women by men in relationships is 'normal' and common. Prioritisation of men's wants over children's needs is normal and common.

Parental Alienation only works one way. Yelling expletives and derogatory names at the mother of your DC in front of them is fine (just 'try' not to do it again), expressing that you would rather never see that man again to your own friend is unacceptable.

Men can be as abusive as they like to DC's mothers, be convicted of crimes against them. God forbid anyone in authority ever suspects that there could even be a danger of the father being alienated. That could be very concerning indeed.

The arsehole that make their children's lives a misery and the ones that don't see them at all are the same arseholes, causing different damage to their children.

My dsd is now 19 so this doesn't particularly affect us too much - our relationship is entirely direct now with dsd

However, when she was young, dhs ex was happy to take his money and facilitate contact around her schedule but everything was organised in a way that benefitted her social life and my dh was never "allowed" to be involved in any decisions regarding schools, hobbies, uni or anything else you can imagine.

He was never allowed to come see her dance shows, never allowed to go to parents evenings, he wasn't allowed to be part of her uni applications etc. He wasn't even allowed to take her on holiday unless ex had one booked at the same time with her boyfriend.

YABU. These women are just (rather tastelessly) expressing frustration with their exes. There’s no need to become hostile to other single mums and make their near-useless exes into innocent victims. Did you really think “single mums have it too good- the sympathy should be with the men who Barely make an effort and frustrate their exes into wishing they’d disappear sometimes”?

I get frustrated when people tell me I’m “lucky” my useless ex is involved. I’m not lucky. He is a parent, he SHOULD be involved. The idea that I should thank my lucky stars he makes a 2 minute walk once a week to see his son for a few hours is insulting. Yes, it could be worse, but it could be a fucking great deal better. Would I say I wish he wasn’t involved to a parent who has no involvement with their ex? No. That’s in poor taste. But people make comments in poor taste to me all the time and I don’t feel the need to try and tear down other single parents for it.

The number of threads here is not a surprise as this is a mainly women's website(the clue is in the name). I would encourage you to search for fathers' websites to see both sides of the story. Do you know that you don't have to present any proof to claim domestic violence? For example, when you open a case with the child maintenance service, they will waive the fee if you say that you suffer domestic violence. Guess what, a lot of women will claim domestic violence to avoid paying the fee. 50% of child maintenance cases are opened by women that claim domestic violence. Do you really believe that 50% of men are domestic abusers? If you have two sons, one will be a domestic abuser. Pick one.

The thing is if people tell you that they get quickly shot down and reminded it’s not luck and it’s the “norm” so in that same sense I am not “lucky” my ex isnt involved because that shouldnt be the norm either or something to be desired. My ex SHOULD be involved as well. Just because someone’s ex is shit or abusive doesn’t mean I’m lucky mine doesn’t bother, what a low bar to set, well my ex was abusive so lucky you 🙄

@SpinningFloppa

Actually, in group settings most people agree that I’m “lucky”. They don’t get shot down at all, unless it’s by me. There’s nothing stopping YOU shooting these women down. Someone has always got it worse, and non-resident parents should all be making the best effort they can. Unfortunately we know that doesn’t happen.

I’m not saying it’s fine people make ignorant comments to you, but I am saying becoming hostile to other single mothers is not the answer. Don’t we have enough on our plates without that?

Yeh I do shoot them down but I usually then have others defending them it’s to the point I can’t even post without someone saying it because I can guarantee they will so I’ve started putting at the bottom of the post “please don’t tell me I’m lucky”

I put a post up a few months back just saying how I was sad that my ex has never done a school run, never cooked them dinner, never had them over night, never looked after them when they are sick, never taken them to an appointment etc and again I got “my ex has the kids eow and doesn’t do any of that.” Well you still get eow off! Maybe I should start telling them how lucky they are they get a break eow!

Yeah I’m not gonna lie I’ve been jealous of the EOW people, and I get sad that my ex has never looked after our son for a night or given him a bath- and there’s always someone who suggests I should be grateful that he’s in his life. As if I’m not going to have to explain to my son when he’s older that his dad lives on our street and still can’t be bothered more than once a week for a few hours.

Honestly I think we should all throw the word lucky out of the window. None of us asked to be where we are. We’re all just trying to make the best of it.

Op, I think that while you don't want to admit it, you are constantly suggesting that women mostly don't want the dad's involved. Possibly becuase on specific forums, that's what you see. My advice would be to swap forums. Spend more time over on MN and join the single parent forum here and ask for advice to help your daughter. Because I think a lot of people will agree that no dad is better than a shit dad but of course your DD doesn't know that. So perhaps if you post talking about the specific struggles your DD is having, there will be people with similar experience who can help you navigate it.

Certainly, I expect that my SIL will be where you are in a few years time as her ex spends less and less time with their DC and continues to be erratic and unreliable. Right now, the DC seem to just see this is as normal but I'm sure it's going to be difficult in the future and she'll probably be looking for other people with stories of how they helped their children to navigate this.

There are mothers who do not want to share. I have dated single fathers and been in situations where the men have wanted more contact and been told no and have had to go to court. Sometimes the women are using the kids as weapons and sometimes they use the kids as company as they do not like to be alone. My DD sees her dad most days. We share Xmas day at mine and birthdays. My current DH gets on well with my EDH and we work together as a family to raise DD. This apparently is rare. My mum used us as weapons I struggled never having a dad I don't want the same for my DD. I always advise the dads to keep records of conversations and issues and court papers to show the adult DC the fact they tried when they are older. There are dead beat dads out there (and mums) but the fact women can dictate when kids see their dads without courts getting involved is detrimental to the kids. I think the default should be 50/50 unless there is abuse. If the NRP doesn't want that then they pay maintenance. If the RP refuses to allow access they do not get maintenance as they shouldn't financially benefit when the refusal has no substance. Probably an unpopular opinion though!

Thank you.

Yep seen it with my own eyes yet people refuse to accept it happens. Women that don't like their exes being involved because in their words they don't want to be apart from their kids. They are lonely without them. Yes the father has contact but they view it as them letting their ex see the children. I've seen posts where a woman has met a new partner so they want their ex out of the picture so they can play happy families with the new partner. I think this is more common than people care to admit.

@Qwertyyui It is so wrong that women can say if you want to contact or more contact take me to court. Of course, you can take her to court but it takes years and thousands of pounds. The family court system is a mess and not fit for purpose. You have to wait months between hearings, a barrister costs between 3k and 5k per day, solicitors 250 per hour, you take to take days off work, etc. Of course, you can represent yourself but you are at a disadvantage due to the emotions involved. Who gave women the power to force you to go to court to access your own child? As I said before if they have a son they will find out in the future that he cannot access his child for months or years and they won't be able to access their grandchildren either. Only then they will recognize the problem.

O course there are women who have weird or unacceptable reasons for not wanting the dads involved, but I don't believe that is the norm. In almost every instance I've seen, the woman DOES want the dad involved, but his willingness varies from "over my dead body" to "if and when I feel like it."

And it's not just the ones who are obviously deadbeats. You can spot them a mile away. Apparently nice, normal, helpful, loving dads but who come out with any number of comments said in an on-so-reasonable tone. Things like,
"well, I'd like to see the DC more but I work really long hours and they live far away."
or
"It makes me so sad but my ex would rather the DC do their activities on the weekend than see me so it's impossible for me to see them as much as I'd like."
or
"I can't have the DC on Wednesdays becuase I have football"

And on the surface, fine, except that 9/10 the woman who DOES have the children isn't going to football, hasn't moved 200 miles away, is leaving work early and is facilitating these activities and social events.... but god forbid the man should do any of this.

This...and if they are a dad on nmw/low income he won't get help for accommodation either, it's shared house until he is 35. So, nowhere to take kids, let alone have them stay.
Add in parental alienation, and mothers can ignore court orders too.
I keep seeing that the system is set up for men, but it's not if they are at the bottom of the pile.

Could you support your assertion with statistics, not with generations based on your limited experience? Have you been to family court? Have you waited months and months between hearings? Have you talked to fathers that want access to their children but are blocked by their exes? Your staunch defense of all women without any hard-based facts may come to haunt you one day if you have a son.

This is genuinely one of the saddest things I've ever read on this site. It brought tears to my eyes thinking how you must have felt reading that text about your precious child. I'm so sorry 💐

The older I get, the more I consider that a substantial number of fathers resent their own children, and that this makes their own relationships fall apart. I don't just mean being lazy, I mean they in essence regard them as competition. Someone, somewhere, raises men like these.

This kind of guy is real poison to a happy child because he has not had the kindness and love himself to give it to others.

If kids grow up never seeing a parent then there is a danger that they will mythologise them. By this I mean that, the parent being a blank canvas so to speak, the child might ascribe qualities to them (usually diametrically opposite the qualities of the present parent) that they find sympathetic. If the absent parent is a jerk then this is likely to cause some heartbreak sooner or later.