Childfree people ranting about parents

[the7Vabo]

Came across a thread on another site full of people ranting about children entitled “parents not everything is about you.” I get it to a point, as a parent I think society has become somewhat a overly child-centred. I assume however that the odd stories you see about parents demanding people give up train seats for ten year olds are just that, the odd story of unreasonable behaviour that people in all groups can be guilty of.

The extent of the comments on that thread baffled me. Full of I’m so glad I don’t have children because X, Y. It’s one thing to want to be child free which to me is a perfectly valid life choice, but I’m baffled by the level of bitching about parents & children. If someone wants to be child free why can’t they simply be child free & accept that others didn’t make that choice instead of ranting about how parents are always on at them about how fulfilled they are while at the same time ranting about how terrible it would be to have kids.

Before I had children, I had a woman say to
me that I “didn’t know tiredness” and that stuck with me cause I’d been really fucking unwell and nearly died and it took me months to recover. She absolutely was NOT saying “oh I thought I knew what tired was but since I’ve had kids, I realise I didn’t ” she was directly playing competitive tiredness and acting like a martyr. I make a special effort noT to be a dick and act like having children wins me the most exhausted award.

Why do people like you resort to personal comments? Does that make you feel for a few seconds like you are superior in some way?

I’ve just read some of the comments on the thread you are writing about. The people on there have serious issues and clearly have very sad and insular little lives. I can’t get wound up by it- I just feel sorry for them to be honest.

The worst example I saw of this was when one colleague said to another 'you don't know what tiredness is' to a woman who was nursing her DH through terminal cancer whilst working full time.

She was one of the most stoic women I had ever worked with and that was probably one of the very very few times she ever said anything that referred to her struggles.

The colleague who said it didn't have a small baby herself, so she was well past the night waking years, but despite knowing the woman's husband was dying she still couldn't resist saying it.

Another medical condition then...

Those are threads by parents. I meant I’d never seen a thread opened by a childfree person claiming being a patent is shut.

You’ll have todo better than that.

But what has that got to do with anything? What has your tiredness/experience got to do with the childfree person's tiredness/experience? They haven't experienced the tiredness of being a parent, therefore it's not relevant. So what is the purpose of you saying "you don't know tiredness until you've had a child" other than to invalidate their feelings?

Sorry. Such extreme and unique examples doesn't really help.

Anyone telling anyone who is nursing their dying spouse through their final moments, that "they don't know what tiredness is", on whatever basis, is an utterly bastard and most of us would not be able to think of a single person in real life who would ever make that comment.

That's not representative of the general population, or the day to day interactions under discussion here.

You’re missing the point. When she said that I didn’t know tiredness, she was being an insensitive dick, assuming her own experience was valid.
Why do you happen to think you need to win at being tired?
I parent with a serious life limiting health condition, I cannot begin to tell you the level of physical and emotional strength required to get out of bed, work, be mum and everything else I have to be. So, I have zero time for mums who want to argue their tiredness is special. Life’s too short! When you say “you don’t know tiredness” to someone, you have no idea what the person has been through. It’s insensitive and unkind. Why would you want to risk offending someone?!

Yes but the problem is, all of those times someone has said to a person without children 'you don't know what tiredness is' unless they are extremely close they cannot presume to know whether that person has a medical illness affecting their energy levels. Yet still they say it.

I once had a woman on crutches apologise for having a moan to me about how hard she was finding it to manoeuvre on them, because I have a disability that limits my mobility. I told her not to be so daft, I'm perfectly capable of sympathising with her and I probably understand her frustration better than someone who has never had limited mobility.

If two people are sitting together tired, instead of one invalidating the others tiredness why can't they just sympathise with each other

It's like telling someone in a wheelchair who can occasionally walk they don't know what disability is because they aren't permanently paralysed.

It's a strange attitude to me. That need to compete or invalidate other people's experience. I see it all the time.

"My husband beats me."
"At least you have a husband. Mine died!"

"My toddler is such hard work. I can't cope."
"Try having three!"

"Breastfeeding is so difficult."
"Not as difficult as having to constantly wash and sterilise bottles!"

"I'm so tired."
"You're not as tired as me!"

I don't understand it.

You don't get to tell me what I can and cannot post

I was sharing a story with another poster not replying directly to you

Besides which you have just joined the thread, I've been posting on it from the start and now suddenly you get to pick and choose what I am and am not allowed to say?

Who made you thread queen?

I agree that trying to compete over tiredness is a horrible thing to do. If someone says they are really tired just sympathise.

On a thread about abusive parents
'my mum died last year and I would do anything to see her again, you should treasure your parents'

No matter how badly the poster was abused, someone will always pop up to say that 🙄

Yup. Every time!

That's precisely my point.

They haven't experienced it. But presume someone who has, and, heaven forbid, speaks about it must be trying to invalidate their experience.

Try this.

Person A: "It's boiling today, it's 34 degrees!"
Person B: "I know! In Dubai, it's 70! I was there last week and it's heat like I've never experienced"

And instead of saying:

"Wow. I've never been, I can't even imagine that heat."

Responding:

"Why would you even say that unless you were trying to invalidate how hot I feel?"

Person B isn't trying to invalidate anything or anyone. It's just a comment about the difference in temperature between Dubai and England, by someone who has experienced the heat in both places. It's not a competition.

I agree OP, I find it really embarrassing. The childfree people I know in real life are all happy, stable, normal people who are supportive of parents and would never behave like that. Personally, I don't care if they want to whinge in their own spaces, but I find the ones who come into parenting spaces and go on like that ghoulish and weird and sad.

The OP is talking about a thread that is specifically named "childfree by choice"...

So yeh she is being unreasonable as she's moaning about childfree people talking about their experiences in "their own space"

If you could just point out where I said what you could and couldn't post?

"I was here first and youve only just joined"

Okkkk....

I love how this the one you replied to and not the one where I thoughtfully explained a different view point on how to answer someone whose tired

"I was here first and youve only just joined"

No, I have been posting a lot on this thread and now you have suddenly taken it upon yourself to tell me my contributions are

Not helpful, not representative and not what's under discussion aka what I should and shouldn't post

If that wasn't what you meant then unfortunately it was definitely how your post could be taken

I'm not missing the point. We are at crossed purposes.

Stating "I was more hungry in scenario A than scenario B" does not instantly mean someone is trying to win at being hungry.

Saying to someone in scenario B, who's never been in scenario A, and who is complaining of being hungry, that you felt more hungry under different circumstances, isn't a big competition or stamping all over someone.

When millions of women who've experienced both scenarios, say they were more hungry in scenario A, could it just be possible, that they were more hungry in scenario A.

I find it so odd, that rather than think millions and millions of women saying the same thing, might have some weight behind it, but to think, they only say that to minimise my experience.

Is tattle a parenting space? I thought it was where people when to gossip about social media influencers

Saying to someone in scenario B, who's never been in scenario A, and who is complaining of being hungry, that you felt more hungry under different circumstances, isn't a big competition or stamping all over someone.

If I was hungry and had no food and someone told me they had been more hungry in a different situation so I didn't know what hunger was I would think they were an unhelpful idiot

Besides which, as with sleep, people's bodies react in different ways to both tiredness and hunger. You cannot judge someone else s tiredness or hunger only your own. It doesn't matter that you found two situations had specific results for you, that's you. It will be entirely different for someone else.

No, it's the equivalent of

"I'm so warm today."
"Ha! You can't be as warm as me."

and expecting back

"You're right. I can't imagine being as warm as you are."

It doesn't make sense.

If someone tells you they're tired, they're not asking you to tell them how much more tired you are.

Yes.

But this isn't "just me".

This is millions and millions of women from all walks of life, with different bodies, ages, sleep patterns, diets, saying the same.

Of course each individual will have a different level or threshold. But the collective pattern remains.

What I find tiresome (tiresome! ) is if I do comment on my lived experience, being told that the only possible reason I could have shared that experience is to minimise the experience of another. It is possible just to say things in general conversation without it having to be loaded with smugness and motive.

I think because of the general weird attitude around women who don't have children, which absolutely exists, and is wrong, that childfree women have become accustomed to the idea that anyone speaking as a parent is automatically having a pop. Where in most cases its just another woman making small talk.