AIBU to expect my parents not to shout at my 4yr old?

[TooConflictedConfused]

My DC (4years old) came back from the grandparents today and told me and my OH that they didn’t like going to my mum’s house. The reason being that when ‘they do wrong things their gran shouts at them’. Then we asked what wrong things they did they said they couldn’t remember, they only remembered the shouting and that they did wrong things all the time. And they also said that’s why they don’t miss their gran cause they get shouted at all the time by her.

Occasionally I ask my parents to help with childcare but it’s no more than once a week. My DC was meant to go to my parents again tomorrow but now I’m thinking of keeping them at home and taking a day off from work.

Any advice on how to approach this with my parents? AIBU to expect my parents not to shout?

My DC is only 4 and generally a super well-behaved kid and never has any complaints from school or after school nanny re behaviours.

My dad is a mild mannered person but generally leaves the childcare to my mum. For background my mum is a school of tough love parent and shouted at me a lot whilst I was growing up and also used corporal punishment. I hence was super triggered by the revelation and would love some objective advice on how to deal with the situation.

One day a week is a lot of childcare to do.

Either put up with it (and appreciate the financial saving she is giving you) or stop it and I guess send your daughter to pre-school for a bit longer each week.

There is no way you will be able to change you're mother's behaviour.

You what now?

OP already knows her mother was not a decent loving parent.
She used to use corporal punishment on her.

"For background my mum is a school of tough love parent and shouted at me a lot whilst I was growing up and also used corporal punishment. I hence was super triggered by the revelation and would love some objective advice on how to deal with the situation."
For starters, there's no need to check with your parents about what your son said. He has described behaviour that you know she does. You KNOW. Your son is not exaggerating or misunderstood what was happening, he ACCURATELY described how she treated him.

"Any advice on how to approach this with my parents? AIBU to expect my parents not to shout?"
You are not being unreasonable to expect your parents not to shout at your son, but I do think you are being unrealistic. They will shout at a child, they think their behaviour is fine. Having a word with them about it will not change that.

You're going to have to stop them having him on his own. If you're not there, neither is he. And you're going to have to be straight about why that is. 'No you cannot have my son this afternoon, you've started shouting at him. I remember you doing that to me, and the hitting, and I remember how it made me feel, and I am not going to put my son through that. We will visit, but I will not leave him unattended with you any more.'

"I want my DC to have a relationship with their grandparents that’s why I let them visit there."
Then you need to be present at all times. No solo visits.

Shouting to me means loss of control and inability to cope.
You need to speak to your parents and tell them that if they want the one in one time with your dc, then shouting isn't acceptable. If your dc does decide she wants to go back, then make it for a much shorter time. If she doesn't want to go, then don't force her.

This cracked me up. I’m in the same position as both of you 🤣🤣

As it's not for childcare, but just for visits, can't you organise it so you are free to go with DC while they visit? I think you need to do this given what your child has said combined with your knowledge of your mother's parenting style.

I think the people saying "your mum might be completely different with her DGC, your DC might be lying" are forgetting the fact that the DC has actively stated they don't want to go there.

Children usually love seeing grandparents, aunties/uncles etc because it's a change from the norm, and they are often spoiled with extra TV time and baking and treat meals etc etc. If this is happening with the occasional shouting/telling off, I would hazard a guess the child would still want to go.

The child has, at four, expressed that the shouting is all the time and they don't miss their grandma or want to go back. I'd listen to that, regardless of whether the child is exaggerating over the exact volume of the telling off.

I think YWBU to just instantly assume your DS's account is accurate. If shouting is a trigger point for you and you swing strongly the other way in terms of your own parenting, it's unsurprising a child raised that way would be very sensitive to stern voices. She may not be shouting to an unreasonable extent.

That said, if your DC just doesn't want to go there then you're obviously not unreasonable to come up with a different childcare plan.

@KettrickenSmiled what are we talking about by 'corporal punishment ' though?

My mother used to chase us with a slipper and we certainly got a slap round the legs (not often and it was more of a threat when quite frankly we were being naughty) but she was and is an amazing mother

There's a massive scale to this stuff and some discipline is required. My child was partly deaf when little so I would seem shouty to some but if he was doing something dangerous it needed to be loud.

What did the child do that resulted in him being shouted at as he says? There's nothing in the OP's posts to suggest she's done anything other than take what he said at face value. No follow up asking what happened, what had he done, etc.

Talk to them.

Hey Mom, was there any problems with Bob yesterday, he said he got shouted at for being naughty, what did he do?

Take it from there.

So it triggered you, but you know that your mum is like this so why have you asked them to be childcare? I’d also query what “shouting” meant to your 4 year old. As my 11 and 13 year olds say I shout, I don’t my voice is just more serious and slightly raised to get my point across, but to their ears it’s shouty.

You'd have to ask OP, as only she will know what her mother used to do to her.

Your own mother was out of line.
She wouldn't have chased an adult with a slipper or slapped their legs. Not only is it illegal, but the other adult might have retaliated. But she was happy to hurt children, who couldn't defend themselves.

You call her an amazing mother, but here you are, banging on about some "scale" of physical punishment being required for "discipline". Children don't need to be "disciplined" they need to be TAUGHT, & led by example.

@TooConflictedConfused similar situation. Almost all the time my children spend with my parents is also in my company

I would try having a chat with your mum. Try not to sound judgemental just ask her politely to please not shout at your daughter as that is not the way you are bringing her up.

Surprising how many parents post on here about their awful upbringing at the hands of their parents yet use these same people for free childcare.

Visit grandparents with your child if you don't trust them.

For background my mum is a school of tough love parent and shouted at me a lot whilst I was growing up and also used corporal punishment. I hence was super triggered by the revelation and would love some objective advice on how to deal with the situation.

My parents were similar. My children do not spend time alone with them as I do not trust them not to treat my own children in the same way.

I would suggest you re-evaluate your need for childcare over your child going through the same experience as you did.

Personally with your own experience in the frame I would cease her giving any childcare and stick to social visits only when you can be present as the parent.
There are a thousand things you should do before you reach in the tool box for shouting if you're got halfway decent parenting skills. Everyone has shouted if they've lost their rag, but as an exception it's one thing, if that's your parenting style it's another.

This.

But I would explain exactly why I longer feel comfortable with DM being around DS unsupervised (including DF).

Might not be your style (which is fine) but there is nothing wrong with raising your voice at children who are being naughty and under your care

Sometimes I wonder if people on this site are actually bothered about raising a child with discipline and resilience. They need to learn that actions have consequences. If they don’t like the feeling of being shouted at, then don’t be naughty/disobedient!

They can have a relationship by spending time with grandparents when you're free too.

I would try and find out what happened. Maybe ask if dc behaved badly because they mentioned being told off.

In the mean time I would stop using your mum as childcare because the possibilities are

1. She can't cope/ finds it difficult
2. Dc is naughty for he
3. She is repeating the past and unnecessarily shouty. Possibly has unrealistic views that were used in the past like clearing a plate at mealtime.

All of those point to her being an unsuitable babysitter. Do you spend time with her and dc at the same time ?

Pillow56, do you find shouting at kids ok? You have posted 5 times back to back defending shouter and finding their criticism sad but in this scenario mother of the said child had herself experienced shouting and corporal punishment as a child and says that gran believes in tough love.

You are sad over hypothetical situations but why are you not sad about the fact that child had requested the parents to not send him to gran? Whatever the level of shouting is he feels uncomfortable with there.

Just because another poster's niece lies to get attention, doesnt mean this kid too. Context is more important than what another unrelated child does. This is not a discussion of child psychology.

Once a week childcare is not “occasionally”.

You knew what they were like when you were growing up so should have expected them to treat your son the way they treated you.

Time to find alternate childcare.