AIBU to expect my parents not to shout at my 4yr old?

[TooConflictedConfused]

My DC (4years old) came back from the grandparents today and told me and my OH that they didn’t like going to my mum’s house. The reason being that when ‘they do wrong things their gran shouts at them’. Then we asked what wrong things they did they said they couldn’t remember, they only remembered the shouting and that they did wrong things all the time. And they also said that’s why they don’t miss their gran cause they get shouted at all the time by her.

Occasionally I ask my parents to help with childcare but it’s no more than once a week. My DC was meant to go to my parents again tomorrow but now I’m thinking of keeping them at home and taking a day off from work.

Any advice on how to approach this with my parents? AIBU to expect my parents not to shout?

My DC is only 4 and generally a super well-behaved kid and never has any complaints from school or after school nanny re behaviours.

My dad is a mild mannered person but generally leaves the childcare to my mum. For background my mum is a school of tough love parent and shouted at me a lot whilst I was growing up and also used corporal punishment. I hence was super triggered by the revelation and would love some objective advice on how to deal with the situation.

Shouting was my mother’s go to method of discipline with her own children. Also corporal punishment which was normal back then. She has provided childcare to 9 GC and never shouted at any of them, apart from the odd shriek if someone was about to jump off a roof or something. It is patently ridiculous to suggest that a GP is incapable of adapting their style when caring for GC. Caring for a child for a few hours is nothing like 24/7 responsibility for several kids.

I have watched my otherwise lovely and well behaved 4yo niece make up a complete bald faced lie in order to be cuddled and comforted by her mum and to get someone else in trouble. I’d gently try to get to the bottom of the ‘shouting’ with the aim of maintaining the relationship.

My DS used to say someone 'shouted' at him when he was just upset at being told off. I know this because he used to accuse me of doing it

this exactly. I hear so many kids say this when really it's because they got told off.

If you experienced corporal punishment at her hands and she is getting shouty as she did with you, i wouldn't have them look after the child.
I would tell her why she isnt having the child

and cause a possible family feud?

I have watched my otherwise lovely and well behaved 4yo niece make up a complete bald faced lie in order to be cuddled and comforted by her mum and to get someone else in trouble

yes but you got to remember on mn that kids NEVER lie or manipulate and what they say is the truth. Also parents here all know their child and know their child would never lie to them.

I agree it’s best teasing out whether your child actually is being shouted at. I have one who has always interpreted being told off or hearing something they don’t like as being shouted at even though it’s not the case. They have been like this right through from a young child to adult so guess it will follow them to the grave. They genuinely believe this, are not making it up, seems to be some way their brain is wired and processes.

I don't see the big deal. There are certain scenarios that a warrant a child being told off.
DC is obviously not going to be forthcoming about misbehaving

I agree with this but I stand by the fact that kids and even adults used the word 'shouted' when they are simply being told off or reprimanded over their behaviour and omit their wrongdoing in the story.

I feel sad when I read threads like this on mn as they get so angry at the apparent shouter. And we wonder why we can't get teachers anymore in this country?

Believe your DC

the child is 4, it's probable that the child at that age isn't lying. But at the same time a kid's much more likely that they have perceived a situation wrongly because of their naivety and young age. So grandma may have gently but firmly gave an instruction but child interprets it as shouting.

However having said that, I was a year 1 ta for many years and you'd be amazed at the amount of 5 year olds who tell barefaced lies about what the teacher said and did to parents. I witnessed the lies myself. Children of that age can be very manipulative and deceptive.

Not at all, I trust my parents. If they shout at my DC it will be because he was doing something wrong, most likely dangerous. 4 isn't that young, it's not like shouting at a baby who doesn't know any difference.

I agree with a pp that many grandparents were much more strict and shouty etc. with their own children than they are with their grandchildren - it’s a very different role to have children for a few hours whom you can hand back at the end than to be the parent who has ultimate responsibility.

But you know she has the capacity to shout, and to hit since she used to hit you and shout at you. Have you discussed with her how she looks after DC? Does she know that you don’t consider it a good way to treat a 4 year old? Do you spend much time with them together? Have you seen how she interacts when they irritate her or makes a mistake? Does she still shout at you?

Whether or not she shouted at them today (and it seems likely) there’s the issue of them not wanting to spend time there. If you don’t need the childcare I wouldn’t send them, though having to take time off work at short notice doesn’t sound ideal so you may have to balance the extent to which you jeopardize your financial security over a one off day of non-ideal childcare. Ideally I think you shouldn’t send them on their own again until you’ve discussed it with your DM and your DF and spent time there with DC being a bit hands off to see how she really is.

Hmm I once told off a group of kids (including mine) for misbehaving and one of them ran to her mum (my friend) and accused me of shouting at her. Friend scolded me for it saying “we don’t shout at our children” and it was pretty awkward. Child just didn’t like being told off.

Hmm I once told off a group of kids (including mine) for misbehaving and one of them ran to her mum (my friend) and accused me of shouting at her. Friend scolded me for it saying “we don’t shout at our children” and it was pretty awkward. Child just didn’t like being told off

what was the outcome? How did you handle it? That kid will manipulate mum all the way to adulthood. If she doesn't get her own way at school, she'll say teacher did x,y and z and mum will show up at the school.

But when asked why he couldn’t remember that so OP needs to talk with gran. It might be that history is repeating itself but it could also be that her DC was about to do something dangerous or naughty and gran shouted to get their attention. Plus there’s a raised voice and then there’s shouting.

I was quite taken aback by my friend’s reaction; I had spoken firmly but hadn’t shouted. I can’t remember exactly what I said back to her but we were with a large group and I didn’t want to create more drama by arguing so I just let it go.

None of the other kids (or parents) were remotely bothered, they all just stopped the misbehaviour and carried on playing. Upset child clung to her mother’s skirts and glared at me for the next half hour. It was pretty obvious to all that the issue was with sensitive child rather than me being a shouty harridan.

Friend didn’t send her dc over for play dates for a while, saying they didn’t want to be away from her. Fine. My dc had lots of friends so wasn’t an issue for them.

This was all a few years ago now and we’re all still friends. Her parenting is different from mine in a number of ways and that’s up to her. I’ve always been pretty careful what I say to that child since that incident though. She can be a pain at times but is mostly a perfectly nice child.

Eugh your friend was a dick reprimanding you in front of others. If she'd a problem she could have said it to you 1 on 1. I'd be wary of that child around me to be honest, sounds like a trouble maker and mum sounds like a pratt.

Hmm I wouldn't necessarily assume DCs interpretation is true tbh. My DC told me his dad "screamed in his face" the other day. I'd watched the interaction and it went like this: "child's name" said admittedly loudly to be heard over the telly, then in a totally normal but maybe slightly stern voice, "never run around the lounge with a lollypop in your mouth, if you fall you could choke"
I'm very glad I'd actually witnessed what happened or maybe I'd have believed he really did!

I was wary for some time but it’s water under the bridge now. Her mum has recently admitted to me that she wishes she’d been a bit firmer with her daughter when she was little as she does run rings around her now. There were serious health issues in the family at the time though so life wasn’t entirely normal for them, in her defence.

Her mum has recently admitted to me that she wishes she’d been a bit firmer with her daughter when she was little as she does run rings around her now

yes the daughter wasn't being over sensitive that day, moreso that she was manipulating her mother and it worked.

There were serious health issues in the family at the time though so life wasn’t entirely normal for them, in her defence

still no excuse really though, people always make excuses for everything and the truth is that she was just a shit mother and now her kid is a brat who will grow up entitled. Sorry to be blunt but it's true.

It will be incredibly powerful to your child if you take note that they don't feel cared for or safe there - they can still have a relationship but with you mediating. If this is mainly at grandparents request then its not primarily for him.

If I calmly tell my DS (just turned 5) to stop doing something, he will frequently responds with
STOP SHOUTING AT ME 😭😭

Do a bit of digging by all means but consider the possibility that your child is exaggerating.

Most people seem to be ignoring the fact that the OP's mother thought it was OK to shout at her routinely and use ''corporal punishment'' with her...

None of that is OK.

This is not about an adult who had to shout because the child was doing something dangerous for example and had to be quickly stopped, it sounds instead like someone who believes this type of parenting (shouting and hitting) is acceptable.

I would be concerned that she has not changed and learned that you should not deal with children that way and will do the same thing to your child. I would stop using her as childcare.

Why not just ask dc today if they want to go to gp's.
If they say no then perhaps your dm is shouting.
If dc keen to go then obviously the shouting isn't so bad.

If I calmly tell my DS (just turned 5) to stop doing something, he will frequently responds with
STOP SHOUTING AT ME

if I calmy tell my father the same (age 72) he will do the exact same.

My parents are like this too. It does make me nervous sending the kids to them without us (so it rarely happens). They talk to the kids like they talk to the dog sometimes.

But ‘occasionally’ you ask for childcare - but no more than once a week? Sounds regular to me. Maybe it’s too much for them. My parents definitely dont have the patience for contact that regularly.

You were shouted at and hit as a child. I would say that your dc need another childcare solution. They can see their gm when you are there too. Tell your mother that she’s shouting and you don’t want your dc to go through what you went through. Say that she can see her gc when you are there as well. Let her know that her parenting style was and is unacceptable.

Absolutely!

my Nana was my world & never told me off, let alone touched a hair in my head! But she was very different with my Dad & Aunties.

plus children do say 'shouted' when it's not.