Who's wrong? Parent or Dog owner?

[crashbangg]

My DH went to his friends house and took DS.
His other friend also visited and bought his dog.
The dog kept doing up to my DS who isn't keen on dogs and sometimes quite scared. He wanted to play with the other DC but stayed on the sofa as he was scared of the dog.
DH told the dog owner once, then the dog owner was still letting his dog run around and get up on the sofa so my DH apparently got a bit short with him telling him he needs to sort his dog out. Dog owner then got in a mood and left.

AIBU to think dog owners should keep their dogs away from people/children's especially those who don't like them???

Strongly disagree. In my own case, and that of others whom I know, it is precisely situations where people reacted harshly to our childhood fears, and tried to bully us out of them, which made it difficult for us to get over them. When adults accepted our fears (including dogs in my case), and refrained from being tough with us about them, we got over them much faster.

It's true that if parents' acceptance of a child's fears is due to the parent having the same fears, then the parent may transmit their own fears to the child, But the idea that harshness and refusing to accept ('pander to') a child's fears and vulnerabilities will force them to be 'resilient' is just the modern version of the Victorian idea that allowing a child to be bullied, and exposing them to regular corporal punishment, will 'make a man of them'.

And a dog doesn't have to jump up on people or lick them in order to sniff them. I agree that children should be taught that a dog learns lots of things through smell, and a dog sniffing someone is just like a person looking at them; but that doesn't justify allowing the dog to jump on people.

Thereby increasing their fear- except that a sensible parent would probably have already 'sniffed' your attitude and taken the child home.

I think it was up to the homeowner here. If they were happy with the dog behaving as it was, it was then up to your DH to leave with DS if he couldn't be around the dog.
And no, not a dog owner, but do have two toddlers!

Of course that’s ok. I’ve said right from the start that the dog owner has a responsibility to ensure the dog doesn’t upset anyone!
I’m just taking issue with the fact that some (one) pp seems to be arguing that it’s preferable to be afraid rather than address the fear.

I'm a dog owner and I really love her but if she were scaring a child just by her presence, I would do everything I can to keep them separate. A child shouldn't be uncomfortable somewhere where they are visiting. I know my dog loves children but children don't have to love her and may be scared of animals in general - it's not my task to teach them otherwise but it should be common decency to prefer the child's comfort to a dog on the sofa.

How is it the "householders " problem? 🤨 if it was the kid running up and irritating the dog it would be the parents fault. In this case the dog was terrorising the child, completely the dog owners fault and they need to listen when someone tells them to stop coming up to people. Batshit.

You need to help your DC with their fear not just avoid all dogs. That won't help.

No. Again. That’s not what I said.
I said I think it’s strange that you seem to think it’s preferable to be afraid and uncomfortable than unafraid and comfortable.

In this situation, with an unknown dog repeatedly harassing you, jumping on you, and licking you, it is acceptable to be uncomfortable. Learning to tolerate and endure this treatment is not becoming ‘comfortable.’ Some people (probably most) will never ever want an unknown dog to repeatedly jump and lick them as it is not pleasant. It is best for dog owners to control their pets, not for children to learn to tolerate unpleasant treatment.

You need to help your DC with their fear not just avoid all dogs. That won't help
Helping children with their fears requires the adults to be responsible and proactive by introducing dogs in an appropriate and safe way

It doesn't mean children should put up with being licked and jumped on, and it also doesn't mean parents should leave their children in scary situations (like the OP's situation) where the dog owner hadn't taken reasonable steps.

There’s nothing you’ve said here that I disagree with. Dog owners absolutely should control their pets. I like dogs but I certainly don’t like being jumped on and licked repeatedly by them.
But I also think that children (and adults) who are afraid of unthreatening animals/situations should be helped to overcome their fears, not just avoid them.

Right, well we agree then. In this situation the dog owner was unreasonable and the child was correct to be nervous and frightened while he was being harassed by a strange dog.

As a dog owner myself, l wouldn't have let mine off the lead in a house with a child. Too much potential for accidents to happen, but then again, why take your dog to someone's house? Dogs aren't 'petting shows' or 'accessories' or 'dick extensions' afterall.
Dogs aren't humans either; they have no real desire to sit around listening to their human's chit chat.

I wouldn't mind betting he told his wife he was taking the dog for a walk so he could drop in on a mate insread. Dog owner's fault imo.

No, yet again, that’s not what I said 🤣🤣
This is too silly to continue. I’m off to have a proper conversation with a real person.

Ok, I’ll bite, final time. This is the part you said I agreed with that I don’t:
“the child was correct to be nervous and frightened while he was being harassed by a strange dog.”

There was no need to be frightened. None of the other children were frightened and nor were the adults. There was no threat. It would be better for the child if he were not unnecessarily afraid and helped to overcome his fear rather than avoiding it.
I understand that you disagree with that. And that’s absolutely fine.

He was frightened because the dog was repeatedly jumping, licking him, and harassing him. This is a normal thing to be frightened by. I understand that you disagree and that’s fine too!

Or, here’s a thought.
Stop your dog jumping up and licking small children who don’t want it to and that situation would never arise would it. 🤷🏻‍♀️

There was 1 other child who wasn’t nearby and was significantly older.
What do the other adults have to do with it?
The adults will have been much bigger than the dog. The 4 year old however would very easily be overpowered by a dog jumping up on them. It’s not remotely comparable or relevant that an adult isn’t anxious by the dog jumping up.
Allowing a dog to jump up at a young child’s face and thinking the child needs to put up with it and be fine with it is utterly ridiculous.

I have a dog and love dogs but agree the dog owner was in the wrong here. Dogs aren't guests, and the owner should have been able to ask his dog to lie still without bothering the kids. With my dog, if anyone shows any reaction to her (a very cute friendly border terrier) whether it's positive or negative, she automatically wants to go over to them. I keep her at my feet or on the lead in these situations. It's not fair on the kid OR the dog for the dog to be left to do whatever if someone present is uncomfortable.

The only thing I might have done differently is that your husband could have spent time reassuring your child that the dog is friendly and harmless and just wanted to play (if he didn't already)

Does it matter why anyone is frightened of dogs? Especially a child? Some adults are frightened of spiders etc.
If someone, even an adult is frightened of something, don't you do what you can so they are comfortable? It's just being a nice person?
My friend has a fear or birds, which I think is very weird and I laugh at her (which isn't very nice) but when we go to the park I'll chase any away.

The problem these days is that people take their dogs absolutely everywhere, even over to other peoples dog free houses who do t even want them there, I’m not sure when this trend occurred because as a kid my family always had dogs but we never used to scoop them up and take them to friends houses and parties etc, we went out and they stayed at home, they were not neglected in any way you just didn’t do it back then. For some reason people now think dogs are basically children and you can take them anywhere, it’s very frustrating when you aren’t particularly fond of dogs especially ones who jump up and claw you and skit about

If it was me I would have put my dog on a short lead and tried to distract her away from the children. Although it sounds like maybe this dog was getting quite excited? Are you sure the owner didn’t just leave because the dog was getting overstimulated as opposed to walking out in a mood?

Also I feel as though your friend should have warned you that there was going to be a dog there if this isn’t usually the case.

@Anotheryearsameshitshow it wasn’t the dogs house. Read the post.