Who's wrong? Parent or Dog owner?

[crashbangg]

My DH went to his friends house and took DS.
His other friend also visited and bought his dog.
The dog kept doing up to my DS who isn't keen on dogs and sometimes quite scared. He wanted to play with the other DC but stayed on the sofa as he was scared of the dog.
DH told the dog owner once, then the dog owner was still letting his dog run around and get up on the sofa so my DH apparently got a bit short with him telling him he needs to sort his dog out. Dog owner then got in a mood and left.

AIBU to think dog owners should keep their dogs away from people/children's especially those who don't like them???

No where does the op say the dog was jumping or getting In anyone's face

Here

DS wouldn't have been scared of the dog just generally being there, he was scared when it keeps coming over to go trying to lick him and jump on him

It sat on the sofa beside the child !

Here

DS wouldn't have been scared of the dog just generally being there, he was scared when it keeps coming over to go trying to lick him and jump on him

How is that problem solved? The problem wasn’t OP’s DS’s fear of dogs. She literally said her son would not be afraid of the dog if it wasn’t jumping up on him and licking his face.

My DD was recently around a ‘friendly’ dog, however it was badly trained just like this one and she hated it. The dog kept jumping up in her and a dog on its back legs is often taller than a toddler. It would push her over, lick her face and she hated it.
In the end we had to leave the family event because the dog just could not be controlled around children.

This. Knock it out of them asap. Dogs are not snakes - they are everywhere and the kid will go to many friend’s houses who have pets and can’t whinge and whine.
(Or worse, shriek and frighten/wind up the dog and make it jump).

As a dog owner myself I have to say dog owner was completely in the wrong

@MsMarch yes, that's exactly what I said. But no amount of road safety or teaching an child to be careful around animals will help if a dog owner is not in control, or is unwilling to be.

This dog was being allowed to repeatedly approach a 4 yr old who was scared of it. The child can't do anything to stop it so the owner should. If the car mounts the curb suddenly or speeds round a corner unexpectedly, " look both ways" is not always enough to stop it from hitting your child.

Of course they can ‘whinge and whine.’ If any of my kids said ‘I don’t like visiting Lucy’s house, her annoying dog constantly comes up to me, jumping at me and licking me’ I’d say ‘cool, I’ll tell Lucy’s parents that you can’t do playdates at her house anymore.’

In fact, if I (an adult) had a friend and found visits to their home included being jumped at, licked, and bothered by their irritating and uncontrolled dog, I would refuse to meet at their home.

There’s absolutely no reason to ‘knock it out of them’ AKA force them to accept irritating and annoying treatment so as not to inconvenience dog owners with poorly controlled and untrained animals.

the dog owner for not having their pet under close control as per the law.

and the parent for not taking his chikd out of the situation.

What a vile post - ‘knock it out of them?’ - seriously? Dogs don’t have to be snakes for people to not want to be around them. You have to be thick or seriously lacking in social awareness if you think a dog is more important than a child’s bodily autonomy and welfare.

Dogs home. DH took kid there knowing dog would be there.kid needs to get over his fear or not go there.

The turn of phrase isn’t right but the intention is. Growing up afraid of dogs in a world where so many friends and family will have pets is not ideal

Wow, you said three wrong things one after the other!

But in most cases, if the dog owner is negligent, understanding how to handle dogs WILL help the child. Just like if the driver is negligent, of course I, as a pedestrian, cannot mitigate for that every time. But, if I am paying attention, I am much less likely to be hit by a poor driver than if I just assume everyone is a good driver.

None of these things take ALL the risk away. But they do mitigate SOME of the risk.

@Anotheryearsameshitshow they were not visiting the dog owner’s house

and in the kindest way possible, the dog you posted looks overweight. Does it get enough exercise? Perhaps speak to a vet.

Yes, agree with @GerbilsForever24 . Bad dog owners are unfortunately a reality. But even with good dog owners, people need to know how to handle dogs or to be around them.

I sometimes tie my dog up completely off the path near school. I am close by and keep a close eye on her but she doesn't like being approached by strangers when she's tied up. Which is why I tie her up basically in the trees that are to the side of the school - not on the path in ANY way and a good way from the path whereby to get to her, the children have to tramp through a bit of a wild area. I'm always surprised at how many parents let their children approach her. I'm always close by and intervene immediately, but a basic premise of being around dogs surely is not to approach a dog that has clearly been restrained in an out of the way place?

But in most cases, if the dog owner is negligent, understanding how to handle dogs WILL help the child.

You realise the child is 4? 4.
I would not expect a 4 year old to start 'understanding how to handle' a dog that is almost at face height with them, and therefore pretty bloody scary I imagine, purely because its owner can't be bothered to stop it jumping up the child.

This situation was NOT down to the little tot to handle ffs, it was down to the adult in charge of the dog to handle and as they were not doing so, down to the childs father (which the childs father DID then have to handle, by calling out the dog owner on his dogs shitty behaviour).

@GerbilsForever24 @MsMarch I don't know if you just aren't reading my posts or are willfully misunderstanding - I fully agree that children need to be taught how to behave around animals to and as I said, have done so with my DD. But it didn't help when a large off lead dog pelted towards her in the park when she was 2 and knocked her off her feet, onto hard paving. She could have been seriously injured.

Yes, children can and should be taught how to behave around animals. But ultimately there is only so much a child can do. In this case, the dog owner should have taken action to prevent their dog from approaching a small child.

I don't expect the 4 year old to be fully responsible, but I started teaching my children about road safety from when they were in prams, "ooh, let's stop here and wait for the cars shall we?" Ditto, from very young we constantly reinforce things like being careful around hot things or not running when it's slippery. We still watch them and help them, but we start the learning process young. For me, it's the same with dogs.

Any family who ever looks like they want to engage with my dog, I ALWAYS stop. Because she is very gentle, never jumps and often just wanders away - she's a good opportunity for parents to model how to act with a dog in a safe environment. 9/10 it's the parents of toddlers who clearly want to stop and get their child used to a dog. I think that's very sensible.

@CosyKnits I actually don't disagree with you as i said from the start. But I DO also agree with other posters that the OP's Dh could have used it as an opportunity to try and get their child used to dogs and to learn how to be around them. This dog was NOT aggressive. It was over friendly and annoying. And learning how to handle those sorts of dogs is an important skill.

“Yes, children can and should be taught how to behave around animals. But ultimately there is only so much a child can do. In this case, the dog owner should have taken action to prevent their dog from approaching a small child.”

Exactly! Putting the emphasis on the child takes all the responsibility away from dog owners who don’t need any encouragement to shirk that particular accountability for what they see as their dog’s God given right to do, shit, jump up, slobber and and interfere with whatever it wants.

And also - avoiding a dog that is uncontrolled and jumping up trying to lick/bother you is exactly what I’d teach my kids. They aren’t Cesar Millan, they don’t need to be training other people’s unruly dog. If my very small child was being repeatedly harassed by an uncontrolled dog I’d teach them exactly what this child did - make your discomfort known and stay safely by an adult.

@GerbilsForever24 the child was already scared though and the OP has said that this dog was jumping and licking. For a child already nervous of dogs, that sort of " friendly" is just scary.

Slow, gentle work with a calm dog, absolutely beneficial and important. But not in the scenario described in the OP, a 4 yr old would just learn that their parent couldn't be trusted to keep them safe or listen to their fears (not true but perception is everything to young children, they don't have enough experience to put it into context and understand the aim of the parent).

Tbh parents like your husband do my head in about dogs! You need to teach your child how to behave appropriately around them. Allowing them to develop a fear and validating doesn't do you child any good. Teaching them to be calm and how to appropriately behave around dogs is really important especially now there are so many dogs about.
Of course the dog should be under control but it doesn't sound like it wasn't. Or was doing anything particularly wrong. Lots of people allow dogs on the sofa and there is nothing wrong in that.
Your DH should have left if he wasn't comfortable or was incapable of teaching his child how to behave!

But the dog wasn’t going to harm the kid. So I just don’t understand why you wouldn’t want to help the kid understand that. So weird, it’s like you think the fear and discomfort is a good thing.
Not everyone has to like dogs but it’s not ideal to be fearful of a harmless pet. It’s helpful to teach children to be cautious around unknown animals but unhelpful to not address an unfounded fear.

Being uncomfortable with having a strange dog jump up at you and try to lick you isn’t a bad thing. It is entirely acceptable and not at all weird to want to avoid strange dogs jumping up at you and licking you. That’s what I’d be helping my kids understand. Why do you struggle to comprehend that regardless of fear no person should tolerate unwanted harassment from dogs?