Who's wrong? Parent or Dog owner?

[crashbangg]

My DH went to his friends house and took DS.
His other friend also visited and bought his dog.
The dog kept doing up to my DS who isn't keen on dogs and sometimes quite scared. He wanted to play with the other DC but stayed on the sofa as he was scared of the dog.
DH told the dog owner once, then the dog owner was still letting his dog run around and get up on the sofa so my DH apparently got a bit short with him telling him he needs to sort his dog out. Dog owner then got in a mood and left.

AIBU to think dog owners should keep their dogs away from people/children's especially those who don't like them???

It wasn't the dog's home. The dog belonged to another visitor.

The child needed to accept the actual presence of the dog, or he and his dad needed to leave.

But the dog wasn't just present; it apparently kept trying to jump up on the child and lick him. The dog owner should have prevented it from doing so, once it was clear that its approaches were not welcome.

Your child had no reason to fear the dog... just because the child is fearful isnt the dogs fault, nor the owner. Your DH sounds a bit precious, as do you. It would have been sensible to ask the dog owner to shut the dog out, or arrange the child play in another room,or explain child was fearful and then facilitate gentle meeting of the dog to lessen the fear... either way, non event and a lot of to do about nothing.. It's a dog it will dog, your child is a child it will child... youd be better off teaching your child that most dogs are ok rather than exoecting every dog in creation to ignore your kid...

The only thing I’m struggling to comprehend is why you seem to prefer to be uncomfortable with a non threatening dog than comfortable! Very strange.

I should add that even in the case of people who aren't specifically afraid of dogs, a jumpy dog could knock a toddler or elderly or disabled person over, or trip them up, and for that reason alone owners should discourage this sort of behaviour.

It wouldn't in general be considered as good parenting to allow children to jump all over guests who don't welcome it! The same goes for dogs.

A dog that repeatedly jumps on and licks people who do not want that is not something anyone needs to be comfortable with.

Why is it you struggle with that? Why do you think preschoolers must tolerate and be taught to accept strange dogs repeatedly jumping on and licking them, even if they really dislike it?

Like I’ve honestly never been considered ‘very strange’ for such a world view as ‘strange dogs shouldn’t jump on and lick little children. It is acceptable for children to dislike strange animals jumping at them or licking them.’

@justgettingthroughtheday This is actually laughable.

Tbh parents like your husband do my head in about dogs!
Yes, why on earth would a parent want to protect his little child from a over excited dog that was scaring them!

You need to teach your child how to behave appropriately around them.
Absolutely, sole blame here lies with the 4 year old who should have behaved appropriately and avoided the dog.... oh wait....

Allowing them to develop a fear and validating doesn't do you child any good. Teaching them to be calm and how to appropriately behave around dogs is really important especially now there are so many dogs about.
Yes yes, again, sole responsibility lies with the little 4 year old. They should have behaved appropriately......and by the age of 4, why haven't you taught them this vital social skill OP! oh wait...... they sat by their dad and avoided the dog as best they could. Absolutely though not the owners responsibly to ensure their dog behaves responsibly around small children, heaven forbid.

Of course the dog should be under control but it doesn't sound like it wasn't.
Unwanted jumping up and licking?

Or was doing anything particularly wrong.
Unwanted jumping up and licking?

Your DH should have left if he wasn't comfortable or was incapable of teaching his child how to behave!
What part exactly of the childs behaviour was unacceptable to you? The fact they were scared of the dog? Or the fact they didn't want to engage with the dog? Or the fact they sat quietly by their dad to avoid the dog?

The dogs behaviour on the other hand, was not acceptable and the dog owner should be teaching it how to behave!

And quite frankly, OPs ds did the right thing. Had it been my little nephew, he may well have attempted to morph into a power ranger and karate chop the bloody thing and that could well have been a whole other ending couldn't it! Although I'm sure in your eyes, the 4 year old would of still been to blame.

Bullshit! The DH has reinforced the child's fear by making a big deal out of it!
Dogs come up and sniff people - that's how they find out about the world. The child should have been taught how to handle that and the father shown there was nothing to fear.

There is a reason we have a generation of kids with poor mental health and irrational fears and demands. Because parents bloody pander to them!!! They have zero resilience!

Oh and if your nephew had tried any of that shit around my dogs they would have been asked to leave and given a huge telling off!

If I was the father of a child who's scared of dogs, I would have taken the opportunity to encourage scared child to interact a little with the dog? Kids only get over their fears by facing them.

As this board has shown some dog owners really don't get it. Some people really don't like bloody dogs and that's up to them. I wouldn't let my child jump around annoying others, don't let your dog jump around annoying others.

Definitely the dogowner at fault there. I have a dog who is (due to past experiences) scared of children. If she and I were sitting on a sofa and, despite warnings, someone let their child approach my dog or get up next to her, I would be very angry and the child would be snapped at by my terrified dog. So, I have every sympathy with your DH and DS, OP. The dog owner was wrong. And before any doghaters criticise me, I would not take mine to a house with children in the first place and I always keep her well away from children when we are out (also she would not be allowed on other people's furniture!).

DH was sat on the sofa next to my DC not having a jolly somewhere else with his mates
So his child is scared and instead of removing your child from a scary situation, he sits there and keeps your child in the situation. Strange thing to do if your child is scared.

he was scared when it keeps coming over to go trying to lick him and jump on him. So it's the 'fear' is proportionate I think, doesn't need to be dealt with.
I don't fancy a dog jumping all over me either and I'd expect it to be stopped.
I'd also expect it to be stopped by the owner.
But I'd also consider it fairly irresponsible parenting to have a child scared of a dog and for the parent to keep the child in a situation they find scary, being licked and jumped on. What a way to make a child even more nervous around dogs.

As a dog owner and parent I'm responsible for my dogs and my child. I'm not responsible for other dog owners and their dogs. If my child was scared of dogs, the last thing I'd be doing is keeping them in a situation that they're likely to find upsetting because that would be shitty parenting.

I'll happily change my stance following OPs updates about the dog jumping and licking.

I adore dogs but it gets very tiresome being constantly targeted for affection.

Dog owner in the wrong

Funny that

I think the dog owner should have made more effort. I have a friendly dog and three kids - if any of them have a friend over who is nervous of dogs, I will keep the dog away from that child and offer reassurance.

BUT - I do think that we live in the UK, lots of people have dogs, and parents should help their kids overcome those fears (within the realms of dog safety etc). Also for the posters who are saying 'well the dog must just sit on a matt and ignore everyone there' - yes of course it's important to have a well-trained dog BUT, like kids, dogs can be unpredictable, particularly if they are in new or exciting situations. My dog is very obedient 90 percent of the time, but she's not a robot, and sometimes dogs will behave like dogs - ie lick people or bark or whatever. Not ideal I know, but unfortunately animals and children don't always behave EXACTLY as we want them to 😂

Dog owner was in the wrong.

It doesn't get tiresome - it's the best I don't particularly like people though

Thats not even vaguely what I said 🤣

Any responsible dog owner wouldn't let there dog mix with a strange child

So to me the dog owner is a idiot.

Why do you struggle to comprehend that regardless of fear no person should tolerate unwanted harassment from dogs?

Because that OP has a dog that jumps on people probably.

OP, a 4 yr old would just learn that their parent couldn't be trusted to keep them safe or listen to their fears

Exactly this. In the throes of fear you can't learn anything. And according to OP the child would have been ok if the dog hadn't been jumping on and licking him.

It’s exactly what you’ve said. You think I’m ‘weird’ and ‘very strange’ because I think it is normal and acceptable for a child to feel uncomfortable in this situation - you feel the child should be forced to tolerate it to ‘teach them’ about how to behave around dogs.

Not everyone has to like dogs but it’s not ideal to be fearful of a harmless pet

Is it ok to not want them jumping on or licking you? Because it appears that was the problem in this scenario. All that was needed was for the owner to keep his dog off the child.