To have asked them to find their own place to live?

I’m not disagreeing with you, or with the advice you’ve been given here, but one of the things that’s jumping out from your posts is that your decisions so far have been reactive.

First you invited them in because you had too much space/you were lonely; then you’re asking them to leave because it’s overcrowded. So I can understand (to an extent) your ds’ rational that the problem is his extra sibling. He’s not correct, but he might be partially right in intuiting that if your other ds hadn’t come home you might have reacted differently.

Dc, and particularly youngest ones are bloody expert psychologists when it comes to ferreting out the weak points in their dp’s thinking.

I think you need to figure out what’s important to you and then the decisions you take will be much more certain.

Write down everything that could be important, and that is important, and after a while come back to the list and you’ll see the 1 or 2 things that are most important to you.

It’s their choice to have this baby. If they are going to have it then your DS needs to forget about uni for now, stop dicking around and get a job to support them all.

definitely not unreasonable to ask them to leave especially since he’s now eyeing up other rooms in your house for them to use instead of getting his act together

YANBU!
I’d want to have a vote in their family planning if they’re planning to extend their family in my house!

Also, if they’re stealthily taking over your house by saying you’re selfish (which is rude), when do you get to invite friends over including make friends - unless that’s been benched on your behalf!

What? Where? I’m stuck in private rented and would love this.

@lapasion because they are living in overcrowded conditions, you can’t count the others sons bedroom so it’s 3 going to be 4 in one room plus shared kitchen and bathroom, also they can say OP needs them out, so they would be a high priority on the housing list. Unfortunately being stuck in private rented doesn’t make you a priority :( obviously depends on the area how quickly they would get somewhere but when this was my situation I got somewhere in a few months.

What a silly pair. They are currently unable to house themselves or the 5 year old that the GF already has. They both sound utterly immature - although there is some excuse for your barely-out-of-his-teens son. Little excuse for an adult woman who already has a 5 yo child and is relying on others to put a roof over their heads.

They need to move out. And behave like grown ups if they actually want to be parents.

I thought that - I don't thinkMarigoldMoonStone was speaking from recent experience!

Even 20 years ago I remember 16,17 and 18 year old girls at the school where I worked half seriously claiming that they were going to get pregnant "to get a flat" and having to be convinced of the reality of the situation (and every couple of years one actually being pregnant and not having a snowball in hell's chance of getting accommodation and remaining in the overcrowded family homes sharing their childhood bedroom with the baby, or once moving to a mother and baby foster placement).

Could they apply for social housing as overcrowded

My experience was 18 months ago, it’s most certainly worth a try - it totally depends on the area.

Years ago it used to be the case that if the OP evicts then then the local authority will place them in temporary accommodation (B&B accommodation perhaps). I don’t know if this is still the procedure.

Whether you feel two parents and two children sleeping in one room is overcrowding or not IS cultural.
That a lot of UK (bed)rooms are too small to put four beds in is another issue.

I got a flat in Glasgow 3 years ago and a flat in Devon 18 months ago so it is totally possible. You are not expected to share a bedroom with your baby and while it doesn’t make you the highest priority it does still give you a chance of getting somewhere. They need to register asap because the longer you are on it also increases your chance of getting somewhere. Different areas have different criteria.

Social housing is difficult to get. As another poster said it depends on the area. They may be housed in temporary accommodation which is usually grim.
Op may find that her son punishes her by going no contact.
It is a really difficult situation to be in Op. However, this is a situation where the notion of ‘tough love’ comes into play.
He is basically a father of two and has to sort himself out. He needs to study part time and work. It will take him slightly longer to complete his degree but he will only be about twenty five when he completes his degree
It will not be easy but he made his own bed..,,

The gf needs to get her own place with her kid. Universal credit would then cover most of her rent and give her a bit extra to live on if she is working part time. He should (technically) stay at yours, get a part time job working 30 odd hours a week, you give him a pass on the rent and bills and he saves like fuck for the next 6 months. This could give a nest egg of at least a few thousand. That way you are helping and supporting them working toward independence. I wouldn't have them in the house but equally it's not a good time to cut them off they will need support

Depending on the degree it might make a lot more financial sense to drop out now and work full +over time. I teach Higher education and most degrees do not increase your earning potential these days

Why do people keep saying the gf is 5 years older? OP has said she is 'slightly' older and has a 5 year old. She could be 21, 22, 23...
OP I think tough love, they need to move out. It sounds like the gf is very vulnerable but also much more sensible than DS. She's had a child in her teens, presumably in the abusive relationship, managed to get out and is working part time around looking after this 5 year old and seems to have no support from her own family. Given DS doesnt work, she must be the one who is making the financial contributions to the household that you mentioned?

She is clearly vulnerable and young herself and will need your help with the practical things but sounds far more open to it than your son. Sit down with her, talk through how you and she both know this is not a good set up for the children and they need their own home. Think beforehand about what help you can offer (ie help with baby costs e.g. pram so she can save for household, babysitting 2x a week etc). Make clear you arent cutting them out.
Then work through the options together, realistically:

• uni accommodation, with DS still studying. Think about budgets and availability.
• council; what's availability like in your area? Could they cope with DS studying or would he need to work? or half and half? Do you need to write a letter of eviction to get them on the list?
• private rented. Are there deposit schemes? DS will certainly need to work. What is her maternity pay like? Etc.

Great ideas

Your DS is still young at 20 and probably feels intimidated by the idea of living in his own place with all the adult responsibilities that go with keeping a roof over the head of them both and two children. Who wouldn’t be sympathetic, but he has grown up responsibilities that he needs to face. What your other son does is irrelevant, it is your home and your wishes that matter. I can envisage a scenario where if they stay, you may be pressured into providing free childcare and sidelining your own needs once the baby arrives. You must establish firm boundaries now.

Tell them that they must move out before the baby is born. You can be supportive with helping them by providing information and advice, building their confidence that they can manage ok as a couple.

Your DS and partner need to budget for different scenarios (that don’t include continuing to stay with you!) to work out what they can afford. Tell DS that he possibly needs to defer university to get a full time job, but that they need to check how much they would have to live on in each scenario, factoring in expenses such as housing, childcare, commuting and utilities. Tell them about the Entitled to calculator, or how to contact local citizens advice if they are struggling to pull the figures together. Good luck, and if you need any info to help you support them, let us know and the Mumsnet hivemind can probably help.

If he is at uni so doesn't have any income, doesnt seem like they were in a position to have a baby. Not a good choice, have they thought this through?

This.

You’ve been hugely supportive for a year. It’s a slap in the face that your son has called you selfish for not accommodating their reproductive choices. They’ve clearly given zero thought to supporting a family before they created one. if you let them stay it will be many more years before anything changes.

@Mamansparkles also made a good post, plenty of positive suggestions. You want to be treading that line where you are supportively launching them into independence but not burning bridges. A new grandchild is a lovely thing and I imagine you will want to be an involved granny on your terms of course.

What a mess.

Of course you should ask them to leave.

Your son is both selfish andentitled.

He does not get to take over YOUR home and make his brother feel uncomfortable.

He needs to move out asap.

OP, you ANBU and your son is being childish and selfish. They made a decision to have a baby, while he is at Uni and not working.

If he spends all his time on the xbox at age age of 20, he clearly hasn't grown up yet. Unfortunately there are a generation of boys growing up like this, not wanting to give up their gaming and deal with real life and work and families.

You need to spell it out that you will not be kicking DS1 out, and that there is not enough room for DS, his GF and 2 children in your house. Help them to find somewhere if necessary, look into benefits , uni accommodation etc.

or, you could have a chat with them both and explain that if you evict her she will be a priority on any housing list. Then once she has been given somewhere, DS can move in with her. They may only be given a 2 bed but they will have to suck it up until the DC are older if they can't afford anything else.

If you can afford it you could lend them the deposit. You can be registered as the interested party so that the deposit is returned to you, but obviously you might lose some if there were any damages or unpaid rent.

He will never grow up until he has to stand on his own two feet. With a baby on the way he needs to find some work around Uni, or even give up Uni if he isn't that serious about it.

He needs to take responsibility for his own actions.

His GF sounds like a decent person but again has made a bad decision to have a 2nd baby while not even in their own house.

YANBU at all, OP, but your DS2 is irresponsible to father a child he can neither support or house, plus entitled and manipulative in the way he's addressed this.
I don't think many parents would have their son's girlfriend and her 5 year old move in and live rent-free, and l think you have been very kind and accommodating.

I would put my foot down and explain that your house is too small for 4 adults, a child and a baby, even if one of the adults is only there in the holidays. It is still your DS1's home. They are already overcrowded by having a child sleep in their room.

They need to move out and I think it would be more than reasonable for you to insist on this. I think you should write them a letter giving them a reasonable amount of notice, eg 2 months. You might also want to lend them the upfront costs of getting a private tenancy, and explain that if the rent is high they will be entitled to some help with that from Universal Credit, depending on GF's income, plus his maintenance loan which will be treated as income by UC.

They could also approach the council, as they will be in priority need when homeless and the council has a statutory duty to help them. It varies a lot, but many councils in the SE now lease private rental properties accommodate homeless. They may have to spend a short while in a B&B or temporary accommodation, but a family with 2 children (or 1 plus another on the way) would be a high priority.

And you can help him work out how much financial help they would get by using entitledto.co.uk and putting in different rental figures.

But YANBU imo, not at all.