Page 39 | To want to cease friends with many of my friends that have children

daysayso · 2022-07-12T07:47:38+00:00

NC for this, I am really struggling to maintain friendships with most of my mom friends. I think as much as having children becomes consuming it's not entirely fair to think you can treat people like crap or not bother with them on the basis you now have children and expect them to still just take it. I am being a bit harsh when I say I want to stop friendships and perhaps unrealistic but certainly stop bothering as much if at all. I am just burned out, exhausted by it. And I'm sure may posters will say oh it is what happens when you have kids - but equally I have a life too and when it's becoming unenjoyable I don't want to bother anymore There's a line and I think I'm being pushed past it far too often - this has been happening now for years and I have just had enough

Hrpuffnstuff1 · 13/07/2022 11:16

Katypp · 13/07/2022 11:06

Somewhere in the last 20-30 years (?), having children moved from becoming something most people just did and got on with to something altogether different.
As parenting has evolved along with social media, it has become competitive, with women outdoing each other on who's the best mother.
I also think long maternity leaves add to the mix, with modern parenting practises positively discouraging good sleep patterns and routine. You just have to look at the sleep board to see that - anyone daring to suggest any type of routine is torn to pieces and it's baby-led all the way on there.
I only had six weeks off with my first and back then, getting your baby to sleep through was the main goal. I am sure there were some poor sleepers then as well as now, but we have had people on this thread stating quite nonchalantly that their baby didn't sleep for two years. That's ridiculous.
Having a non-sleeping baby seems to be a badge of honour now, in the way that having a sleeping one used to be. It seems to me that women are, actively encouraged to martyr themselves completely to their children - from birth, it's all about following 'cues', baby-led this, no routine - it would drive me mad. And then there's the women who don't want to share their baby with anyone, even the father. And that's OK too apparently, on MN at least, as becoming a mother seems to bestow queen bee status, when everyone is running around trying to keep her happy and being glad of the crumbs thrown to them.
In all honesty, although I am always told I am wrong, it all sounds very lonely to me and I am not sure it's good progress.
I am always told how much better it is for the child not be be 'ignored' (because there's no middle ground between 100% attention 24/7 and being ignored, apparently) but I am convinced the mothers get a, much worse deal than they used to.
A few have said on here that parents going out used to be the norm. It definitely did. My parents and my friends' parents, all went out, individually and together, and children were left with the other parent or grandparents.
In a nutshell, I suppose what I am trying to say is that babies and children used to fit into the family, rather than the family fitting in with them

My parents always socialized together with other families. I do remember my dad briefly having a single friend come round but he drifted away.
Although my dad socialized more than my mum, he had lots of hobbies. I used to be with my dad all the time during these hobby periods, football, martial arts, and metal detecting. I was like his little shadow. My mum socialized mainly with her family.
Neither of them came home boozed up, ever, I don't ever remember a time when my parents were absent.

antelopevalley · 13/07/2022 11:20

855fg678 · 13/07/2022 10:40

In answer to the question of when did mums stop going to the bingo, probably around the same time they started working 40hr weeks and commuting. I only see my kids on the weekend and very briefly during the week. I only go out with DH once every four months and usually for lunch during the day when we WFH.

Not true. Working-class women worked. Often working physical jobs such as a cleaner or in factories. They just did not have weekend family time or have an issue leaving their children with their dad.

elenacampana · 13/07/2022 11:21

Katypp · 13/07/2022 11:06

Somewhere in the last 20-30 years (?), having children moved from becoming something most people just did and got on with to something altogether different.
As parenting has evolved along with social media, it has become competitive, with women outdoing each other on who's the best mother.
I also think long maternity leaves add to the mix, with modern parenting practises positively discouraging good sleep patterns and routine. You just have to look at the sleep board to see that - anyone daring to suggest any type of routine is torn to pieces and it's baby-led all the way on there.
I only had six weeks off with my first and back then, getting your baby to sleep through was the main goal. I am sure there were some poor sleepers then as well as now, but we have had people on this thread stating quite nonchalantly that their baby didn't sleep for two years. That's ridiculous.
Having a non-sleeping baby seems to be a badge of honour now, in the way that having a sleeping one used to be. It seems to me that women are, actively encouraged to martyr themselves completely to their children - from birth, it's all about following 'cues', baby-led this, no routine - it would drive me mad. And then there's the women who don't want to share their baby with anyone, even the father. And that's OK too apparently, on MN at least, as becoming a mother seems to bestow queen bee status, when everyone is running around trying to keep her happy and being glad of the crumbs thrown to them.
In all honesty, although I am always told I am wrong, it all sounds very lonely to me and I am not sure it's good progress.
I am always told how much better it is for the child not be be 'ignored' (because there's no middle ground between 100% attention 24/7 and being ignored, apparently) but I am convinced the mothers get a, much worse deal than they used to.
A few have said on here that parents going out used to be the norm. It definitely did. My parents and my friends' parents, all went out, individually and together, and children were left with the other parent or grandparents.
In a nutshell, I suppose what I am trying to say is that babies and children used to fit into the family, rather than the family fitting in with them

@Katypp

💯%, you’re speaking my language. I have an eight month old, she fits in with us, we ignore everything ‘baby led’ and have a very happy baby. She eats everything we give her, she sleeps from 6:30/7pm to 7am, naps in her cot upstairs for a couple of hours at a time and because we have a routine, either of us can look after her allowing the other one to go out at any time of day, evening or weekend. When GPs have her, they also do our routine and she’s very happy with them too. We keep it simple and we have a good life with her, a relationship of our own and see our friends often with and without her. It’s just not that hard. I would say that we’re the odd ones out amongst our friends - it’s all co sleeping, baby led, can’t leave child for 30 seconds to go for a wee. I complain about my life so much less than they do.

stayathomer · 13/07/2022 11:23

LuckySantangelo35

but kids are sick loads would you really let your mates down if it had been planned for weeks and weeks to stay home for your kid when they have their dad their with him
id be well pissed off with you if I was your mate
Theres levels though- they’re sneezing or coughing a bit I’d go meet you, but they’re miserable, lethargic and in bits or vomiting and diarrhoea I’d ask could we do it again or I’d drive down to you another day or something. (Sounds like we’re making plans;))

Nancydrawn · 13/07/2022 11:24

deedledeedledum · 13/07/2022 08:47

The one coming across as entitled here is YOU OP. You seem to struggle with the fact that you just aren't very important to your old friends anymore. You have gone way down their priority list as you should but you struggle to accept this. Your old friends are making it clear, they do not want to spend their valuable and limited free time with you. You are much less important to them than they appear to be to you. Perhaps one day if you chose to have a family you will understand. You go in the offensive and call them entitled and say you will cut them out. Good. That's probs for the best. You are way way too much hard work for adults to be friends with. You can't get angry because your friendship has run its course or changed. The fact that you are angry is because you are so entitled

Good God, how do you see through such a fog of smugness?

antelopevalley · 13/07/2022 11:24

2muchtimeonline · 13/07/2022 10:49

I have two teenagers. The early years were hard with v limited family support but I did make an effort to keep in touch with friends. But nights out were limited and days out without kids almost impossible. I think a big part is two parents working … yes our mums had choir / walks with friends etc but they were probably at home with us all day! When you have kids in childcare you need to see them weekend days. BUT now life is changing very quickly and they are about to go their own ways and I’m back out again. So OP if you can keep the lines of communication open (while developing other hobbies etc) your 40s and 50s could be a social whirl !

Nobody waits around for years for friends to be available. OP will develop her new friendship group and her 30's, 40's and 50's will be a social whirl.
It has also been made clear to OP that her friends do not value her. She is only there when her friends have lots of free time. So maybe OP wants to find friends who do not just see her as an afterthought?
And her friends with children will just have to make their own new friends when they decide they have some time.

Lottapianos · 13/07/2022 11:25

'And that's OK too apparently, on MN at least, as becoming a mother seems to bestow queen bee status, when everyone is running around trying to keep her happy and being glad of the crumbs thrown to them.'

SO TRUE. Lots of talk about 'support' etc but it only goes one way apparently. Non mothers have to content ourselves with all the 'free time' we have and just sit tight until the day we might get picked up again, maybe

antelopevalley · 13/07/2022 11:26

@stayathomer were you the one who said you cancelled if your child fell over?

Bubblebubblebah · 13/07/2022 11:28

Lottapianos · 13/07/2022 11:25

'And that's OK too apparently, on MN at least, as becoming a mother seems to bestow queen bee status, when everyone is running around trying to keep her happy and being glad of the crumbs thrown to them.'

SO TRUE. Lots of talk about 'support' etc but it only goes one way apparently. Non mothers have to content ourselves with all the 'free time' we have and just sit tight until the day we might get picked up again, maybe

All the free time and absolutely totally no stresses, eh..

Lottapianos · 13/07/2022 11:30

'Perhaps one day if you chose to have a family you will understand'

Jesus. The irony of you calling the OP 'entitled'! You really do represent the absolute worst of the smug mummy brigade. You clearly see non mothers as beneath you. This thread has been FULL of examples of this kind of thinking but your comments are among the nastiest

stayathomer · 13/07/2022 11:30

antelopevalley
@stayathomer were you the one who said you cancelled if your child fell over? yup but to be fair he fell on his face and split his lip and his chin went purple and swelled up, decent amount of blood. Literally as I was walking out, I would have laughed if obviously, you know, he was screaming and his brother was looking like he was going to pass out!

stayathomer · 13/07/2022 11:30

That was except not if!

599075w · 13/07/2022 11:30

I also wonder whether it's an age thing as well as parenthood. We are in our 40s and all of a sudden, it's not just primary aged kids but also two sets of grandparents who need us. In our 30s - our parents would have helped us or perhaps taken us on holiday, in our 40s (and am assuming early 50s) as they themselves are now hitting mid-late 70s, they increasingly need us. I really do feel like the sandwich generation in a way that I didn't in my 20s/30s and probably wont in my mid-50s when both my kids and parents should no longer need me. But right now....everyone needs me.

HuffleWoof · 13/07/2022 11:30

@elenacampana you sound like my kind of parent!

antelopevalley · 13/07/2022 11:30

Katypp · 13/07/2022 11:06

Somewhere in the last 20-30 years (?), having children moved from becoming something most people just did and got on with to something altogether different.
As parenting has evolved along with social media, it has become competitive, with women outdoing each other on who's the best mother.
I also think long maternity leaves add to the mix, with modern parenting practises positively discouraging good sleep patterns and routine. You just have to look at the sleep board to see that - anyone daring to suggest any type of routine is torn to pieces and it's baby-led all the way on there.
I only had six weeks off with my first and back then, getting your baby to sleep through was the main goal. I am sure there were some poor sleepers then as well as now, but we have had people on this thread stating quite nonchalantly that their baby didn't sleep for two years. That's ridiculous.
Having a non-sleeping baby seems to be a badge of honour now, in the way that having a sleeping one used to be. It seems to me that women are, actively encouraged to martyr themselves completely to their children - from birth, it's all about following 'cues', baby-led this, no routine - it would drive me mad. And then there's the women who don't want to share their baby with anyone, even the father. And that's OK too apparently, on MN at least, as becoming a mother seems to bestow queen bee status, when everyone is running around trying to keep her happy and being glad of the crumbs thrown to them.
In all honesty, although I am always told I am wrong, it all sounds very lonely to me and I am not sure it's good progress.
I am always told how much better it is for the child not be be 'ignored' (because there's no middle ground between 100% attention 24/7 and being ignored, apparently) but I am convinced the mothers get a, much worse deal than they used to.
A few have said on here that parents going out used to be the norm. It definitely did. My parents and my friends' parents, all went out, individually and together, and children were left with the other parent or grandparents.
In a nutshell, I suppose what I am trying to say is that babies and children used to fit into the family, rather than the family fitting in with them

I agree with this. There has been a major change in how bringing up children is supposed to be all-encompassing for mothers until their children are adults - and for some beyond that.

CounsellorTroi · 13/07/2022 11:31

As parenting has evolved along with social media, it has become competitive, with women outdoing each other on who's the best mother.

Yup. Remember that awful motherhood challenge on FB when mothers were nominating who of their friends were the best mums and if you were nominated you had to do it yourself.

Mardyface · 13/07/2022 11:31

elenacampana · 13/07/2022 11:21

@Katypp

💯%, you’re speaking my language. I have an eight month old, she fits in with us, we ignore everything ‘baby led’ and have a very happy baby. She eats everything we give her, she sleeps from 6:30/7pm to 7am, naps in her cot upstairs for a couple of hours at a time and because we have a routine, either of us can look after her allowing the other one to go out at any time of day, evening or weekend. When GPs have her, they also do our routine and she’s very happy with them too. We keep it simple and we have a good life with her, a relationship of our own and see our friends often with and without her. It’s just not that hard. I would say that we’re the odd ones out amongst our friends - it’s all co sleeping, baby led, can’t leave child for 30 seconds to go for a wee. I complain about my life so much less than they do.

Show quote history

I hope you were firmly touching wood when you typed all this. 😁😁

I think the OP has gone but imo there's no value in thinking it's because your friends don't care enough to adapt for you. Much nicer for you to think they can't (and as I posted earlier, that was the case for me. I struggled.). Yes you should absolutely move on if it helps you but taking it personally doesn't help you at all. It's not your fault. It probably isn't theirs either - or not all of them anyway. You're allowed to feel sad about it but resentment is a really damaging emotion for everyone.

antelopevalley · 13/07/2022 11:33

@599075w that can be hard. But it can also be hard for women without children to have older relatives needing help as it is not unusual in families for that burden to fall mainly on them.

antelopevalley · 13/07/2022 11:35

The happiest mothers I know are those who do not buy into this idea that they have to be caring for their children 24 hours a day.

Katypp · 13/07/2022 11:36

Whew! I am glad some people think like me because I sometimes feel like I am the only one on here!
As I said upthread, I only came to MN about 10 years ago (when mine were 19,8 and 5) and I honestly couldn't believe the way practises had changed and the rings mums were running round to try and keep their baby happy. Never being allowed to cry - what's all that about? Another thing that I struggle with is thus breastfeeding 24/7 thing that's often bandied about. I breastfed my three and they weren't attached to me 24/7. So e if my friends might have breastfed or they might not - it just wasn't the drama it is now. But of course, that links back to my point about short maternity leaves. If you only had six weeks off, you had to develop a routine sharpish, and I honestly think everyone, including the baby, was better for it.

VincaBlue · 13/07/2022 11:37

Over the years I've seen threads with mothers of small kids being judged for: Working full time
Only working part time
Being a SAHM
We've now even got a thread with people being scornful of how mothers choose to spend their own free time at the weekend after working all week.
Maybe leave mothers to decide what's best for their own family and if you don't like it, yes ditch your many friendships with parents. I'm sure they will cope just fine

VincaBlue · 13/07/2022 11:38

Over the years I've seen threads with mothers of small kids being judged for: Working full time
Only working part time
Being a SAHM
We've now even got a thread with people being scornful of how mothers choose to spend their own free time at the weekend after working all week.
Maybe leave mothers to decide what's best for their own family and if you don't like it, yes ditch your many friendships with parents. I'm sure they will cope just fine

VincaBlue · 13/07/2022 11:40

Over the years I've seen threads with mothers of small kids being judged for:

Working full time

Only working part time

Being a SAHM

We've now even got a thread with people being scornful of how mothers choose to spend their own free time at the weekend after working all week.

Maybe leave mothers to decide what's best for themselves and if you don't like it, yes ditch your many friendships with parents. I'm sure they will cope just fine

Hrpuffnstuff1 · 13/07/2022 11:40

antelopevalley · 13/07/2022 11:11

An emergency everyone understands. But a conflict of scheduling just makes it sound like you ditched her if a better offer came along.

Show quote history

No, it doesn't, the children come first. If something unexpected crops up with the kids I step in. It doesn't matter what it is.
Interestingly enough she's the one who struggles with meeting up-funny ole thing those pesky kids.

VincaBlue · 13/07/2022 11:40

Over the years I've seen threads with mothers of small kids being judged for:

Working full time

Only working part time

Being a SAHM

We've now even got a thread with people being scornful of how mothers choose to spend their own free time at the weekend after working all week.

Maybe leave mothers to decide what's best for themselves and if you don't like it, yes ditch your many friendships with parents. I'm sure they will cope just fine