To insist DC get christened even though it will cause huge fight in my marriage?

[probabyam]

Before we got married/had kids we didn't really talk about religion much. Neither of us go to church, however both have been christened. I'm Irish so went to a Catholic school and although we didn't really go to church as a family it was part of my life. DH was christened (Protestant) but actively anti any religion/thinks it's all mental.

When we got engaged I liked the idea of a church wedding but he was very against it so as it wasn't as if I attended church I didn't really feel I could insist and we had a lovely wedding we both loved, no regrets/issues.

Have had two DC, now ages 2 and 4. I would have liked to get them christened as babies (having godparents for them is something I would have liked) but DH against and again I wasn't bothered enough to push.

Now I feel like I wish we had got them christened. Most of my friends children have been christened (though none seem to attend church regularly). Part of me just likes the idea of godparents but another bit of me has a worry like a what if kind of thing, we're both christened why aren't they!
DH still massively against but yet again it seems to be a thing where the person who doesn't want it gets their way (another example is wanting more kids).

Anyway not sure that makes sense but are your kids christened and if so, do you go to church/mass?

My question would be, why does this issue keep raising itself in your mind. Do you have some inner feeling that you actually would like to raise your kids Christian? Do you, yourself, wish for some aspect of being Christian?

I don't see anything in the OP that suggests this.

My DM had me christened. My DF just didn't attend. I don't think he necessarily gets his way on this.

It's a pointless waste of money. Just another reason to feel obliged to buy gifts for you.

Let them decide their own religion of any when they grow up,

Surely your friends saw fit to congratulate you when they were born? Why would you need to do it again?

No, your child should be the one to decide, when they are old enough.

I'd be furious if my partner suddenly insisted our children were christened when it's never been discussed before.
I don't believe in it and wouldn't want it for my children.
But then this is something I'd discuss before having children.

If you are church goers , of course a christening is a lovely event welcoming your child into the church and your community.If you are not it is rather distasteful imo .were you going to pick out practising Christians as god parents? What was your vision of the occasion?

For your Instagram?! Unless you are strongly religious and want to induct them into the religion (which you’ve denied) then just why? Having gone through the Catholic system, I think it’s awful to force a religion on a child, plus you seem to want a baptism for no good reason. I’m godparent to multiple dc that I no longer see, we moved and just fell out of contact.

Wow, I really didn't think this would have got as many answers so have just caught up on reading the whole thread!

I'll try and reply to the questions raised.

I think overall it's what @ApplesandBunions and @icantgetno and @flurryofcurry @Choopi and @Ponderingwindow have touched on. I feel like it's more a tradition and a part of my culture and I think the older I've got the more significant that has felt. If we'd lived in Ireland I would have got them christened but seeing as we live in the U.K. and I have lived her since uni it wasn't in the forefront of my mind in my 20's. It feels more like a connection to home and culture although I do think that's changing at home too as many of my Irish friends from school have chosen not to baptise their babies which wouldn't have happened a few generations ago.

It's nothing to do with schooling, they are already signed up for the school they'll attend.

I think the godparent bit was musing and I didn't think it out properly, I suppose it's a big deal to some at home as part of the ceremony and that's what I meant. It would probably be an Aunty and uncle (as in my Aunty/uncle) or friend from school.

I think as others have said I need to think of it more and it most likely won't happen.

I do feel that faith or at least the values and the community that go with it are something I miss but maybe something I need to let go of.

Thanks for all the replies

@aloris thank you for this, it's in some ways spot on for how I've been feeling for a while and I will be exploring it further I think.
I appreciate the time you took to put that into words.

I think overall it's what @ApplesandBunions and @icantgetno and @flurryofcurry @Choopi and @Ponderingwindow have touched on. I feel like it's more a tradition and a part of my culture and I think the older I've got the more significant that has felt. If we'd lived in Ireland I would have got them christened but seeing as we live in the U.K. and I have lived her since uni it wasn't in the forefront of my mind in my 20's. It feels more like a connection to home and culture although I do think that's changing at home too as many of my Irish friends from school have chosen not to baptise their babies which wouldn't have happened a few generations ago.

I had a feeling that might be it. Perhaps it's worth looking at other ways you can offer the children access to that part of their cultural heritage. By any chance is DH not Irish?

Not sure what you want for godparents. It doesn't create a great relationship or bond or have any sort of legal obligation and I doubt more than 4 godparents in the history of time have taken responsibility for the religious welfare of a godchild in the absence of their parents. Most people I know seem struggle to remember what relative or friend is their godparent.

Your partner has been consistently clear that this is something he actively does not want for his children so going behind his back for some amorphous desire for something something godparents doesn't really seem worth the ruction or loss of trust.

@ApplesandBunions yep, not Irish! And I suppose now raising my kids here they are more English than anything and I would love just that touch of home, though we do go back to see family as much as we can.

Thought as much! The difficulty I suppose is that one of the best ways to get access to other families of Irish heritage for your children to be around is still Catholicism, the schools if nothing else. And in your 30s with young DC, you're at a very common age for Irish people living in England to go back home, in my experience.

I think it would be worth talking to DH about this. Not necessarily framing it in terms of a desire for Catholic religious practice, because actually I'm not sure that's the best way to describe what you're experiencing here, but the way you feel about wanting them to better know their roots.

By not getting them Christened, you’re not making any statement or promise about how you intend to raise the children. But by getting them Christened, you’re asking DH to make a promise that he does not believe in and does not intend to keep. So, that is why he ‘wins’. You can have your beliefs, but you can’t enforce them on others.

OP, how do you know that they will choose Christianity? There are all sorts of religions available, is it not a bit off to jump in like this before they can weigh up the options themselves?

@spanishmumireland that priority rule for baptised children getting into schools was abolished in 2019 as far as I'm aware. I agree it was one reason for people in Ireland getting their kids baptised. Be interesting to see if baptismal rates have declined since the rule was changed.

Not true about the schools in Ireland as my son went to a school that was a religious school and no issue and religion was not shoved down his neck like it was when I was in school. He still went to mass if there was a school mass so wasn't or didn't feel left out. The only people who gave me grief about my son not making communion or confirmation was stuck up mum's/hypocrites who only went to mass before those events to look good and because they had to. Nowadays no one gives a damn as isn't nuns in schools now or priests really and so many young teachers. They can always choose to get christened themselves when they are older if you do not do it. When the mums were asking me why my son was not making his communion I told them straight out because I am not going to be a hypocrite just going to mass before communion and then not going. People do not care about religion anymore and soon will not be a part of any curriculum. In my son's secondary they did all religions which was more like history and very interesting so no one excluded. Hope you make the right decision for you and your family and maybe go and talk to a priest about it. I do know in the U.K. you will get into a Catholic school only if child is christened but when I lived in U.K.I did not send my son to a Catholic School, could think of nothing worse.

I'm a fairy god mother. I couldnt be godmother because I havent been christened. Her parents werent bothered by my lack of religion because they go to church and have got it covered. They just wanted someone who would love her.

Have you named a guardian for them? Might that assuade some of your feelings?

Or a non religious naming ceremony?

You can of course do this, but why would you if your DH disagrees?

It’s a pile of crap anyway, so I suppose it doesn’t matter much, but why not just let them decide what religion, if any, they want when they’re older.

If you were a militant church goer, I would get it more, but you’re not.

Why do you even care?

I completely agree with this.

OP would there be any problem in having a non-religious naming ceremony with the would-have--been-godparents having some sort of special role? Family party, nod to special people in the family, and if anyone asks from your side, I guess, say you and DH had agreed that the DC should make their own religious choices when they were older (or some such)?

My DM was anxious about my DC not being christened, but it was more her Catholic guilt and superstition than anything else.

I had religion inflicted on me by my DM who herself suffered at the hands of vicious nuns when growing up, and I hated it, so there was no way I was inflicting that on my DC. Plus why indoctrinate a female child in a patriarchal medieval religion that doesn’t value women?

I’ve not banned religion but I believe that it is something that should be decided in adulthood, or in late childhood but only if the child understands and has all the facts. I live in a Catholic country and there is a huge thing around catechism classes and communion here and after school at primary everyone disappears one day a week for2 years. I asked my DC if they wanted to participate so they weren’t left out but it was a resounding no.

If they want to get married in a church later on the local churches do a baptism, communion and confirmation package in a week, for a fee of course. I guess that indulgences never quite went away!

Im Irish and we call this 'a la carte catholicism'

It was supposed to be abolished a few years ago but it still stands. What it really shocks me is that nobody in Ireland says anything at all.
My children go to the local national school (public) and children don't have a choice if they decide they aren't making their communion, unless they literally leave the school during mass and attend religion class.
In Spain you have the choice of "Values" class, (in my day was called "Ethics"). Here basically kids not attending mass have to be collected by their parents during mass hours (which is in the middle of the school day, any random day in the week). To start with this happens as part of the curriculum in the public school.
In my kids class there are a majority of catholics, or kids with catholic parents, few muslims, and budists. They all sit in the class during religion. They are not allowed to do anything else like going to the library. So same crap still stands. And in a very Irish was nobody says a thing. I raised this a few times in the mums school group. Radio silence.

No where in the Bible does it say an infant won’t get into Heaven if they are not baptised. In fact, you won’t find any infants getting baptised at all. You can teach your children the gospel but no one is born a Christian, at some point you have make your own choice to follow Jesus.