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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to not tell anyone about my ‘legal wedding’?

246 replies

ShotgunSummerWedding · 11/04/2022 09:42

I should be so happy, but I’m so upset by my family’s reaction. I know MN is usually well in favour of the married couple to be doing whatever they wish, but just really want to vent and hear some similar stories. I want to preface this by saying I am my parents only child.

Me and my fiancé are due to welcome our baby girl in June after miscarriages and general misery. This pregnancy is going well and I am feeling a bit more hopeful each day that we will meet her. We really wanted to be married and have a lovely small family wedding before DC, but the first pregnancy was unplanned and stuck us on the TTC treadmill as we tried to regain what we had lost. We thankfully have, and now marriage is back on the cards. Before it stopped being a priority as the only thing I cared about was being pregnant again.

Now I am and we definitely want to get married before the baby is born. First and foremost, we want to be a legal family and cement that before she is here. Practically, we are also worried about the medical aspects of not being each other’s next of kin (particularly if anything goes wrong at birth). My partner is also a foreign national and if we are not married at birth it is notoriously difficult for her to get his citizenship without a lot of paperwork and expense. Financially too, he is worried about me being a SAHM and not having the legal protections of marriage, particularly if he died before we planned a wedding.

So we booked a registry office for next month and have given notice to marry. This would be our ‘legal’ wedding in jeans and trainers, just tick off all of the above. Our witnesses will be two friends. No one else.

I don’t want family there because I am still not very well and I’m terrified that something will happen to my baby. If my family are there then that ceremony becomes my wedding day and it will be forever tainted. Also, my fiancé’s family are not able to travel at the moment and I do not want my MIL and FIL to feel excluded. This ceremony is our legal protection together. Nothing more.

We do want a wedding though. Next year we are then going to take our family and friends on a destination wedding blessing next year and have bridesmaids, a cake, speeches and a nice party. When I am hopefully happier and in a better mental place after my daughter arriving safely.

I told my mother my plans (not set dates, just intentions) and she was furious and unkind. She is usually a lovely, non-toxic person. In her eyes, the vows are the most important thing and she is will be heartbroken if she doesn’t see them. She told me that if I am just going to see my marriage as a piece of paper, then I may as well bin my engagement ring and get a plastic one Confused

She eventually calmed down and sent me a text saying that she was sad, but I needed to do what was right for my family. I though this was her blessing and tried to talk to her a little more ‘would you like to know when we book somewhere?’ ‘Would you like pictures?’ but she quickly got angry and asked to be there. I explained all of the above, and she still didn’t get it and pulled faces. I have tried to get her excited about our ceremony next year, asking about bridesmaid’s dresses and planning dress shopping, but she rolled her eyes and said if my destination wedding guest list was so small then there was no point.

I’m at a loss of what to do. She keeps asking me about it but everything I say upsets her. I’m currently in the mindset that I want to just say “we’re not doing that because of how you have acted” but just go and do it anyway. And to tell no one. This is actually what my dad has advised…

But it just feels so untruthful Sad I’m so excited to be married and this just feels like something else (like my pregnancy) that has been ruined.

OP posts:
Keha · 11/04/2022 20:10

Haven't read full thread, but I know quite a few people who have done the "paper work" on one day and had the "event" another day. Destination weddings, unable to have legal ceremony in a field etc. I don't think of it as that odd, and I've never felt like the "party" was a sham. Theyve always had a ceremony of some sorts at the "party" and used that as chance to declare their love in front of everyone etc. So I don't think what you are on suggesting is that odd, and I think your mum is putting you in a bit of a difficult position. You don't need to get dressed up, take photos etc though for legal bit.

scottishnames · 11/04/2022 20:13

itsback again next of kin has no universally agreed legal meaning in the UK of kin legal uk. Nor do advance directives have unvariably binding force unless the person involved lacks capacity www.thespeedwellpractice.nhs.uk/polices/advance-directives/.
POA yes, but it's taking a very, very long time to get them registered at the moment.

billy1966 · 11/04/2022 20:35

@Aberration

Op I would stop reading this thread. Sometimes people just like to put the boot in.

Do whatever is best for your mental health.

Absolute this.

After your losses, you won't have any peace until your baby arrives safely.

I mean this very kindly, but I think your mum is very self absorbed to not understand and support whatever gets you through this time.

I really hope you do whatever you need to do, to get through this.

Flowers
autienotnaughty · 11/04/2022 20:41

Some ridiculous posts on here! Of course you are right to have the wedding you want. The destination wedding will be as lovely regardless of if the legal stuff was done earlier. I completely get why you want to be married sooner and why you don't want to jinx it.

I would stop talking to your mum about it and just book it and do it. If she try's to guilt you just say it's not up for discussion. When you plan the wedding abroad include her if she resists again don't involve her in plans.

Blossomtoes · 11/04/2022 20:41

legally, you are wrong. Two witnesses are all that's required

And why do you think witnesses are required? Legally I’m right.

You say you want to witness the vows. Why? What is it to you? Fine if the couple wish to display them, but does it not seem a bit intrusive otherwise?

I want to witness the public vows, not watch them consummate the marriage!

PoshWatchShitShoes · 11/04/2022 20:54

I was gutted when one of my best friends did this. I'd spoken to her that very morning and then she went and had a secret wedding that afternoon. It actually ruined our friendship. Not the wedding, but the secret. I don't know why she didn't tell anyone in advance and then told everyone after. I didn't travel to her overseas fake wedding and our friendship didn't recover.

I'd be devastated if one of my DC did this.

I understand your reasons, but just make sure it never comes that you're actually already married when you want to have your big celebration.

Giraffesandbottoms · 11/04/2022 21:06

@PoshWatchShitShoes

A friend of ours did this 4 months ago. Went to New York “to propose”.
Didn’t mention it again. 3
Months later tells us they actually got married, but will celebrate in September as a proper wedding. In Paris. Well
Fuck that shit. Didn’t allow anyone to enjoy their happiness (including his mother who was excluded and will never get over it) and lied about it for several months, but expect people to pay to travel for the celebration? No thanks.

SleepingStandingUp · 11/04/2022 21:12

@Letterasaurus

Wouldn't it be best to postpone everything until your baby is safely here?

This all sounds bonkers and a load of unnecessary stress.

Op wants them to be married in case anything happens to her or the baby
HangingRock25 · 11/04/2022 21:17

@scottishnames

blossomtoes really seriously, just why? The vows are actually nothing to do with you; they are between the couple being wed. And it's not up to you to decide how your friends and/or family decide to make those vows.

It IS up to you when those friends/family invite you to share their happiness by celebrating the fact that they are married (where when and how they did this is NONE of your business). If you can't join with them when invited to share their joy, then just what sort of a friend/family member are you?

@scottishnames The vows are actually nothing to do with you; they are between the couple being wed.

But the whole point of a wedding invitation is that you are invited to witness the wedding of so and so. That's the whole point, and wedding invitations are usually written that way.

Blossomtoes · 11/04/2022 21:18

But apparently it’s “intrusive” @HangingRock25. 🤷‍♀️

scottishnames · 11/04/2022 21:21

Blossomtoes No really, not always.

Two witnesses are required to be just that - to declare, if required, that they witnessed the marriage vows and to confirm each other's testimony. Marriages can and do take place in private homes, in hospitals, in prisons etc etc . I believe that synagogues are technically private places, also. www.citizensadvice.org.uk/family/living-together-marriage-and-civil-partnership/getting-married Some marriages - at least in Scotland - take place in remote locations deliberately away from the public in the open air (this IS legal). All that matters is a licensed celebrant/registrar and two witnesses. The Law Commission in England has been consulting on allowing marriages to take place in 'private gardens' and 'at home'. www.lawcom.gov.uk/project/weddings/
See also this, page 2: [[https://s3-eu-west-2.amazonaws.com/lawcom-prod-storage-11jsxou24uy7q/uploads/2020/09/Weddings_at_a_glance-v4.pdf]]

Of course some marriages take place in public places, such as churches or venues licensed for marriage. That is well known, and not what I was talking about. But even then, only two witnesses are actually required. A marriage does not always have to be 'public'. But if a couple want that, then fine, of course.

As to witnessing 'public vows', I think that there is a real and significant difference between 'before two invited witnesses' and 'the public who demand a right to be there'. I think that there is also a significant difference between 'members of a church congregation who share religious beliefs and practice and know the couple very well/worship together' and people who just want to spectate.

HardbackWriter · 11/04/2022 21:22

But the whole point of a wedding invitation is that you are invited to witness the wedding of so and so. That's the whole point, and wedding invitations are usually written that way.

I have never received a wedding invitation that said I was invited to witness. They have always invited me to 'celebrate the marriage of' or similar.

Blossomtoes · 11/04/2022 21:26

Traditional wedding invitations invite you to the marriage, ie the ceremony.

RainySmarties · 11/04/2022 21:36

Aw op. Huge hugs. I think I get it. You want the legal and practical protection of a marriage but you don't want your wedding to be associated with this current time.in case you lose the pregnancy. So for you the actual wedding would be the second one but if your mum attended the registry wedding it would make the registry one more real and you'd risk having bad memories associated with your marriage in case of a miscarriage. Is that it? Sorry I'm not explaining it very well but I can relate and I'm sorry that some people here are giving you a tough time.

Have you explained this to your mum? That for you the real wedding, (the one that is meaningful to you) is the one she would be attending? Not this first legal one?

I had two miscarriages before ds and it really puts you on edge. I expected to miscarry every day and sometimes I still can't believe that he's here now. We've actually made it.

Op, do what feels right to you. If you want to keep the peace do you even need to tell your parents or anyone else that you are getting legally married now? Could you let them think that the later wedding is the actual one?

Best of luck with the pregnancy. I hope it all goes smoothly and that you'll have a wonderful wedding wherever and whenever (and how many ever) you choose to have. Flowers

desiringonlychild2022 · 11/04/2022 21:40

www.brides.com/what-is-a-sequel-wedding-5086475

I think it was a niche thing in the past for international couples like me and DH who married straight out of university and had to sort out visa issues/masters degree/buying our first home so a wedding was the last thing on our minds. But wanted to get married.

But covid has meant that for a lot of people, they may not be able to have their whole family at their weddings. for example if your mum lived in shanghai, i don't think you should postpone your wedding ceremony until they come out of lockdown and can travel freely. You might be waiting for years. And if your friend is offended at that like some PP, they should brush up on their general knowledge and step out of little England :)

LegMeChicken · 11/04/2022 22:04

@desiringonlychild2022

www.brides.com/what-is-a-sequel-wedding-5086475

I think it was a niche thing in the past for international couples like me and DH who married straight out of university and had to sort out visa issues/masters degree/buying our first home so a wedding was the last thing on our minds. But wanted to get married.

But covid has meant that for a lot of people, they may not be able to have their whole family at their weddings. for example if your mum lived in shanghai, i don't think you should postpone your wedding ceremony until they come out of lockdown and can travel freely. You might be waiting for years. And if your friend is offended at that like some PP, they should brush up on their general knowledge and step out of little England :)

This will probably be what DP and I do (I'm foreign Grin). But also common in my circle as many are of different religions, where venues aren't licensed for marriage. and to them the ceremony is the important bit anyway, nobody cares about the paper.
Gelasia · 11/04/2022 22:10

"The vows are the wedding" - sure. The vows in the official ceremony at the legal part of our wedding created a legally binding marriage. But the vows we made to each other at our own ceremony with family and friends later on were our actual wedding so far as we are concerned. They were vows too. It doesn't have to be the same thing and that doesn't make it "just a celebration."

Lilboots · 11/04/2022 22:11

One of my friends "confessed" to me after her destination wedding that, in fact, she and her husband had been married already for seven years. They'd had a quickie registry wedding to sort out her visa status and then waited until they could fit the actual wedding into their crazy busy lives and her dad had recovered from a health scare.

I didn't feel misled at all - we'd been invited to celebrate their marriage and that was exactly what we did, we just hadn't realised the marriage was a bit older than we'd thought! I also think it's kind of romantic that they'd had this lovely, intimate secret for so long.

I've also had several friends have the legal ceremony a few days before the big celebration for practical reasons. They still had vows on the day and the wedding didn't feel any different or less special.

Do what works for you x

Itsbackagain · 11/04/2022 22:33

@scottishnames

itsback again next of kin has no universally agreed legal meaning in the UK of kin legal uk. Nor do advance directives have unvariably binding force unless the person involved lacks capacity www.thespeedwellpractice.nhs.uk/polices/advance-directives/. POA yes, but it's taking a very, very long time to get them registered at the moment.
I know, it was OP who was looking for NOK status specifically in relation to possible medical issues. The AD is evidence of a person’s wishes so should be taken into account moreso than the 'NOK'. Having been through the ringer not having any of these in place I now have them sorted for all family.
GnomeDePlume · 12/04/2022 04:28

In OP's position I can well understand why she and her DP want to be married before the baby arrives.

No niggling worries about DP not being listened to if OP isn't able to advocate for herself in the moment.

It doesn't matter the legalities of whether NOK has status, it's another worry which right now OP could do without.

Once the baby is here OP will be able to relax and plan the rest of her wedding. Having lived elsewhere I see nothing strange in the different parts of a wedding: the legal vows, the romantic or religious vows, the celebration; being separated by time and location.

Different people set store by the different elements but it is very narrow minded to insist they all have to take place on the same day and all be attended by everyone.

It is a privilege to be invited to be invited take any part in a couple's wedding. I was not gutted/insulted/devastated/grief stricken to not be invited to attend my DD's register office wedding. I understood and respected the reasons why. I was and am happy for them to have had the wedding they wanted.

tintodeverano2 · 12/04/2022 05:15

With hindsight you probably should have just done it and told no-one. I'd ask strangers to be witnesses to soften the blow a little bit rather than friends though.

Many 'destination weddings' aren't even legal in the UK, and are just blessings or religious ceremonies anyway! Most that get married abroad have to do the legal bit here as well!

From a mums pov though, I would be upset if I wasn't there, as I'd still like to see my daughter on her day -even if it was just a jeans and T-shirt wedding. But, having said that, you do have valid reasons, and you need to do what you and your partner feel comfortable with.

tintodeverano2 · 12/04/2022 05:18

Btw... if I ever did get married again it would be a registry office affair, with no one there as my mum isn't around anymore and if my mum wasn't there I wouldn't want any family. I probably wouldn't tell anyone that we had done it anyway as it would just be for us, no one else.

desiringonlychild2022 · 12/04/2022 09:52

Just thinking about it. My SIL had her legal marriage in the USA with her DH's family. We weren't even invited. It was very informal and the ring was a sweetie ring!

But we all travelled to Israel for her big wedding/religious ceremony, including lots of family friends from America! No one seemed bothered or I guess they wouldn't have spent thousands travelling to Israel at peak season.

desiringonlychild2022 · 12/04/2022 09:57

I think it was a mixture of immigration related reasons (easier to get a green card if they choose to move to USA in future if you are married in America?) and because the groom is fundamentally opposed to a marriage under orthodox auspices in Israel. In Israel, legal marriage between Jewish people is required to be conducted by orthodox rabbis and therefore excludes a lot of people like gay people and reform converts. So people who are opposed to this tend to get married abroad.

The groom told me this when I asked but I don't think most people who attended the wedding knew, I mean it's not something you want to broadcast esp to older people as it could potentially be contentious.

RoundTheGardens · 12/04/2022 10:20

OP, it sounds as though what you want are the legal protections of marriage before your DD is born, but are happy for the actual marriage to happen with family afterwards?

In which case, all of the legal protections of marriage (inheritance, PoA if anything happens to you, etc) can be gained through alternative ways- you can sign various declarations, deeds of trust, wills etc which would give the same protections.

Usually people wouldn't bother with this because it's a much more expensive way of getting the same result as marriage, which is much cheaper (the legal part!) But as in your particular circumstances it could be a perfect resolution, and money is no object... have you considered consulting a Shit Hot Lawyer before the birth to contract yourselves into all of the legal agreements of marriage, and then making your abroad wedding a legal one that replaces those temporary agreements?

Just an idea. Best of luck with the birth Daffodil

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