… to wonder why people continue having more children if they cannot cope with the ones that they already have?

[NetflixMom21]

… or am I just being extremely judgemental?

A couple of recent interactions and conversations with people that I know has got me thinking about this. In one situation; the person in question already has a couple of children plus a couple of stepchildren which they have 50% of the time, they are always complaining of having no money, they have openly said that they max out their credit cards to survive and pay their bills every month and are in a lot of debt because of it… now they have just announced that they are having another child.

In the second situation; the person in question has 5 children. The first child was born with a severe disability and they were told that it could possibly be genetic and that if they had anymore children, those children could have a disability too. The second child was also born with a disability, but not as severe as the first. The person then went onto having 3 more children, of which, another child has a similar disability to the first 2. So 3 out of 5 children are disabled. This person now admits that they are unable to cope and it massively impacts on the care that they are able to give their children.

In the third situation; someone that I know was born with cystic fibrosis (they are the first born child of the family). They nearly died as a young child and was only just about saved by a lung transplant which they were incredibly lucky to get. The parents have gone on to have more and more children, even though they know that they have the gene for cystic fibrosis and any child that they have may be born with it too and after watching how badly their first child has suffered. Well another child has been born with it, and suffers horrendously already (they are reception/year 1 age) and unless they receive a lung transplant, they might not even make it to a teenager.

My own situation; I have a progressive disability myself and also a child that has a disability. I know that I will never have anymore children (I am looking into surgical procedures to ensure this) because I know that firstly, I will not be able to cope with my own illness and that is not fair on the child especially as I know that there is a possibility of me having another child with a disability, and secondly; I do not know how much independence my child will go onto have as a teenager and adult, and if I had another child, it would impact on the level of care that I am able provide for my child and that isn’t fair on them.

AIBU to wonder why people in these situations continue having more and more children rather than focusing on the ones that they have, and then constantly complain of being unable to cope?!

Summed it up in your first sentence really!

YABU. Other peoples decision to have or not have children are quite literally nothing to do with you. HTH.

… or am I just being extremely judgemental?

Yes.

or am I just being extremely judgemental
This bit.

I’m not saying it is anything to do with me, but it drives me nuts hearing people constantly complain that they can’t cope with their situations… when they have created the situations for themselves in these circumstances!

You're being extremely judgmental.
You have no idea why people choose to have more children. Besides, some parents go through phases of coping and not coping. Just because they aren't coping now doesn't mean it will never get better.

You are right it not being any if your business. However, if they constantly complain about it they are making it your business and you are then free to complain about that. I too find it annoying when people complain about things they themselves caused as if it just happened to them.

@Fimofriend

You are right it not being any if your business. However, if they constantly complain about it they are making it your business and you are then free to complain about that. I too find it annoying when people complain about things they themselves caused as if it just happened to them.

I agree. Probably too strong to say I get judgey, but I do wonder about people who clearly can't cope, who have more children (and add pets to the mix, too). Why one earth put yourself through it and then spend 20 years or so going on about how hard life is (and how much "life admin" you have). Especially when they inevitably seem to be married to feckless lazy men who don't pull their weight, too.

There was a thread on here yesterday where the OP had two children already, clearly couldn't cope, and was pregnant with a third. Completely mad in my view.

or am I just being extremely judgemental?

You answered your own question.

They are the same people who buy a dog (s) and raise poorly behaved animals, usually due to gross ineptitude and arrogance.

Once taught a family where they would have almost one child a year, the family were living in a shed and a bus and each child had a health condition which required ongoing in/ out of school support and an elective surgery costing $20,000 per child, plus health condition was lifelong. Am left wing but that situation appalled me … 8 children later … could be even more now…. they lived in appalling conditions and did nothing to help themselves or the kids. The mother just loved babies, children not so much!

I agree op. Yeah, yeah, it's judgmental but let's be honest, we all judge all sorts of situations. I know a woman, she had one child, is a single mum. Had another. Doesn't seen to enjoy being a mum at all...is skint and dumps them on her mother every weekend. Got pregnant with a third child. She was openly gutted but went ahead and had the baby. Now pregnant with a fourth. It baffles me.

I agree OP, there’s no way I’d continue to have children if I was told they were very likely to be born with a disability.

Allow them to deal with the consequences of their choices without being a judgemental silent confidant for their complaints. They deserve better than that. Move on with your own life.

Because so many people (especially woman) WANT a child or 2 or 3 or more and that want overrides everything it seems.

If you are struggling to afford 1 child why have more? If your OH is useless and you are unhappy that he doesn't help with 1 child why have more?

As for people who have a child with a disability and then have more knowing they may well have it too that is just pure selfishness.

Let's be honest, having children is selfish. You don't have them for any reason other than you want to. Far too often so little regard for what those children(s) life will be like.

Have to say totally agree. Ditto more big dogs in unsuitable housing. Just very alien to my mindset. Guess it takes all sorts.

I would be shocked and not believe it if these "oh you are so judgey OP" didnt at least have your views as a fleeting thought.
Same with anything. Someone sitting there stuffing their faces with cream cakes and then complaining as to why they are fat. Someone smoking and coughing/hacking and then complaining why they have no money/are ill.....same thing. Because of life choices.

We all make life choices and we all have an opinion on what others do, even if we keep our views to ourselves. Those holier than thou that say they don't I never believe.

I expect you have just said what a lot of people think.

But to answer your question - I asked the same to my mum when I was little and wondering why people in poor countries who were starving still had children. "To give them hope and something to love"

Yeah I know 🙄people on FB having a third child which I do unapologetically judge due to the planet. The same people who were wailing that Covid would destroy them financially
Just feel relieved it’s not you up at 4am on a cold November morning with a baby!

Usually I assume they got pregnant by accident.

I suppose of those that don't, the impulse to have more children was just irresistible, some people seem to feel it very strongly.

I completely agree with you.

The examples you give are extreme and the decision making, on the part of the parents, ridiculous and unethical.

But I think even when illness isn't involved there are a lot of parents who would benefit from putting more consideration into whether or not to have additional children.

My mother isn't the best at coping (she can make cooking a meal of beans on toast a stressful event, and she's a more than capable cook), I suspect some form of ADHD. She did fine with my brother, but I think when I came along 2 years later i tipped the balance, and she couldn't cope. But because of the type of person she is (she can do no wrong and must appear to others as the best mother in the world) the blame for all her stress and difficulties got pushed onto me, as well as all her anxieties.

I'm in my 40s now and no contact, and whilst I do like being in existence I do wonder if my mother would have done so much better if she had stopped at 1 child.

However there is so much societal pressure, on women in particular, not to have a "lonely only", that it can be hard to stop at just 1 child regardless of circumstances.

I also wonder why some women have more children with men they already know to be shit fathers and partners.

As someone with Cystic Fibrosis, I totally agree with the OP. It is selfish to the extreme to have more babies if you know you have the gene for an illness like this. There are genetic tests available to help prevent you having another ill child. Why oh why would you put your child through all that pain? How can they look at their child suffocating (I'm not being dramatic - that is what it feels like) in front of them and know that they made the decision to create this situation?

Yanbu.

A school mum I know, has 5 children. Since the 3rd she complains everyday. Abusive husband. But she openly tells me and everyone she doesn't want to leave him (the husband is 15 years younger) to the point she won't tell her in-laws he abuses her because she's scared they will tell him to leave her.

Yet she had two more children thinking he would change.
Try's to get lifts off everyone and anyone.
Always asking for help off randomness.
Complaining she's always skint.

Like why did you continue?

In some cases however circumstances change but I think you're talking about the sort of cases I mentioned above.

I chose to stay at 2 because I know mentally/financially/physically it's best for me and my family

On first impulse I'd agree, yet people who make bad life choices will always exist. I've made plenty myself, just not so much in that area, and not as extreme as in your examples.

Most of my worse choices effected only myself and involved putting others before myself too much. But there are some that have led to similar, as a result I have two severely autistic boys 18 months apart and then experienced coercive control, poverty and homelessness caused by the situation with their dad, followed by more coercive control, poverty and homelessness from our new slum/rogue landlord. After a hell of a fight with the council and social services we got into emergency housing and finally a beautiful 3 bed in an idyllic locale. I will not be procreating again lol, if I cope better later, had more money I would foster.

The thing is that if people don't know the consequences of their actions they cannot make good choices. I felt something was off with my first child's development at four months but was dismissed. Looking back I was absolutely right but doctors, hv etc made us wait until the delay was undeniable. I had to fight so hard to make sure the initial referrals at 18 months went through as they kept getting lost and I was repeatedly directed to incorrect council departments for chasing them.

The other reason I was ignorant of consequences when younger , I am autistic so don't always infer things/take things literally, had a severely autistic father and high functioning bipolar mother who could only half raise the six children they shared, I came from a rural and impoverished area where many people have regressive ways of thinking, and I was raised effectively in a cult that discouraged open thinking and socialisation, the jehovahs witnesses. I didn't know my neighbourhood was one of the ten most deprived in the UK. Why would I start a family there? Why did my parents? So stupid now that I have read more about what children need.

I always wanted my children to have a close age gap and always planned on two so by the time my eldest's issues came into focus at 18 months I was about to give birth to his brother.
I don't complain about it a lot though its harder than it would've been.

But I don't think the complaining is the problem here. It's the way it affects the children and the cycle of poverty, depression, abuse, destitution, and the inability to achieve solvency, independence, and make a contribution to society, that I want to end.

I would argue that people with poor prospects and little agency over their lives don't have the same incentive (and possibly ability) to plan their lives in the same way that those that are financially stable do.

I think there should be more counselling given to people to make them consider the implications for their existing children of further pregnancies and children.