to think this shouldn't be normalised?

[ChristinaRussell]

I came across this Blind Date column in The Guardian from a couple of weeks ago: www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2022/mar/05/blind-date-sam-jenn

Apparently ordering 4 shots before you even sit down to dinner means you're great fun. AIBU to think it actually means you might have a bit of a problem? I get so fed up with heavy drinking being equated with having a good personality and a good time, and if you don't want to get hammered you must be really dull.

For context, I do drink alcohol, but I don't particularly like being drunk, and I LOATHE hangovers - I really don't think that (for me) they are worth the night before.

I'm trying very hard not to come across as po-faced, and honestly, each to their own, but I know that some people I've come across in my life have thought I'm incredibly boring because I prefer not to get rat-arsed. I think, generally speaking, that this is a prevalent attitude in our society and it shouldn't be.

I'm now donning my hard hat in preparation for being told how boring and judgemental I am

I would think someone who needs to drink that much was nervous and taking advantage of the free bar in that situation, that's all, but if it was someone I knew who always did this then I'd consider they had a problem.
I don't really enjoy drinking any more because I get terrible hangovers, but also because of the amount of times I've been taken advantage of by men when drunk, often with them trying to get me to drink beyond my limits, it makes me feel sick to think about it. I really hate this kind of pressure, to make women binge drink so that they're easier to take advantage of, and I think a lot of this idea of binge drinking being fun is rooted in this. I also don't like peer pressure to drink from colleagues and being seen as some sort of killjoy if you don't want to participate. I don't judge anyone if they drink every day, but I think those that do try to shame those that don't in order to normalise their own issues with alcohol.

I see drinking as a hobby which doesn't really have anything to do with socialising. I too worry that some people struggle to socialise without alcohol, and I don't think it's part of getting to know someone with a view to having a relationship with them.

Would you be so horrified if she'd had two large g&ts before dinner, which would be the same (or more) in terms of alcohol?

Were they even all for her?

Is there any evidence she does this every night or is she just letting her hair down?

People have always enjoyed a drink. There has been moral outrage over binge drinking for almost as long as there's been drinking (see the temperance movement which was a response in part to the Victorian love affair with cheap gin). In my experience young people today are far more moderate when it comes to drinking than their parents are - DD and her friends are all teetotal and they're by no means unusual in that.

Drinking in moderation (and occasionally having one or two extra) is one of life's pleasures for many. And there's nothing to say that the drinking described here is problematic.

I don’t really care if people who drink heavily think I’m boring. Because the feeling is mutual.

I love dinners, good conversation and a couple of bottles of wine. But I have no interest in getting smashed, hammered or shit faced. And I completely understand that other people do enjoy this.

It’s just incompatibility.

Calm down. The Guardian does many things of which I disapprove but normalising heavy drinking is not one of them.

I read that column every week and that one was the only one I can remember in recent months which highlighted the amount someone drank.

I wouldn't drink four shots of tequila at all let alone before dinner but I do drink and more than lots of other people do. I also realise that people on a freebie often push the boat out and the poor bastard trying to turn this into interesting copy grabbed at that quote like a drowning woman.

They are young and on an all expenses paid date. At that age I would have done similar (not shots as I don’t like them, but a couple of large G&Ts are the same amount of alcohol - most of us used to drink before we went out as it was cheaper). My friends and I used to drink a fair amount at that age, but some of us were teetotal and nobody batted an eyelid or made people feel bad for drinking or not. I’m glad I have those friends, but honestly wouldn’t have picked friends who did judge. Nowadays I would raise an eyebrow to a date that had 4 shots, as I’m in my 30s and it’s not the sort of thing I like to do anymore. I don’t pre-drink now as I can afford a glass of wine with dinner (I didn’t used to eat out at that age as it was too expensive). Often I don’t even drink. If people think you’re no fun if you haven’t had a drink, then it’s probably time to get better friends, not deride a young couple who fancy a few drinks when someone else is picking up the tab.

She is clearly a go big or go home sort of gal. I was going to suggest this is standard for youngsters on a night out, but I see she’s 30, so not that young.

I’ve only drunk a shot once in my life, so the idea of 4 is unimaginable to me. I love drinking and do far too much of it, but I haven’t been drunk since my 20s. Tbh, I don’t get shots. Is the idea to get really drunk really quickly?

I mean, who actually enjoys that? Who feels good after downing 4 shots?

It's the same (or less) alcohol than a couple of large g&ts, or a cocktail. Even if you had a couple of cocktails a week you'd be well within government guidelines for alcohol. Would you ask who feels good after a cocktail?

So often you watch characters drink a huge glass of whisky and be totally unaffected. So why drink it?

This suggests that your perception of alcohol is off. Drinking sensibly is not about the 'effects'. I don't drink a 1996 Lagavulin because it gets me pissed, I drink it because it's delicious and a huge pleasure.

@PurpleCarpets

I wouldn't say four shots is a huge amount before dinner on a big night out (and I don't drink). I think you're being a bit po-faced.

Seriously? It's a lot to have before a meal out. And I do drink.

@LadyCordeliaFitzgerald

I don’t really care if people who drink heavily think I’m boring. Because the feeling is mutual.

I love dinners, good conversation and a couple of bottles of wine. But I have no interest in getting smashed, hammered or shit faced. And I completely understand that other people do enjoy this.

It’s just incompatibility.

I’d argue that drinking a couple of bottles of wine certainly is heavy drinking and if you’re not getting smashed on that you must have a very high tolerance!

The best nights out are when you're a bit beyond tipsy but not close to staggering.

Absolutely, but it’s also the case that a lot of people aren’t very good at letting you manage for yourself how to balance that. I’ve lost count of the number of times I’ve had shots forced on me (although if it goes that far I don’t feel bad about tipping them away) but I won’t do them, because I know it just signals game over for me very quickly.

Maybe she's nervous about being on a date with someone she doesn't know, never seen before and the whole thing being in the paper afterwards?

"I mean, who actually enjoys that? Who feels good after downing 4 shots?

It's the same (or less) alcohol than a couple of large g&ts, or a cocktail"

But those drinks aren't downed. At least a G&T is usually drunk more slowly.

@Gwenhwyfar

"I mean, who actually enjoys that? Who feels good after downing 4 shots?

It's the same (or less) alcohol than a couple of large g&ts, or a cocktail"

But those drinks aren't downed. At least a G&T is usually drunk more slowly.

So it's the speed they're drunk at that's the issue? Why? It's exactly the same amount of alcohol and the effects are the same.

@Octomore would you think that two glasses of wine before dinner was a lot? Or two large gin and tonics, or a couple of pints of beer?

@Boood

The best nights out are when you're a bit beyond tipsy but not close to staggering.

Absolutely, but it’s also the case that a lot of people aren’t very good at letting you manage for yourself how to balance that. I’ve lost count of the number of times I’ve had shots forced on me (although if it goes that far I don’t feel bad about tipping them away) but I won’t do them, because I know it just signals game over for me very quickly.

I am very firm about shots. You buy them for me, you'll be drinking them yourself. I'm also not beyond tipping half a pint into your glass if you buy me a whole one when I asked for half or abandoning a drink altogether if you buy one I didn't want.

I still think drinkers are more fun on a night out and a enjoy a good drink myself, but they're not going to force drinks I don't want on me.

@TypicaIMe

I agree, it feels a bit snobby.

Has anyone noticed the Dragons' tendency to perk up if drink is in the pitch? And Mary Berry's love for alcohol seems to be a running joke on Bake Off

@TypicaIMe by that logic there’s no difference in poaching two eggs and having them on toast with a little butter than there is necking a glass with raw leaves, eggs and a slice of granary blended up. Food/Drink is cultural and psychological not simply nutritional

I agree with you. I just don't understand how anyone thinks they've had a good night out when they can't remember it, they've been sick everywhere, and they feel dreadful the next day, I do drink, but I worked out in my early 20s that the hangover was never worth it.

@5thnonblonde

Absolutely, and if someone prefers eating the latter, then who cares?

[quote Qwill]@TypicaIMe

I agree, it feels a bit snobby.[/quote]
It absolutely does. The same mentality that says it's ok to take the DC to child friendly craft beer bars and give them an artisan pork pie while the adults drink £7 pints, but it's practically abuse to take them to the local Wetherspoon and give them turkey dinosaurs while you drink Stella.

@Qwill I do if you’re having shots before dinner at quite a nice restaurant! The latter is just not half as nice!

[quote 5thnonblonde]@TypicaIMe by that logic there’s no difference in poaching two eggs and having them on toast with a little butter than there is necking a glass with raw leaves, eggs and a slice of granary blended up. Food/Drink is cultural and psychological not simply nutritional[/quote]
That's a ridiculous comparison.

The judgement here is based on how pissed four shots gets you. It doesn't get you any more pissed than four gins, two pints or a cocktail.

As a PP said, it's snobbishness.

1 guy said this as his opinion......it's one person's experience. You made it sound like this is the Guardian's consensus or did I miss something?